CollegeHoops.net Top 144 in 144 Days

[rjl]

Perhaps we change the starting center based on the opponent?

Weak offensive opposing center, we play JT.

Strong offensive opposing center, we play EO.


The reality is that, with the amount of talent we have this year, starting positions might be merely ceremonial and there will be some "bench" players getting just as many minutes.

[WuDrWu]

I think the write up is fair and positive. As for the starting line up he suggests, I think it is a realistic guess at this point especially coming from a writer not intimately familiar with the program. If either GS or EO cannot step in right away (which is more likely than not), Durley is the most logical alternative.

If GS or EO cannot step in right away then something tragically bad has occurred.

I have not seen either play but I have to respectfully disagree. They are, in fact, first year players. More than that – they are first year centers. If one or both are not ready for the starting line up at the beginning of the season, I would not call that tragic.

Do not get me wrong, I am very excited about both players; however, I am reluctant to place too high of expectations on them.

I totally understand your reluctance and not only do you have every right to have a differing opinion, that opinion is the most logical.

I also do not wish to put undue pressure and expectations on this team. Most, rightfully so, do not expect great things this year. They are probably right. I will not be in that group.

I am a member of the group that watched a thin, beaten down, woefully unathletic team fight and claw in most every game last year and come within about 7 baskets of a winning season. I watched a team that was well prepared, showed a ton of fight (like their coach) and backed down to nobody play hard in about 26 of 31 games they at least had a chance to win.

If we have to suit up 10 guys, I will be wrong. If we have to start walkons, I will be wrong. If the guys don't get the system or don't get along, I will be wrong.


I've seen my fair share of basketball over the years. I understand the complexities of the game that get by the average fan. I am not a great evaluator of talent on their own....I think I'm pretty solid in a group environment.

There is more talent assembled on this team than any other I have seen in decades. The 1 thing that concerns me is their ability to shoot. If we can shoot at all...watch out.

EO is going to play. Barring injury, or some unforeseen event, he is going to play a lot. He is going to be very good defensively. Garrett will probably not contribute too much this year. By his 3rd year, he will be as good as any big man in the conference. If it's sooner than that, just assume I was being pessimistic.

Bottom line......We are young, big, unbelievably athletic, deep and we have a coach that knows exactly how to handle a group like this. We have an entire team of winners. Our practices are going to be great. Competition will be fierce. I think we are going to win this year. I think we are going to be SUPER next.

I will readily admit that I am a bigger fan and believer in our coaching staff than most, so take that for what it's worth.

:wsu_posters: :goshocks: :posterwu: :posterwsu:

[pinstripers]

I, on the other hand, cannot even grasp the complexities of a 5-buckle overshoe............

[Dan]

I like the Doctor's opinion on this one. While we lost a ton in PJ and Matt, we need to remember that all our guys were playing in a new system last year. We have guys on this team that have one year of Marshall's system under their belt - a big plus over last years team. We have guys like AJ and the JUCO guards that can fill in wherever PJ and Matt left off - hopefully and then some. While the quality of minutes from EO and GS are the big question marks, we have a lot of athletc potential and will see one or two surprises that we aren't counting on - will it be from Ellis, Mantas, one of the new freshmen guards? - someone will emerge from this crowd as a big plus. We're not as inexperienced as we appear on paper.

[SpanglerFan316]

I think the write up is fair and positive. As for the starting line up he suggests, I think it is a realistic guess at this point especially coming from a writer not intimately familiar with the program. If either GS or EO cannot step in right away (which is more likely than not), Durley is the most logical alternative.

If GS or EO cannot step in right away then something tragically bad has occurred.

I'll trust HCGM's opinion over your opinion.


ADDED: I hope EO and GS play a lot, JT learns to play defense and we win the Valley.

[WuDrWu]

I'll trust HCGM's opinion over your opinion.


ADDED: I hope EO and GS play a lot, JT learns to play defense and we win the Valley.

I trust Gregg's opinion over mine as well, fwiw. But I'm curious what opinion he has expressed that diverges from what I said.

[Colorado Shock]

According to the article, the Shocks don't look bad on paper; and I agree with what was said in the first paragraph, that the Shockers won't be a team anyone will have to enjoy playing in a year or two. :wsu_posters:

[SpanglerFan316]

You might not have intended it but your post seemed (to me) to have a negative tone. If HCGM decides that JT is the best person to be starting center (at some point in the season), then I trust his judgment and would not think EO and GS were failures. If JT played good defense, then I'd love to see him start against a lot of Valley teams (because who could stop him on offense?) with short centers. I could see HCGM messing with SIU's heads; start JT and then bring in EO (or visa versa) or start JT at center and GS at PF.

Whatever HCGM decides is fine with me because it's his career on the line. If he starts JT, I won't assume the sky is falling. 8)

[Aargh]

I wouldn't be a bit surprised to see Durley starting at the beginning of the year. Center is where he spent most of his minutes last year. That year of experience is invaluable.

Whoever wins the battle of effort and hustle in practice gets the nod. Durley can have the season-opening start, but he's going to have to work for it. Stutz seems to have the work ethic GM loves. Orukpe seems to be a monster on D and GM loves the D.

There won't be any early-season scouting reports on WSU, so why not try this rotation:

Start Orukpe to get the opening tip and get the opponent out of an inside game. About the time they figure out Orukpe isn't an offensive threat and change their game play, bring in Durley. Instant offense and hope it takes a few minutes to figure out they can go back inside. Or bring in Stutz. Either option changes the dynamic of the inside game. Marshall can be in a position to force an opponent to react to what he's doing on the court.

[SpanglerFan316]

Aargh: I like your idea because it includes the possibility that Marshall could (in effect) say

"Fine, we'll be happy to beat you by outscoring you. You feel free to score lots of points inside because we'll also score lots of points inside and we're deeper than you. In the second half when your players are getting tired and missing inside, I'll still be sending in fresh players who can score inside (Durley, Ellis, Stutz, Hawkins, Clemente, Griskenas (?), Orukpe (?)). Feel free to hang 100 points on us (if you can) while we hang 150 on you."

Some of you will not like this suggestion. I hope Marshall does like it. There may be games where the other team has one unstoppable inside player. Rather than lose the game trying to contain him, we might just need to outscore him and let him wear himself out. HCGM prefers defense and getting turnovers but a good coach has to have contingency plans (and be prepared to use them). As they say "Just win, baby." Turgeon was not good at this; for example, how often did he play zone against SIU?

I like coaches who are mean SOBs and will exploit every weakness the opponent has. No mercy; just win. (Of course, no cheating; just hard, smart play.)

ADDED: "Mean" coaches: Parcells, Ditka, (Pat) Riley, etc. Remember Kurt Rambis and AC Green. They were tough forwards who complemented Magic, Kareem, Worthy, etc.; Riley has a "mean" side as well as a "slick" side. Remember when Green was slugged by another player, which broke his jaw; he got his jaw wired and didn't miss a single game. That's tough; I guess Ralph Miller taught his players to be tough.

[ISASO]

I think Marshall, and many other coaches, would be more apt to put the best defensive matchup on some unstoppable inside player instead of letting him go off and just trying to out-score him.
Or double-team said unstoppable player and make him give up the ball.
Marshall's words on this are: "We want to make the offensive player extremely uncomfortable every second of the game."

And yes, the day I hear this from Dana Altman I will smile: "Well, the Shockers went big on us so we made some changes to adjust but it still didn't make much difference. They were the better team and deserve the league's NCAA bid."

[60Shock]

Initially, I have a suspicion that JT, EO, and Stutz will rotate in and out at will. Stutz and EO, being freshmen, are bound to accumulate tons of fouls due to inexperience and MVC refs. And JT will contribute more than his fair share. We will need three centers this year.

I don't see this as a major problem at the start of the season. The problem will be if none of them are capable of starting or playing significant minutes and we are back defending with a 6'6" center.

[SubGod22]

I'm not worried.

[pinstripers]

We will be good at center, if Durley busts his azz, so much the better. He'll be in the mix. If he doesn't, he'll transfer over Christmas break. That's a win-win either way.

[DoubleJayAlum]

Any idea on when an answer is coming on EO's eligibility?