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**WuDrWu** · October 30, 2007, 10:31 AM

Not too much arguement there. Seems all in line with what most people have talked about.

Really enjoyed the interview with Chris Jans by the way this morning.

Good questions and good insight from the assistants. Please feel free to give us a heads up on those anytime right here!

My one question for anyone that votes in these polls would be this:

What is it that makes you convinced SIU is going to win the conference? They lost Tatum and the other thug. Are the replacements that good or is the rest of the conference that down? Or is it simply that they have one 1 year in a row so they are destined to repeat?

I'm just curious..........

**NCAABound** · October 30, 2007, 10:32 AM

The way I see it...SIU is the clear favorite. #2 through #7 is a crap-shoot.

**DoubleJayAlum** · October 30, 2007, 10:50 AM

Originally posted by WuDrWu

What is it that makes you convinced SIU is going to win the conference? They lost their 1 and 2. Are the replacements that good or is the rest of the conference that down? Or is it simply that they have one 1 year in a row so they are destined to repeat?

I'm just curious..........

Doc,

I think its just the fact that SIU returns the most solid set of starters from last year, combined with the fact that there was no head coaching change (meaning the kids won't have to learn a new system). Stability and number of returning starters usually are the prime factors in preseason polls. One could certainly argue whether they should be or not, but it doesn't change the fact that they normally are....

I'm not convinced they are going to run away with the conference title by any means, but if I had a preseason vote, SIU is certainly the safest choice.

**RoyalShock** · October 30, 2007, 10:57 AM

I won't get into my thoughts on SIU again. I'll just go with the flow . . . for now.

I'm having a little trouble with the love given to Creighton. They basically return Dotzler and Watts. Dotzler is a nice PG, but IMO, Watts isn't that great unless he has talent around him to receive the focus of the defense. Besides those two Hibma is the only substantial experience returning, IIRC. I know their newcomers are supposed to be talented, but it seems like voters are giving Dana just a little too much credit.

So the only change I'd make is to put CU at #6 and move ISU and WSU up a spot.

**RoyalShock** · October 30, 2007, 11:00 AM

Originally posted by DoubleJayAlum

Originally posted by WuDrWu

What is it that makes you convinced SIU is going to win the conference? They lost their 1 and 2. Are the replacements that good or is the rest of the conference that down? Or is it simply that they have one 1 year in a row so they are destined to repeat?

I'm just curious..........

Doc,

I think its just the fact that SIU returns the most solid set of starters from last year, combined with the fact that there was no head coaching change (meaning the kids won't have to learn a new system). Stability and number of returning starters usually are the prime factors in preseason polls. One could certainly argue whether they should be or not, but it doesn't change the fact that they normally are....

I'm not convinced they are going to run away with the conference title by any means, but if I had a preseason vote, SIU is certainly the safest choice.

Ok, I guess I will get into my thoughts on SIU again.

You're right that they are the safe pick. But I've been surprised at the "clear favorite" types of remarks. Until they find a guard that can consistently shoot from the perimeter, they are a one-dimensional offensive team. Falker is going to see double-teams in his sleep until a shooter emerges. He's not had to deal with that as long as Tatum and/or Young were on the floor.

**shock-it-to-me** · October 30, 2007, 11:24 AM

Yeah, but how many years now have we been saying they can't shoot, they're one dimesional, they're thugs on defense and this year we'll 'figure it out'. But somehow, someway, they are always still at the top. So until they finish 4th or lower for a few years, I think they are deserving regardless of who they bring back.

**The Mad Hatter** · October 30, 2007, 11:40 AM

Originally posted by shock-it-to-me

Yeah, but how many years now have we been saying they can't shoot, they're one dimesional, they're thugs on defense and this year we'll 'figure it out'. But somehow, someway, they are always still at the top. So until they finish 4th or lower for a few years, I think they are deserving regardless of who they bring back.

While I agree that SIU should be the favorite because they have been the most consistent team in the Valley over the last several years and have won the most titles, I would point out that there is a precedent for thinking that they will have a down year this year.

The last time that they had to replace their two best guards, including a Player of the Year, was when they lost Brooks and Hairston. Even with Tatum returning after their departure, SIU struggled that year. I could see the same thing happening this year. Even if they guards they bring in to replace Tatum and Young turn out to be POY caliber players like Tatum did, it does not guarantee that they will be ready to lead their team to a championship in the first season that the come in.

I know that the counter to this argument is that SIU didn't have an experienced inside presence then like they do this year with Falker. While I acknowledge that he is an extremely good player, I can't bring myself to pin my hopes on a guy that gets in foul trouble as much as Randal does. It hurt them at times even when he was the second option next to Tatum, and it will hurt them even more now as they lean on him to be the primary scoring option.

**AG1219** · October 30, 2007, 11:43 AM

What? Indiana State didn't have a first place vote? McKenna must have missed the memo from Royce.

**Snapshot9** · October 30, 2007, 11:52 AM

I don't think SIU is the clear favorite. Tatum took the team upon his shoulders last year and carried them with his sidekick Young. Granted Falker deserves all the accolades he has got. But less experienced less talented guards this year will have a bigger impact on their 'Offense' than people think, plus the fact that the whole league is taller this year at most positions.

You saw how to beat SIU last year during the tourney. Dana took their own game to them in the finals, and although it was the Funk vs. Tatum show, I felt Creighton's tough defense during the game, just as tough as SIU's was what put Creighton over the top.

2-3" taller in the post could become a problem for Falker, which reduces his overall effectiveness.

2-7 is up in the air, too many factors play into this with new coaches and some good inexperienced talent. Illinois State recruited well, and could have more upside. Jim Les is a good coach, and getting better every year.
Barry, what can you say about the Bridemaid every year, some good talent, but is left knocking on the door. Barry gets out benched coached in many close games.

It will, without a doubt, probably be a very entertaining and interesting year to see how all this plays out. I will say one thing, I think our days of getting out bench coached in close games is over, and I have every confidence in Coach Marshall and staff.

**Maggie** · October 30, 2007, 12:23 PM

I don't have a problem with this poll nor do I have any issue with SIU being named the favorite. As others have pointed out the MVC is fairly wide open this year – any number of teams could win the regular season. A poll like this, in large part, is really about how people perceive each program historically and despite the loss of its backcourt SIU has earned this type of respect.

Will they win the regular season title? Maybe not, but chances are they will be in the mix.

**SB Shock** · October 30, 2007, 12:33 PM

How many times has the pre-season favorite actually fishished first over the last 5-10 years?

**JVShocker_old** · October 30, 2007, 12:39 PM

Put me into the "I still don't get it" category.

I understand SIU at the top, but that's about it. I think 2-5 are going to be fun to watch (BU, CU, WSU, MSU), but I just do not understand the Illinois State love. Maybe someone can explain it to me? Any Redbirds on SN?

How does a team go from losing twice as many games in the conference as it won to being a force (and a sleeper) in the conference under a new coach in his first major coaching job? And with all of their off-court issues this summer, how exactly does that fill so many people with confidence?

I'd take Creighton (or any one of the other 4) over Illinois State 8 or 9 times out of 10. I know what Altman and the others have done (and will presumably continue to do.)

**1972Shocker** · October 30, 2007, 12:45 PM

I like it, in fact, I love it. Just what HCGM and the Shocks need to create a little chip on the shoulder, no one respects us, kick rear attitude!

Remember what happened when we were picked 5th in Paul Miller's senior season.

:posterwu: :goshocks: :posterwsu:

**RoyalShock** · October 30, 2007, 12:50 PM

I have my theory on the ISU predictions:

- Moser was a decent recruiter but not a great coach. So Jank is probably considered an upgrade.
- They return most of their contributors, something few MVC teams can claim.
- Also added at least one talented newcomer (Sampay).
- Dyer is a major matchup problem.
- Balanced team: PG - Richardson/Johnson, SG - Eldridge, SF/C - Dyer, PF/SF Slack, PF/C - Sampay.

If they get any bench production, I think the'll be good this year.

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