Which One of Our Newbies Will Break-Out in NCAA Tourney???

[Dave Stalwart]

We are going to need Bush if we make it far in the tourney. Most the top teams have great bigs.

This is just served up on a platter right here.

[jocoshock]

You may be confusing my memory of inconsistency with concern. I don't think there was concern. However I know there were threads discussing Fred's progression and being ready for the reigns. He had a learning curve. He didn't become AA with his regular season play in his Frosh year. He did in his freaking unreal breakout on our way to the Final 4 and daggering the Buckeyes. And the rest is history.

That's my point.

All freshman have learning curves. Marshall carefully worked Fred into the role of pg throughout the year. Discussions of his progress (not lack of) are perfectly natural.

Get your point. Thanks for the clarification.

[ROOT ANGRY!]

Dude is going to be 22 this year but has the face of a 15 year old!

it's all about the bone structure.

[pie n eye]

We are going to need Bush if we make it far in the tourney. Most the top teams have great bigs.

However, in our bracket there are not a ton of teams with dominant bigs...

[jdshock]

However, in our bracket there are not a ton of teams with dominant bigs...

Who do you think are the dominant bigs this year? UK, KU, and Texas absolutely dominate the lists for best power forwards and centers this season. Arizona, Duke, and Wisconsin also have bigs, but we could potentially face UK, KU, and Texas before hitting the final four. I don't think there's a region with more densely packed talent of big men.

[Jhook89]

Who do you think are the dominant bigs this year? UK, KU, and Texas absolutely dominate the lists for best power forwards and centers this season. Arizona, Duke, and Wisconsin also have bigs, but we could potentially face UK, KU, and Texas before hitting the final four. I don't think there's a region with more densely packed talent of big men.

KU is not that big to begin with and Alexander is still out. Ellis is hobbled. We won't see texas. UK is the only team that worries me when it comes to big men. Notre dame has one 6'10" guy, but the rest of the contributers are not overly big. We match up well in this region. Shouldnt see a huge frontline till the elite 8 if we go that far.

[AZ Shocker]

I voted Rashard Kelly. He hasn't really showed squat in quite a while but earlier in the season he looked like he could be a "contributor". I'm thinking (hoping) the grind of the Valley season and time off the court this past couple weeks kicks him into a higher gear.

Agree about Brown though. We could see a whole lot more from him this weekend!!!

And Shaq yes...he will go for 20!!!!

Time to spread your wings young fella's!!!! Go Play Angry and help the upper classmen WIN!!!!!!!

[MadaboutWu]

I'm hoping Evan Wessel and Shaq are who breaks out. Plus Wamukota puts in 8 good minutes per game on D .

[jdshock]

KU is not that big to begin with and Alexander is still out. Ellis is hobbled. We won't see texas. UK is the only team that worries me when it comes to big men. Notre dame has one 6'10" guy, but the rest of the contributers are not overly big. We match up well in this region. Shouldnt see a huge frontline till the elite 8 if we go that far.

"KU is not that big to begin with"

It's not just about pure size. It's about offensive and defensive skill of the "big guys" that are the concern. KU with Alexander and Ellis had two of the best big guys in college basketball right now. It is true that Alexander is out. Ellis still had a decent showing in the Big 12 tournament, and now he's had an extra week of rest. Prior to his injury, he was playing like a top three big man in college basketball.

"We won't see Texas"

Seems like kind of an odd argument. We could see Texas. It would be impossible to see both UK and Purdue. Both UK and Purdue have good big men, but we wouldn't need to worry about both of them. Sure Texas might not make it to the sweet 16, but they might, and they have better big men talent than most other teams in the country.

"Shouldnt see a huge frontline"

Like I said before, it's not just size. It's about offensive and defensive talent. If another team had Carl Hall, we'd need to be worried about the strength of their post play. Not because Carl Hall is 6'10", but because Carl Hall was incredibly skilled offensively and defensively.

I stand by my statement that our region has the most densely packed talent of big men. I do think it's unlikely that we would face KU, Texas, and UK. I was just questioning the comment that our region is weak in the post. When I look at our region, I see the exact opposite. You presented a lot of arguments that suggest our region isn't "big" but what region has more talented big men than ours?

Edit to add: I didn't even realize this. Pie's comment about our region having no big men was a response to your argument that we need big men. Now you're arguing the opposite? I don't understand. If anything, I was taking your side.

[ShockerExpress]

"KU is not that big to begin with"

It's not just about pure size. It's about offensive and defensive skill of the "big guys" that are the concern. KU with Alexander and Ellis had two of the best big guys in college basketball right now. It is true that Alexander is out. Ellis still had a decent showing in the Big 12 tournament, and now he's had an extra week of rest. Prior to his injury, he was playing like a top three big man in college basketball.

"We won't see Texas"

Seems like kind of an odd argument. We could see Texas. It would be impossible to see both UK and Purdue. Both UK and Purdue have good big men, but we wouldn't need to worry about both of them. Sure Texas might not make it to the sweet 16, but they might, and they have better big men talent than most other teams in the country.

"Shouldnt see a huge frontline"

Like I said before, it's not just size. It's about offensive and defensive talent. If another team had Carl Hall, we'd need to be worried about the strength of their post play. Not because Carl Hall is 6'10", but because Carl Hall was incredibly skilled offensively and defensively.

I stand by my statement that our region has the most densely packed talent of big men. I do think it's unlikely that we would face KU, Texas, and UK. I was just questioning the comment that our region is weak in the post. When I look at our region, I see the exact opposite. You presented a lot of arguments that suggest our region isn't "big" but what region has more talented big men than ours?

Edit to add: I didn't even realize this. Pie's comment about our region having no big men was a response to your argument that we need big men. Now you're arguing the opposite? I don't understand. If anything, I was taking your side.

I disagree with this. I think the combination of big AND talented is what gives Darius so much trouble. Look at Tuttle. I don't think Darius would struggle as much vs. a Carl Hall as he did vs. Tuttle because Hall isn't as big. Now depth at our post spot is obviously our biggest issue. But you almost act as if all hope is lost if the opponent has 1. A tall guy or 2. A talented guy down low. I don't think KU is any more talented than any other Power 5 school in the post, if anything it is less so after Alexander's departure.

[Kung Wu]

"KU is not that big to begin with"

It's not just about pure size.

It's not the size of your wand, it's the magic within it?

[WuShock16]

It's not the size of your wand, it's the magic within it?

Barry Hinson says size doesn't matter.

[jdshock]

I disagree with this. I think the combination of big AND talented is what gives Darius so much trouble. Look at Tuttle. I don't think Darius would struggle as much vs. a Carl Hall as he did vs. Tuttle because Hall isn't as big. Now depth at our post spot is obviously our biggest issue. But you almost act as if all hope is lost if the opponent has 1. A tall guy or 2. A talented guy down low. I don't think KU is any more talented than any other Power 5 school in the post, if anything it is less so after Alexander's departure.

It sounds like I think all hope is lost? Maybe that's how it came off. I tend to be more of a sunshine pumper than anything, though. I think the NCAA tournament is won and lost on guard play, so I actually think we can do really well. I think I am missing your point about Tuttle. He is listed at 6'8" and Darius is 6'7", but Tuttle ate Carter's lunch the first time around. Since jhook is saying KU isn't "that big" it sounds like people like Alexander and Ellis who are 6'8" don't qualify as "big" in this debate, so is Tuttle "big AND talented" or is he just talented?

All of my comments started from Pie saying that our region doesn't have talented big guys, which I thought was weird. Every article that I see about best power forwards or best centers is just dominated by KU, UK, and Texas players.

I don't think there are that many "talented bigs" in college basketball this year. I just think a disproportionate percentage of the talented bigs exist in our region. I could absolutely be wrong about that. But argue with me about that. Find another region with more talented bigs.

Like I said, I'm a sunshine pumper at heart. Lots of my posts on this site are saying that height doesn't matter that much and that Darius is better than people think he is... I don't think this team has a "ceiling," we could absolutely win a championship this year if the shots fall. I'm just interested in a discussion about who people think are the best big guys this year. I think a lot of the scary big guys are in our region and could end up on our path specifically.

[jdshock]

It's not the size of your wand, it's the magic within it?

If I can't win the argument that size doesn't matter on shockernet, how will I ever convince my wife???

[pie n eye]

I think Evan gives Perry some troubles. Perry is a very skilled and talented player but he's not that physical. Evan can match his quickness on the perimeter and is strong enough to move him away from the basket in the paint. I'm sure we would give him the Tuttle treatment though. Evan, Darius, Shaq, Brown would probably all get a shot at guarding him.

However that's all a long ways away. One or both of the teams might not even make it to Sunday. My only point about the big men in our region was that no team really relies on post play as their go to strength. And I also believe we're at the point where our post play has been criticized and downplayed so much that it's actually a strength. Darius is very dangerous and efficient when he stays out of foul trouble. Shaq is almost as dangerous offensively and even more so on D.

I like the fact that post play is viewed as our weakness. I hope all the teams we play think that.