All-Time Best Shocker PG

[SHOXAAC]

Clevin Hannah wasn't exactly a slouch either.

He was number one on my others list...so we agree!!!

[shoxlax]

James Gibbs was very solid too his last two years

[Shocker1976]

Ernie Moore is the best Point Guard I have seen play for the Shockers; Kelly Pete was another quality guard but I don't recall him playing the point so much.

My dad always said that Cleo Littleton was the best guard he saw play for the Shockers.

[jdshock]

It's hard to compare across decades. We live in an era where we know about recruits when they are in 6th grade sometimes. And where 6th graders are sometimes putting in more hours in a week toward basketball than I do for my job.

FVV is the best we have ever had, bar none. Elite basketball players now are better than elite basketball players from the 60's. And that's not a knock on anyone. Our elite players from decades past may have been the best in the world! If I'm team captain, though, and I have to pick between a 22 year old FVV or a 22 year old Ernie Moore or anyone else from the 60's, I pick FVV every time.

[Bluzrover]

Tony Martin was really good as well. Top Five good? Maybe not when you consider some of the other names but I'd definitely put him in the HM category. The guy was great at dishing assists and stealing the ball.

[ShockerPrez]

I agree with this completely. And in my dream world, FVV moves into a grad assistant position on the bench, and works his way up to taking the reins when Marshall retires!

This would be a dream scenario!

[ShockerPrez]

Fred will be the first guard in the rafters at this pace. I'd say that makes him the best PG in Shox history.

[wu_shizzle]

If someone wants to figure out the Win Share % and A/TO ratio of all the WSU PGs since they were shooting into peach baskets, I would be willing to listen to you.

But I'm going to go the cheap and easy route and say: "Crown him".

[shockmonster]

Ernie Moore was the best. I'll go with FVV now.

[Shocker1976]

It's hard to compare across decades. We live in an era where we know about recruits when they are in 6th grade sometimes. And where 6th graders are sometimes putting in more hours in a week toward basketball than I do for my job.

FVV is the best we have ever had, bar none. Elite basketball players now are better than elite basketball players from the 60's. And that's not a knock on anyone. Our elite players from decades past may have been the best in the world! If I'm team captain, though, and I have to pick between a 22 year old FVV or a 22 year old Ernie Moore or anyone else from the 60's, I pick FVV every time.

Shallow and superficial reasoning jdshock that elite basketball players today are better than elite players from the 1960's. Oscar Robertson is the best point guard I have ever seen play and if I were selecting between a 22 yr old FVV or the Big O - I would take the Big O every time! And if I were picking a big man to play the 5 - I would select Wilt over any other big man since Naismith invented the game of basketball.

[1972Shocker]

Ernie Moore was the best. I'll go with FVV now.

My guess is that Ernie would agree.

[jdshock]

Shallow and superficial reasoning jdshock that elite basketball players today are better than elite players from the 1960's. Oscar Robertson is the best point guard I have ever seen play and if I were selecting between a 22 yr old FVV or the Big O - I would take the Big O every time! And if I were picking a big man to play the 5 - I would select Wilt over any other big man since Naismith invented the game of basketball.

I respect that a lot of people disagree with me on this. I just don't see it, though. Wilt was one of the most dominant of all time. Wilt at his peak doesn't score more than 20 points against Shaq (THE shaq, not ours) at his peak. Just look at their bodies. Bill Russell was incredible in his time. I just think he'd struggle to make an all-star game in the current NBA. I do believe my argument holds true more for big guys than it does for guards. Even so, FVV is built like a tank (which means Cotton is built like a freakin' nuclear fallout shelter). Players are faster, stronger, and are playing a more complex game than ever before.

[The Cat]

Cleo was great but he played center.

Ernie Moore is the best Point Guard I have seen play for the Shockers; Kelly Pete was another quality guard but I don't recall him playing the point so much.

My dad always said that Cleo Littleton was the best guard he saw play for the Shockers.

[WuDrWu]

IIRC Guff took Griffin's starting spot when he fell from Eddie's good graces, then slid over when absolute assist-machines Robert George and KC Hunt arrived.

I'm assuming my sarcasm meter is broken......

[jocoshock]

I respect that a lot of people disagree with me on this. I just don't see it, though. Wilt was one of the most dominant of all time. Wilt at his peak doesn't score more than 20 points against Shaq (THE shaq, not ours) at his peak. Just look at their bodies. Bill Russell was incredible in his time. I just think he'd struggle to make an all-star game in the current NBA. I do believe my argument holds true more for big guys than it does for guards. Even so, FVV is built like a tank (which means Cotton is built like a freakin' nuclear fallout shelter). Players are faster, stronger, and are playing a more complex game than ever before.

I think X in his college prime would hold up quite well against anyone I have seen since. I have no doubt about that. And although I have only vague memories of Warren Armstrong/Jabali, I would make the same claim.

Same for Dr.J, Jordan, Bird, Alajuwon, and many others..