Little over half way in to the season

[OregonShocker]

They are experts for a reason, we are fans for a reason. Take it for what it's worth. You have your opinion, I have mine, leave it at that.

I'm thinking the reason Gottleib and ******* are "experts" has less to do with their knowledge and more their...personalities...and you can take that like I mean it! LOL! If I am biased because I'm a fan, then they are biased against WSU because... well... they're douches. We're even with them.

[molly jabali]

I STILL love the frosh...if you were a player at any level, think how much better it was when you got consistent minutes...the best 4 just don't give up minutes....there will be a day when the Fab 6 get their due...

[AZ Shocker]

Which is a long, statistical way of saying: Relax. Even FVV and Baker weren't studs at this point in their freshmen years. Don't romanticize the past too much without context. (Granted, I knew FVV was going to be great just watching his HS tape, and I haven't had that feeling of any of our current freshmen, but the stats still were what they were.)

Yeah good stuff Rlh04d as the comparative stats do show the numbers. Hope I'm not splitting hairs here but you could just tell watching those two in their freshman campaign. Kind of the old "eye test" if you will. I have a good feeling there will be a couple in this years freshmen class...we (I) just might not see it 'til a bit later in the season or next. GO SHOCKS!!!

[wufan]

Yeah good stuff Rlh04d as the comparative stats do show the numbers. Hope I'm not splitting hairs here but you could just tell watching those two in their freshman campaign. Kind of the old "eye test" if you will. I have a good feeling there will be a couple in this years freshmen class...we (I) just might not see it 'til a bit later in the season or next. GO SHOCKS!!!

We may not have a Fred or Ron in this class, but I wouldn't be surprised if we had two or three Tekele's. I'm personally really excited about the current freshman.

[OTR Shockfan]

I think it's a matter of perspective. your comparing our freshmen of today against Fred,Ron ,Tekele, (and a team that is way better than the one they came into) Now... not to slight the team of two and three yrs ago,but put these freshmen in at that point and you might have a different evaluation. The tide is quite high right now so it's naturally gonna be harder to float above the waterline.

[AZ Shocker]

I think it's a matter of perspective. your comparing our freshmen of today against Fred,Ron ,Tekele, (and a team that is way better than the one they came into) Now... not to slight the team of two and three yrs ago,but put these freshmen in at that point and you might have a different evaluation. The tide is quite high right now so it's naturally gonna be harder to float above the waterline.

Very good point OTR. Very good point.

[Rlh04d]

Yeah good stuff Rlh04d as the comparative stats do show the numbers. Hope I'm not splitting hairs here but you could just tell watching those two in their freshman campaign. Kind of the old "eye test" if you will. I have a good feeling there will be a couple in this years freshmen class...we (I) just might not see it 'til a bit later in the season or next. GO SHOCKS!!!

We definitely might not have a Fred or Ron on this team ... although personally I'm pretty excited about Holland, despite the height disadvantage. However, if Shaq can really maintain his current level of effort, when was the last time we had a freshman big who could provide what he has? Stutz?

Which doesn't even get into what Brown and Kelly look to be able to provide long-term. Or what Nurger should be capable of once he adds some muscle.

I'm not sure we have a future All-American in that group, but we've got multiple year starters in it.

I'm not disappointed in our freshmen at ALL. I'm disappointed in our JUCOs. Complete bust this year, for the first time under Marshall.

[Perezident]

We may not have a Fred or Ron in this class, but I wouldn't be surprised if we had two or three Tekele's. I'm personally really excited about the current freshman.

Ditto! I think our team is in good shape for the future. Morris, Kelly, and Nurger are all very talented and improving. Holland and Henderson will also add particular skill sets that will help propel our team next year and beyond.

Question: What's the story with Nurger and Holland not getting much PT lately? Is Nurger injured?

[wu_shizzle]

I remember seeing Fred and Ron as Freshmen at about this point in the season and saying to myself..."wow...those two look really good!!!" Thus far in the season...I have not thought to myself "wow...that freshmen looks really good."

If you saw greatness in Fred and Ron after the first semester of their Freshman season, and don't see extremely high ceilings in this freshman class I don't know what to say.

[WSUwatcher]

Ditto! I think our team is in good shape for the future. Morris, Kelly, and Nurger are all very talented and improving. Holland and Henderson will also add particular skill sets that will help propel our team next year and beyond.

Question: What's the story with Nurger and Holland not getting much PT lately? Is Nurger injured?

Nurger has been sick, and Marshall has said that Holland is struggling defensively -- "he can't keep anyone in front of him right now."

[OTR Shockfan]

Very good point OTR. Very good point.

Even a blind squirrel finds an acorn once in a while lol

[shockerfanmas]

If you saw greatness in Fred and Ron after the first semester of their Freshman season, and don't see extremely high ceilings in this freshman class I don't know what to say.

Probably the same as many others... it's just not there. Other than Shaq lately, none of the freshmen have done much of anything to produce. No big deal, they got plenty of time. I agree with some others though, I don't think the Shox have a potential all-American in this freshman class, but I think they do have 2 or 3 solid all-conference players. Add Frankamp into this mix and it looks even better.

[jdshock]

Probably the same as many others... it's just not there. Other than Shaq lately, none of the freshmen have done much of anything to produce. No big deal, they got plenty of time. I agree with some others though, I don't think the Shox have a potential all-American in this freshman class, but I think they do have 2 or 3 solid all-conference players. Add Frankamp into this mix and it looks even better.

Brown has the freak of nature athleticism to turn into a smaller version of Cle while he is here, and I can guarantee what he has learned this year is better than what Cle did at his juco (not saying anything bad about Cle, but imagine what he would have been if we'd had him for four years!) The last three games, Shaq has looked incredible for someone that still has 3.5 years of eligibility left. I don't think any of us can pretend to know how good some of these guys will be as seniors. Sure, they might not be all-americans next year. We can be pretty confident in that. To say none of them have the potential to be all-american while they are at WSU is a more pessimistic view of the players than I choose to take.

[pie n eye]

I really like what I've seen so far out of the freshmen class. Rashard Kelly,Shaq Morris, and Zach Brown have all made significant contributions that helped us win games. I'm not willing to project the rest of their career and accolades half way through their freshmen seasons and I honestly don't think it matters if they're future all americans or not. They can all play basketball at a very high level (as freshmen) and I don't need a committee of biased "experts" to confirm that.

Obviously it's a great honor for those guys but with thousands of collegiate players does anyone really believe that those lists are definitive?

[Rlh04d]

Probably the same as many others... it's just not there. Other than Shaq lately, none of the freshmen have done much of anything to produce. No big deal, they got plenty of time. I agree with some others though, I don't think the Shox have a potential all-American in this freshman class, but I think they do have 2 or 3 solid all-conference players. Add Frankamp into this mix and it looks even better.

See my post above. What had FVV and Baker done at this point of their freshmen years to produce?

Forming strong opinions about freshmen halfway through the season when you're going to have them for four years is just silly. These aren't McDonalds All Americans that are expected to adjust to the college game from day one, and better since they're going to the NBA at the end of the year. This is a learning process.