Ellis?

[RoyalShock]

You're making a BIG ASSumption that Mantas can handle Aaron's minutes. I personally think he would leave his knees at center court.

Aaron brings intangibles to the game at 6'9" that Mantas doesn't. That is why HCGM plays him more.

Let's check the numbers AGAIN.

Last three games: Ellis - 11 minutes. Mantas - 31 minutes.

For the season, Ellis averages 12.5 and Mantas 6.6. That's only an extra 2 minutes a game for Mantas from what he's played over the last 3. If you eliminate the NAU game where Marshall forgot about Mantas as he rode the stationary bike, then Mantas averaged 14 minutes over the remaining two games.

I think he can handle it.

As for these intangibles you speak of, I'm not seeing them. Perhaps you meant "invisibles"?

I'm not arguing that Mantas is more talented. But if Ellis can't turn it into production, I don't care how much more talented he is.

[shocks771]

Aaron brings intangibles to the game at 6'9" that Mantas doesn't. That is why HCGM plays him more.

I do agree that AE brings more intangibles to the game, however your comment regarding playing time is beginning to switch in MG's favor quite a bit. Against Garder-Webb Ellis played 2 minutes and Griz played 17 minutes. Against Northern Arizona Ellis played 6 minutes and Griz played 3, however Coach Marshall admitted in the postgame that he forgot about Mantas and I have a feeling that if he were sitting on the bench that Coach would have chosen to put Mantas in the game ahead of Ellis. Last night Ellis played 3 minutes and Griz played 11.

Playing time in the first 8 games
Ellis 126 minutes
Griz 15 minutes

Playing time in the last 3 games
Ellis 11 minutes
Griz 31 minutes

I expected much more from Ellis coming into the season but he hasn't shown any of the fire and passion that he played with at the end of last season. At this point I would rather have Mantas on the floor and it's looking like Coach Marshall feels the same way lately.

Oops, looks like Royal beat me to the punch. Great minds think alike, right?

[RoyalShock]

And if Coy picks WSU, he'll be 3rd or 4th at SF. (Hawkins, Coy, Hatch)

Hatch hasn't been any better.

His last 5 games: 50 minutes, 3 points, 3 rebounds, 6 fouls, 4 assists, 5 turnovers, 1 block.

I won't argue with that. Nevertheless, Hatch is clearly #2 on Marshall's depth chart.

[Aargh]

Ellis may have come back early from his toe injury and may not be 100%. Maybe he saw Griz hurt and knew the team needed him and said he was ready when rest would have been a better option. We don't know.

What I've picked up about turf toe is that it can be a lingering and nagging injury.

Ellis started off slow last year. This year too. If Ellis can become productive earlier this year than last year, that's improvement over his Fr year. Some guys develop that way.

Ellis is also learning 2 positions.

It's way too early in a So season to make any judgements about a player. Especially a lean 6'9" player who grew up playing finesse BB in Europe.

Griskenas is only at his 7th game of the season and he obviously played before he was 100%.

[WstateU]

Listen to the archive of tonights coaches show and you'll have the answer about Ellis. I'm not going to post anything... maybe someone will post a link and everyone interested can listen. You will have your answer as to why Aaron Ellis has been struggling. Sorry, but I think it's best for you to listen to HCGM for the answer. Nothing alarming here (actually made me feel good), just the facts!
I actually believe we'll see a new Ellis in the near future.

:good: :good:

[BOBB]

Listen to the archive of tonights coaches show and you'll have the answer about Ellis. I'm not going to post anything... maybe someone will post a link and everyone interested can listen. You will have your answer as to why Aaron Ellis has been struggling. Sorry, but I think it's best for you to listen to HCGM for the answer. Nothing alarming here (actually made me feel good), just the facts!
I actually believe we'll see a new Ellis in the near future.

:good: :good:

I did and I agree. It's nice to hear someone working hard for it. I hope it clicks for him on and off the court and he gets into a rhythm.

[Ricky Del Rio]

You're making a BIG ASSumption that Mantas can handle Aaron's minutes. I personally think he would leave his knees at center court.

Aaron brings intangibles to the game at 6'9" that Mantas doesn't. That is why HCGM plays him more.

Let's check the numbers AGAIN.

Last three games: Ellis - 11 minutes. Mantas - 31 minutes.

For the season, Ellis averages 12.5 and Mantas 6.6. That's only an extra 2 minutes a game for Mantas from what he's played over the last 3. If you eliminate the NAU game where Marshall forgot about Mantas as he rode the stationary bike, then Mantas averaged 14 minutes over the remaining two games.

I think he can handle it.

As for these intangibles you speak of, I'm not seeing them. Perhaps you meant "invisibles"?

I'm not arguing that Mantas is more talented. But if Ellis can't turn it into production, I don't care how much more talented he is.

I love a man, who speaks with facts.

Your analysis seems spot on to me.

[C0|dB|00ded]

You're making a BIG ASSumption that Mantas can handle Aaron's minutes. I personally think he would leave his knees at center court.

Aaron brings intangibles to the game at 6'9" that Mantas doesn't. That is why HCGM plays him more.

Let's check the numbers AGAIN.

Last three games: Ellis - 11 minutes. Mantas - 31 minutes.

For the season, Ellis averages 12.5 and Mantas 6.6. That's only an extra 2 minutes a game for Mantas from what he's played over the last 3. If you eliminate the NAU game where Marshall forgot about Mantas as he rode the stationary bike, then Mantas averaged 14 minutes over the remaining two games.

I think he can handle it.

As for these intangibles you speak of, I'm not seeing them. Perhaps you meant "invisibles"?

I'm not arguing that Mantas is more talented. But if Ellis can't turn it into production, I don't care how much more talented he is.

then Mantas averaged 14 minutes over the remaining two games.

I think he can handle it.

Outstanding! Solid evidence that Mantas is an ironman!!11 Forget about the fact that he has to use a stationary bike during the game to keep from a total lockup...

Perhaps you meant "invisibles"?

Whohoho hahahah nice one!

Perhaps those "invisibles" include being used to cause severe stress on opposing guards with hands in faces and passing lanes. One can cause a steal by influencing poor passing decisions through utilization of a 6'11" wingspan and quick feet.

Perhaps he has more fouls because he is actually able to catch up to a defender every now and then to foul him...

The sad truth is, Wichita State has won with defense this year (ugg). Mantas hasn't brought a lot to the table in that dept. so far...

At times Ellis creates major matchup problems with opposing guards of any size.


T


...8)

[vancedave56]

Wouldn't everyone agree Eliis has the "P(otential)" word? Whether or not he is more productive than Mantas right now is pretty much a coach's decision. I think that's why he gives them an opportunity to "show" something each game. It's like coach said in his show the other night, he doesn't have 30 minutes each game to see whether or not they are going to produce. We would love for Ellis and Mantas to produce.

It's not really a question of which player has the most potential (I think we all agree there) or which one is a better player right now - PRODUCE. :wsu_posters:

[pinstripers]

Is there a link to coaches show archive?

[1979Shocker]

Is there a link to coaches show archive?

http://www.shockerradio.com/archive/mensbb/coach-081223.mp3