Congratulations Arbry

[tgcshock]

Aargh and others have said roughly:

"Butler went from dismissed from the team and ineligible - to back on the team with his eligibility re-established. That's a lot for someone not yet 20 years old to go through.

The fact that he did it speaks volumes for his character."

I hope the young man turns into an asset both on and off the court for WSU. But to give someone credit and adulation for digging themselves out of a hole, that THEY dug, this appears to be a lack of personal responsibility. If there were circumstances that led to his lack of academic performance that were beyond his control, then kudos to him, but if these problems were his own making, then I do not give credit for "cleaning up your own mess."

I understand what you are saying but it seems a little simplistic to say he deserves no credit for "cleaning up his own mess." Perhaps it is better to say that there are degrees of credit due.

You might could write it up like this.

Most credit: A person who has lots of temptation, stress, and difficult cirumstances in their life but but makes the most of their opportunities by staying out of trouble and by being responsible.

Good credit: A person who has a normal life and makes the most of their opportunities by staying out of trouble and by being responsible.

Credit: A person who gets into trouble but takes responsibility and fixes the situation.

No credit: A person who has lots of temptation, stress and difficult circumstances in their life and succumbs to them and never corrects it.

Worst case scenario: A person who has a normal life and become irresponsible and never corrects it.

I don't know where Arbry falls on this spectrum, but I will willingly applaud anyone who starts down the wrong path and then takes the initative to correct what they have done wrong.

[Wushock41]

Welcome back Sir Dunkenstein. This kid might need to improve his 15 footer but in the three times I've watched him practice, he about tears the rim down when he finishes and agressively goes after blocks. Someone like this kid would have really helped us last year and iIthink, IMO, he'll have a good role inside this year. This kid got hops......I've enjoyed the kids we've had in the past and their fundementals, etc but this kid brings athleticism to the table......


Exciting!

:wsu_posters:

[C0|dB|00ded]

Self-righteous comments about no credit deserved for improving academic status comes from:

A) Anti-social students (see nerds)

B) Hypocrites/Liers.

The majority of normal, social, fully-functioning students, encounter many challenges during college. Many do not complete their degrees, many graduate with sub-par marks, and a few make a strong turnaround. Arbry was victorious over his first collegiate challenge and should be applauded for his victory not scoffed at...


T


...8)

[wufan]

If Arbry can play 10 min avg 2 ppg, 4rpg, 0.5bpg, and limit his fouls and TO's while playing solid D he will be a much needed asset. I think that is doable and hope he is up for the challenge. He should be a real commodity in a fast paced game.

[MikeShox]

Aargh and others have said roughly:

"Butler went from dismissed from the team and ineligible - to back on the team with his eligibility re-established. That's a lot for someone not yet 20 years old to go through.

The fact that he did it speaks volumes for his character."

I hope the young man turns into an asset both on and off the court for WSU. But to give someone credit and adulation for digging themselves out of a hole, that THEY dug, this appears to be a lack of personal responsibility. If there were circumstances that led to his lack of academic performance that were beyond his control, then kudos to him, but if these problems were his own making, then I do not give credit for "cleaning up your own mess."

I know lots of young people who made their own mess and had the choice to either clean it up or drown in it.

I guess that if you were so exceptional that you never dug yourself into a mess, it's easy to choose to say don't give a jerk any credit for digging himself out of a mess he got himself into. As for me, I have seen so many youngsters who had to fail while they were immature in order to realize the consequences and then had to make the choice whether or not to face the failures and come back or stay down, I do tend to admire those who choose to grow up.

I have 4 children. All four of them made numerous mistakes while growing up. Some far more major than others. Three of them chose to fight and overcome those mistakes. One chose to remain in the mud. I now have 8 grandchildren. For are now past 18 and all have made their mistakes. I have a pretty strong feeling that one will not make it back. Naturally, this is a child of my child who chose to stay in the mud. The others have made real progress and are overcoming their escapades. One had pretty minor problems, one somewhat major and one extremely major. Do I want to applaud them, especially the one who came back from a very deep hole, you damned right I do. She was young and stupid, but managed to somehow remember her upbringing and claw her way out. She is doing really well now.

Obviously, you were mature enough that you never drug yourself down to a place where you had to climb out, but many people do. I for one am eager to encourage those who recognize the error of their ways and choose to fight back and win.

Arbry Butler has only taken one small step. Will he continue to climb? I certainly hope so. For every forward step he takes, I will applaud him. When he takes a backward step, I will encourage him and remind him that the consequences are not what he wants.

I cannot agree though that just because he got himself into a mess, that he does not deserve a pat on the back for fighting back.

I had to fight back as a youngster myself and have managed a wonderful life. Apparently, you were too good to ever allow yourself to fail so you would have to fight back. Good for you. That truly makes you special.

[BOBB]

Let's hope he takes care of things in the gym just as hard, because players that can clang a brick from anywhere on the court are what we've had too much of in the past.

Word!

[BOBB]

I do to. I've always been big on Butler and his potential. He's obviously busted his butt to earn a spot on this team and with the new system, I could see where he could have much more success than with the previous staff.

Absolutely. If there was anyone who looks like he was built for a pressing/fastbreak style of basketball it is Butler. I'm looking forward to seeing how he does in this kind of system.

Last year during Shocker Madness he took a fast-break pass, full-speed, and soared to the rim letting it gently drop into the bucket with a defender ALL OVER HIM. It was a VERY agile, strong move for the then very green, and very thin Butler. Arbry will NEVER be a shooter but if he can just get his weight to at least 230lbs and hit that magical 6'9" mark he will be a special player for us!

GO SHOX!

GO ARBRY!


T


...8)

No way Butler's 6'9". Not even close.

[kcshocker11]

I do to. I've always been big on Butler and his potential. He's obviously busted his butt to earn a spot on this team and with the new system, I could see where he could have much more success than with the previous staff.

Absolutely. If there was anyone who looks like he was built for a pressing/fastbreak style of basketball it is Butler. I'm looking forward to seeing how he does in this kind of system.

Last year during Shocker Madness he took a fast-break pass, full-speed, and soared to the rim letting it gently drop into the bucket with a defender ALL OVER HIM. It was a VERY agile, strong move for the then very green, and very thin Butler. Arbry will NEVER be a shooter but if he can just get his weight to at least 230lbs and hit that magical 6'9" mark he will be a special player for us!

GO SHOX!

GO ARBRY!


T


...8)

No way Butler's 6'9". Not even close.

So how tall is he?

[SubGod22]

Considering he's always been listed at 6'8" I'd have to say he's at least close....

[WstateU]

Considering he's always been listed at 6'8" I'd have to say he's at least close....

As soon as he grows into his shoes, we'll be in business. :good:

P.S. I believe he has a couple of family members (immediate family) over 7' and their growth spurts came a little than most... who knows if and when Arbry might do the same?

[BOBB]

I do to. I've always been big on Butler and his potential. He's obviously busted his butt to earn a spot on this team and with the new system, I could see where he could have much more success than with the previous staff.

Absolutely. If there was anyone who looks like he was built for a pressing/fastbreak style of basketball it is Butler. I'm looking forward to seeing how he does in this kind of system.

Last year during Shocker Madness he took a fast-break pass, full-speed, and soared to the rim letting it gently drop into the bucket with a defender ALL OVER HIM. It was a VERY agile, strong move for the then very green, and very thin Butler. Arbry will NEVER be a shooter but if he can just get his weight to at least 230lbs and hit that magical 6'9" mark he will be a special player for us!

GO SHOX!

GO ARBRY!


T


...8)

No way Butler's 6'9". Not even close.

So how tall is he?

I'm going to say 6'6", maybe 6'7" in heels. He is not taller than Phillip Thomasson. I haven't stood the guy against a wall, marked it and then taped it off. I've just seen him standing next to our other players listed at shorter heights and he's not taller.

I will throw the caveat that he could have grown two inches over the past year as I haven't seen him since basketball season. But I'd put him at 6'6", 6'7" or so.

I will say this: given my past statements, if Arbry gives us significant contributions this year, I'll have to eat crow on this board.

Edit: He also could slouch alot or be a hunchback.

For anyone old enough to remember Dice Clay "I had a hunch...I had a hunch they'd stop with him that bad ******* back. I'll see you back in a hour. Hour back! Get it?"

[Aargh]

BoBB, you joined just about the time WSU was taking their dive last year. There were a lot of posters who joined then and most of them were whiney a-ho's who joined just to whine and complain about the demise of the Shox.

At no time have I seen the overall basketball IQ lower on SN than when all the whiners showed up last year when the Shox nose-dived.

Several posters have speculated on how Marshall could use the potential of WSU's players to create a successful team. You have criticized those posters because projecting minutes and performance is useless unless a poster has observed those players in action.

By the time we've observed the players in action and have a solid basis for projecting their performance - they've graduated.

In the off-season, we're going to speculate. We're going to dream. We're going to let our imaginations run. We're going to project how the coaching staff might utilize the talents of the players.

I made a projection a while back that projected the minutes and production needed to make WSU an NCAA team this year. You ripped me for that projection.

BoBB, what's your prediction of minutes and production? Where will that leave the Shox in March?

Until I see otherwise in your posts, I think you're one of the naysayers who joined because the Shox were nose-diving. You really look like an "at this level" fan who expects a losing season and criticizes those who look at the potential for an NCAA team.

[wushock]

Aargh I feel the same way about this poster. He is always trying to be funny or detrimental towards the team

[BOBB]

Responding to Aargh and WuShock:

I did indeed first feel compelled to post during the time of the swoon. I had viewed the board before but never really needed to vent. This being the Shocker board it was the reasonable place to vent.

Aargh was indeed the unfortunate recipient of a blast about the wild predictions going on earlier this summer. If you go back to the post, the point I was trying to make was not that this wasn't the place for predictions and speculation. It was that these predictions were being presented as fact. Someone caught me doing the same thing on here the other day and I owned it. Typically, when I'm wrong I will admit it. If you look at my post about Arbry I made the following statement:

I will say this: given my past statements, if Arbry gives us significant contributions this year, I'll have to eat crow on this board.

Meaning, I will own it if he ends up living up to the hype created here. Also, I don't think it's being detrimental questioning Arbry's height. Look for yourself.

This brings me to my next point. I am not trying to be detrimental to the team. I feel over the past year that I've settled into a role on this board of a "Devil's Advocate." I do try and temper some of the unbridled enthusiasm for the team. It certainly provides fodder for new posts and differing opinions. At the end of the day we want the same thing for the team. I expect Marshall to do great things and the recruits he's gotten do seem to be upgrades. I admit that I have a limited basketball IQ. I know only enough about basketball to evaluate a player after I'm seen them in a game a few times. I can't make a judgment based on stats in other levels or Scout or Rivals statements.

As far as trying to be funny, I do. Sometimes I am, sometimes I am not. I usually try. Everyone settles into a role on Shockernet. Cold, Trop, SubGod, rjl, players parents, Aargh, etc. I have settled into mine and won't be changing. I also won't stop posting. Feel free to disagree with me you when you must. I will do the same with you.

[pinstripers]

Well stated. Not funny at all, though.......