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  • #31
    Guys, I just don't trust a selection committee picking WSU with their best potential non-con win being a Tulsa. That won't do it.

    Going 16-2 in the Valley would be awesome. But how realistic is that? Even with a down Valley, that is still a gauntlet. And that is the problem. The margin of error is so thin. That's why the UConn game and the SDSU games are so meaningful.

    There are lots of teams in Valley-like conferences (or close to it) that go 16-2, 15-3, have no marquee wins and are left in the NIT. We may have an NCAA-type team, but we have limited chances to prove it. And right now, we're 0 for 1.
    Deuces Valley.
    ... No really, deuces.
    ________________
    "Enjoy the ride."

    - a smart man

    Comment


    • #32
      Aargh - In your example with us beating UConn but going 1-2, how is beating UConn a good win if all they did the rest of the tourney was what we did do. Shoot, just the fact we would have beaten them would have knocked them down several more pegs in the eye test of pundits. Granted, it might have paid dividends later in the season if UConn did go on to do well in the Big East. As it is now, their ticket is probably already punched.

      Comment


      • #33
        Originally posted by AG1219
        Originally posted by ShockerFever
        Originally posted by SHOXMVC
        Originally posted by Kung Wu
        Originally posted by ShockerFever
        Originally posted by Kung Wu
        Originally posted by ShockerFever
        Everybody knew about 8 months in advance that the UConn game was gonna make or break our potential NCAA at-large lives. The players, coach, and us fans all knew this.

        A couple of wins to finish the trip is nice but they certainly aren't wins to pad the resume with.

        We choked our chance. It's true. The only way now we see an at-large is if we roll through a big winning streak and sneak into the Top 25. We have to beat San Diego State and likely not lose more than 3 Valley games. That's the position we've put ourselves in now.

        It sucks but that's what happens when you blow your best opportunity, an opportunity that you had known months about.


        If, and that's a HUGE "if", UConn wins tonight then the loss is all but forgotten. It will be a "quality win" (whatever that means) by the selection committee. We need UConn to step up tonight.
        Yeah you're gonna have to explain that one to me. How is a loss a quality win?

        And besides, it still doesn't change the fact that Chaminade and Virginia don't help the resume.
        Meant loss but stupid iPhone too hard to edit crap.

        Right Chaminade win was worthless. Virginia win hardly noticable. But barely losing to UConn won't hurt as bad as we all thought if they beat Mich. St. and Kentucky. However the chances of that are super slim.
        No, we don't have to sneak in the top-25. Yes, we have to play well. I put it in another thread. We go 12-2 in noncon (meaning we take care of business at home & win either at SDSU (preferred), or at LSU (more likely). Finish 14-4, or 15-3 in the Valley. Get to the championship game in STL and lose, we still finish 28-7 or 29-6. That scenerio will put us, if not in the top-25, somewhere in the discussion. It will be good enough. If not, I like carp with my crow. It would have looked good to beat UConn, but it didn't happen. It wasn't like we were this big favorite. That loss won't kill us.
        That smells like Illinois State in 2008, especially if you take the not-win-at-SDSU option. SDSU has become a must-win.
        Fever, would UNI have been an at large last year had they lost to us in the final? I ask this because they lost to Depaul in opening round of their exempt tourney, then played two less than steller teams on consolation side. (similar to us except UCONN is much better than BE doormat Depaul)

        Their best noncon win could arguably be at big 12 doormat ISU outside of bracketbuster win (we don't know our opp yet)

        They won the MVC (which most considered weak, maybe not as weak as this year, but still weak) They lost to MVC doormat EU.

        Do you really feel that the @SDSU game is a must win?
        They had a real good win against ODU and another pretty good win against Siena. Not spectacular, but not bad. They dominated the Valley, winning it by 3 games, and went 24-4 in the regular season.

        Assuming we beat SDSU, if we dominate the Valley and win it by 3 games, and go 24-4 in the regular season, I like our chances.

        How confident are you that ends up happening?
        Deuces Valley.
        ... No really, deuces.
        ________________
        "Enjoy the ride."

        - a smart man

        Comment


        • #34
          Originally posted by ShockerFever
          Guys, I just don't trust a selection committee picking WSU with their best potential non-con win being a Tulsa. That won't do it.

          Going 16-2 in the Valley would be awesome. But how realistic is that? Even with a down Valley, that is still a gauntlet. And that is the problem. The margin of error is so thin. That's why the UConn game and the SDSU games are so meaningful.

          There are lots of teams in Valley-like conferences (or close to it) that go 16-2, 15-3, have no marquee wins and are left in the NIT. We may have an NCAA-type team, but we have limited chances to prove it. And right now, we're 0 for 1.
          Right now, that comment may be a stretch.

          Comment


          • #35
            But Fever, how many of those teams in Valley-like conferences (or close to it) are in the discussion before the season even starts to get top-25 consideration? I don't know the immediate answer to that question, although my feeling is...not many. A loss at SDSU, potentially a top-15 team, is not going to make or break us, unless we loss at home and or loss road games that a team like us should win.

            I totally get where you are coming from with regard to trusting the selection committee, but I feel our season, up to now, has been a success. The talking heads (big media) are talking about us in good terms...if we keep doing our job, which means hovering around the top-25, we don't have to be perfect to get in, w/o winning in STL.

            Comment


            • #36
              Originally posted by ShockTalk
              Originally posted by ShockerFever
              Guys, I just don't trust a selection committee picking WSU with their best potential non-con win being a Tulsa. That won't do it.

              Going 16-2 in the Valley would be awesome. But how realistic is that? Even with a down Valley, that is still a gauntlet. And that is the problem. The margin of error is so thin. That's why the UConn game and the SDSU games are so meaningful.

              There are lots of teams in Valley-like conferences (or close to it) that go 16-2, 15-3, have no marquee wins and are left in the NIT. We may have an NCAA-type team, but we have limited chances to prove it. And right now, we're 0 for 1.
              Right now, that comment may be a stretch.
              I know what you're saying, but any decent Top 20 conference is a gauntlet. It's just hard to sustain that much winning without stumbling a few times. Hell, Evansville beat the top 2 teams last year. What does that tell yah?
              Deuces Valley.
              ... No really, deuces.
              ________________
              "Enjoy the ride."

              - a smart man

              Comment


              • #37
                The Valley is going to be like playing 14 Division II games. With that said, I think if we played Chaminade 7 away and 7 at home, we'd probably lose at least once.

                Comment


                • #38
                  Originally posted by SHOXMVC
                  But Fever, how many of those teams in Valley-like conferences (or close to it) are in the discussion before the season even starts to get top-25 consideration? I don't know the immediate answer to that question, although my feeling is...not many. A loss at SDSU, potentially a top-15 team, is not going to make or break us, unless we loss at home and or loss road games that a team like us should win.

                  I totally get where you are coming from with regard to trusting the selection committee, but I feel our season, up to now, has been a success. The talking heads (big media) are talking about us in good terms...if we keep doing our job, which means hovering around the top-25, we don't have to be perfect to get in, w/o winning in STL.
                  Playing in Maui on ESPN helped the talking heads do some talking. That will be our biggest exposure of the year (hopefully just regular season) by far. Starting now, we're not gonna get much mention unless we start streaking..

                  Yes, we had some nice creds going in, but that was lost a bit with the L to UConn. I dunno how people are gonna react. All I'm saying is we could have used those preseason creds to catapult us with a UConn win. Instead, we're kinda just meh. It'll be interesting to see how many votes we receive next week in the polls to see how much face we still have.
                  Deuces Valley.
                  ... No really, deuces.
                  ________________
                  "Enjoy the ride."

                  - a smart man

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    Originally posted by AndShock
                    The Valley is going to be like playing 14 Division II games. With that said, I think if we played Chaminade 7 away and 7 at home, we'd probably lose at least once.
                    Are you calling it now? 16-2?
                    Deuces Valley.
                    ... No really, deuces.
                    ________________
                    "Enjoy the ride."

                    - a smart man

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      Originally posted by ShockerFever
                      Originally posted by ShockTalk
                      Originally posted by ShockerFever
                      Guys, I just don't trust a selection committee picking WSU with their best potential non-con win being a Tulsa. That won't do it.

                      Going 16-2 in the Valley would be awesome. But how realistic is that? Even with a down Valley, that is still a gauntlet. And that is the problem. The margin of error is so thin. That's why the UConn game and the SDSU games are so meaningful.

                      There are lots of teams in Valley-like conferences (or close to it) that go 16-2, 15-3, have no marquee wins and are left in the NIT. We may have an NCAA-type team, but we have limited chances to prove it. And right now, we're 0 for 1.
                      Right now, that comment may be a stretch.
                      I know what you're saying, but any decent Top 20 conference is a gauntlet. It's just hard to sustain that much winning without stumbling a few times. Hell, Evansville beat the top 2 teams last year. What does that tell yah?
                      1) The Shox weren't as good last year.

                      2) UNI was still in the dance even if they had lost in the MVC tourney.

                      3) I don't think the Valley is as good this year.

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        Originally posted by ShockerFever
                        They had a real good win against ODU and another pretty good win against Siena. Not spectacular, but not bad. They dominated the Valley, winning it by 3 games, and went 24-4 in the regular season.

                        Assuming we beat SDSU, if we dominate the Valley and win it by 3 games, and go 24-4 in the regular season, I like our chances.

                        How confident are you that ends up happening?
                        Fair enough, but ODU was the bracketbuster, we should get a similar RPI type team coming into CKA this year. Siena was also at home, and I believe just slightly better than a Tulsa win could be for us this year.

                        I just recall all the doom and gloom from UNI fans after that Depaul loss (STL or NIT), I just don't think I'm ready to call the SDSU a must win at this point, but with each game everything could change. Let's enjoy the ride.

                        Comment


                        • #42
                          Originally posted by ShockTalk
                          Originally posted by ShockerFever
                          Originally posted by ShockTalk
                          Originally posted by ShockerFever
                          Guys, I just don't trust a selection committee picking WSU with their best potential non-con win being a Tulsa. That won't do it.

                          Going 16-2 in the Valley would be awesome. But how realistic is that? Even with a down Valley, that is still a gauntlet. And that is the problem. The margin of error is so thin. That's why the UConn game and the SDSU games are so meaningful.

                          There are lots of teams in Valley-like conferences (or close to it) that go 16-2, 15-3, have no marquee wins and are left in the NIT. We may have an NCAA-type team, but we have limited chances to prove it. And right now, we're 0 for 1.
                          Right now, that comment may be a stretch.
                          I know what you're saying, but any decent Top 20 conference is a gauntlet. It's just hard to sustain that much winning without stumbling a few times. Hell, Evansville beat the top 2 teams last year. What does that tell yah?
                          1) The Shox weren't as good last year.

                          2) UNI was still in the dance even if they had lost in the MVC tourney.

                          3) I don't think the Valley is as good this year.
                          16-2?

                          Do I need to start a poll on here asking how many people think we're gonna go 16-2 in the Valley?
                          Deuces Valley.
                          ... No really, deuces.
                          ________________
                          "Enjoy the ride."

                          - a smart man

                          Comment


                          • #43
                            Originally posted by AG1219
                            Originally posted by ShockerFever
                            They had a real good win against ODU and another pretty good win against Siena. Not spectacular, but not bad. They dominated the Valley, winning it by 3 games, and went 24-4 in the regular season.

                            Assuming we beat SDSU, if we dominate the Valley and win it by 3 games, and go 24-4 in the regular season, I like our chances.

                            How confident are you that ends up happening?
                            Fair enough, but ODU was the bracketbuster, we should get a similar RPI type team coming into CKA this year. Siena was also at home, and I believe just slightly better than a Tulsa win could be for us this year.

                            I just recall all the doom and gloom from UNI fans after that Depaul loss (STL or NIT), I just don't think I'm ready to call the SDSU a must win at this point, but with each game everything could change. Let's enjoy the ride.
                            Have you seen the list of road bracketbuster opponents? I guess somebody could jump out and be a surprise.

                            I hear ya. I wanna enjoy the ride. I guess just after watching UConn waltz through their other games, the loss hurts even more. Again, EVERYONE was pointing to that game going in. I don't think many argued the importance of it. We lost, now we have catch up to do - UNLESS you think we're gonna roll 16-2 through the Valley.
                            Deuces Valley.
                            ... No really, deuces.
                            ________________
                            "Enjoy the ride."

                            - a smart man

                            Comment


                            • #44
                              The best thing about the UCONN loss was that it set the bar for the level of play. If that pays dividends for another 20 games, it can be classified as a quality loss.

                              Comment


                              • #45
                                Originally posted by ShockerFever
                                Originally posted by SHOXMVC
                                But Fever, how many of those teams in Valley-like conferences (or close to it) are in the discussion before the season even starts to get top-25 consideration? I don't know the immediate answer to that question, although my feeling is...not many. A loss at SDSU, potentially a top-15 team, is not going to make or break us, unless we loss at home and or loss road games that a team like us should win.

                                I totally get where you are coming from with regard to trusting the selection committee, but I feel our season, up to now, has been a success. The talking heads (big media) are talking about us in good terms...if we keep doing our job, which means hovering around the top-25, we don't have to be perfect to get in, w/o winning in STL.
                                Playing in Maui on ESPN helped the talking heads do some talking. That will be our biggest exposure of the year (hopefully just regular season) by far. Starting now, we're not gonna get much mention unless we start streaking..

                                Yes, we had some nice creds going in, but that was lost a bit with the L to UConn. I dunno how people are gonna react. All I'm saying is we could have used those preseason creds to catapult us with a UConn win. Instead, we're kinda just meh. It'll be interesting to see how many votes we receive next week in the polls to see how much face we still have.
                                With respect, I don't think we lost any cred with the loss to UConn. For crying out load they are going to ranked between 10-15. I like your point about how many votes we receive next week in the polls. I hope what we did in Maui still reflects with the voters...we'll see. Good debate though, you da man!!!
                                :wsu_posters:

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