Bronze Medal Game

[Heinro]

I agree with what you said about realizing it's a volunteer and taking it too serious. Fact check though we have medaled 14 times. In the last twenty years we have struggled. But panam has been around for seventy years

Ah, yes, my apologies. Poor assumption on my part, the coverage said 1 bronze in the last 8 Pan Am games. Thanks for clarification.

[1979Shocker]

You obviously watched the scorebook more than the television set.

The stats I used were from the official box score. How people interpret those stats is up to them.

[ShockdaWorld]

I just finished watching the replay of this game. I think it was Bombs Away Brown's best game of the tournament. He didn't look like a turnover waiting to happen, and he made a few rather nice passes. IMO it just proves that he CAN play team basketball, he just choses not to more often than not. I'm just guessing that it's because he thought of this as some sort of a chance to be seen and show himself off in hopes of finding a better job than China (playing basketball anywhere for a living would be a great job, but I'm sure China wouldn't be first choice for most). That being said, I really felt like although he made some nice passes, it almost looked like there was something personal against Ron. The other guys would pass to Ron, but BB acted like it was painful to do so. Ron handled it like the great young man he is, and made Shocker Nation proud, as I'm sure he (and his teammates) will continue to do not only this year, but into the foreseeable future.

[boltforge]

I really felt like although he made some nice passes, it almost looked like there was something personal against Ron. The other guys would pass to Ron, but BB acted like it was painful to do so.

Because it is fun to speculate, I'll speculate.

Fred is not one to randomly say something on social media. When he said to not ruin this for Ron, he meant it and probably was worried about the bonding between the USA team. People were going off about 'Fred should be there' and 'Fred would pass to Ron', etc. To the point that Brown blocked one of our commenters because of a directed tweet at him and Mello lost us the gold and Fred should have been there. Those all had to have bothered him (enough to block a nameless twitter user) AND probably pointed that ire at Ron. Hence, Fred's warning.

Ron's comment that after this last game it showed 'he belonged' also points to something similar as well.

I'm just glad Ron is a Shocker with the never say die attitude of Marshall. The announcers talked about how he was devastated after the Canada game. And he came to the last game and worked like Marshall has coached him. If you are down, get one stop and then get one score. And you can win. Down 21 or 19.

[ShockdaWorld]

Because it is fun to speculate, I'll speculate.

Fred is not one to randomly say something on social media. When he said to not ruin this for Ron, he meant it and probably was worried about the bonding between the USA team. People were going off about 'Fred should be there' and 'Fred would pass to Ron', etc. To the point that Brown blocked one of our commenters because of a directed tweet at him and Mello lost us the gold and Fred should have been there. Those all had to have bothered him (enough to block a nameless twitter user) AND probably pointed that ire at Ron. Hence, Fred's warning.

Ron's comment that after this last game it showed 'he belonged' also points to something similar as well.

I'm just glad Ron is a Shocker with the never say die attitude of Marshall. The announcers talked about how he was devastated after the Canada game. And he came to the last game and worked like Marshall has coached him. If you are down, get one stop and then get one score. And you can win. Down 21 or 19.

while i agree to a point, many of us thought FVV should be there, noone really had anything to say about Bobby until the first game was being played. It appeared to me that at that point in time, he was already unwilling to pass to Ron. So, while I agree that attacking him personally via Twitter or any other social media is probably a bad idea, I think whatever this was (if it really is more than just my mis-guided perception), started before BB was attacked for his lack of desire to play defense or team offense, particularly as it related to Ron.

[wsushox1]

I love the smell of flame wars in the morning.

[boltforge]

while i agree to a point, many of us thought FVV should be there, noone really had anything to say about Bobby until the first game was being played. It appeared to me that at that point in time, he was already unwilling to pass to Ron.

I agree with that. Again I'm just speculating here (because it's fun), but I would guess from Ron's comment there may have been a 'you don't belong here' attitude towards him early.

It is kind of amazing that with this many competitive guys that they would mesh as well as they did. EDIT: Because a bunch of strangers on a website don't get along all the time and we probably have a weaker competitive drive than the players, AND we are all on the same side!

[Steeleshocker]

I think most here were more miffed that Melo was on the team over Fred, or that Mark Few felt he only needed 2 true point guards (and ended up with 0). From the sound of things BB was the coach on the floor during practices and getting everybody familiar with the sets. The problem became clear after the games started and it seemed Brown would never feed the ball to Baker on the wing or in the corner.

[rayc]

I think that Brown thought this was going to be the "Bobby Brown Show" and learned that Baker could upstage him. He was not going to allow that to happen.

[Windiwu]

I don't think Mark Few actually got final selection of the team. That was done by their committee... There were even rumors on the KU hoops forum that Coach Few wanted FVV and was overriden. I have no clue how much truth is in that but if the KU forum was even mystified by how Fred could be cut... It's really a shame but I think Ron got experience and exposure that will be of incalulable value to him.

[another shocker]

i feel like fvv would have been the best player on that team.. never mind being the best point guard. he would have got the ball to ron baker, yes.. and anybody else that would have popped open for a shot!

[WSUwatcher]

As one who, when I was a kid, used to try to build up my guy by disparaging his opponent or the alternative, I've come to see that approach as kind of juvenile now that I'm older and wiser, so I'm going to refrain from attacking Brown. Plus, I saw so little of the games I really couldn't form any firsthand conclusion.

But he does seem a little thin-skinned, blocking a tweeter, and I do wish I could see plus-minus numbers for the US team. At this point it's also hard to doubt that the Americans would have been better with FVV getting some minutes. My bottom line for Brown is this: if Marshall could trade either Baker or FredWins for Brown going into next season, would he do it? Not a snowball's chance in July, I'm guessing.

[Kel Varnsen]

If you feel the need to personally attack BB on twitter or even here because he does something in a GAME (you know something that is for fun, not a life and death situation or even particularly serious for that matter) that you don't like, you need to get a life. Yeah, it's not ideal, but is it worth it? Does this technically matter even only a few days after the games have been played? Does this have any impact on WSU's season or the respect we, Ron, or Fred gets? The answer to all of those questions is no, and I hope most of you are wise enough to represent Shocker fans well on Twitter and otherwise (some of you I know aren't, however).

[CBB_Fan]

Baker's statline for the tournament:

vs Venezuela: 7 PTs (3/4 FG, 1/1 3PT), 1 STL
vs Puerto Rico: 4 PTs (2/7 FG, 0/5 3PT), 6 RBD (2O/4D), 1 AST, 1 STL, 1 BLK
vs Brazil: 4 PTs (0/2 FG, 0/1 3PT, 4/4 FT), 1 AST
vs Canada: 15 PTs (5/7 FG, 1/2 3PT), 1 RBD (1O), 2 ASTs, 3 STLs
vs Dominican Republic: 11PTs (3/6 FG, 3/5 3PT, 2/2 FT), 5 RBDs (2O/3D), 3 ASTs, 2 STLs, 1 TO

For the tournament he had a 7:1 AST/TO ratio, and a 7:1 STL/TO ratio. Baker shot shot 50% from the field, 36% from the 3PT line, 100% from the FT line. In comparison, the US team as a whole had a 1.05 AST/TO ratio, and a .446 STL/TO ratio. They shot 47/36/81.

Baker had by far the best PG ratios on the team; without him the ratios are even more bleak for the US (.94, .3). He was one of the most efficient offensive players, and by far the best defender on the team. He had the highest scoring average of the college players and looked more poised than the pros. If he was allowed to shoot a little more he probably could have led the USA in scoring, or at least come close, and his individual play was the main factor in playing for a win against a more talented Canadian squad and coming back 20 points against the Domincan Republic. He was the only player, college or pro, that looked to me like he belonged on the next level.

[wu_shizzle]

He was the only player, college or pro, that looked to me like he belonged on the next level.

While I thought Ron did very well, Taurean Prince is ready to play in the NBA.