Blue Ribbon Preseason Top 25 and All-Americans

[ShockTalk]

under that criteria, Murry is out, Early is in. Fred and Ron should be on his heels.

Not that I agree with the "supposed" criteria, but in Murray being out, he must be compared to Armstrong/Jabali and a few others as to whether he is more deserving than them, or, at the least, should he be in the rafters before them. Given that we do have a Shocker Hall of Fame, retiring numbers needs to be done sparingly.

[another shocker]

blue ribbon is incredibly thorough and accurate with their prognostications. the bible of college basketball.

[MoValley John]

Given that we do have a Shocker Hall of Fame, retiring numbers needs to be done sparingly.

Nah, you guys should retire 'em all! That way, in a couple of years, you'll travel to UNI and they won't be able to use their Daktronics scoreboard that can only display two digits for player numbers. Imagine the confusion in the league when Marshall subs in number 108, Rikeem Williams for number 126, Kerwin Roach.

[DUShock]

I am in the same school of thought as @ShockTalk: retiring jersey numbers should be done only on extremely rare circumstance. In my opinion two years is not enough time to warrant a retirement without being a national stats leader.

[Kung Wu]

Nah, you guys should retire 'em all! That way, in a couple of years, you'll travel to UNI and they won't be able to use their Daktronics scoreboard that can only display two digits for player numbers. Imagine the confusion in the league when Marshall subs in number 108, Rikeem Williams for number 126, Kerwin Roach.

Dude this is 2014. We're going hexadecimal!

Rikeem Williams #5F
Kerwin Roach #C6
Fred Van Vleet #AA (See what I did there?)

[wufan]

I am in the same school of thought as @ShockTalk: retiring jersey numbers should be done only on extremely rare circumstance. In my opinion two years is not enough time to warrant a retirement without being a national stats leader.

Even if done only rarely, Early, Van Vleet, and possibly Baker will get serious consideration base on individual awards and team accomplishment. There does come a point, however, where a program can no longer retire numbers based on an overwhelming pool of candidates. We aren't there yet, but if we continue this trend, we will be soon.

[DUShock]

Even if done only rarely, Early, Van Vleet, and possibly Baker will get serious consideration base on individual awards and team accomplishment. There does come a point, however, where a program can no longer retire numbers based on an overwhelming pool of candidates. We aren't there yet, but if we continue this trend, we will be soon.

This discussion is a good problem. Who would have thought when @RoyalShock: created this board all those moons ago we would not only be having this discussion but having multiple players for consideration/discussion? Thank you HCGM & Crew you make writing the check (a meager one) so damn easy.

Go Shocks!

[wsushox1]

I am in the same school of thought as @ShockTalk: retiring jersey numbers should be done only on extremely rare circumstance. In my opinion two years is not enough time to warrant a retirement without being a national stats leader.

Strongly Disagree, though I do understand where you are coming from.

[Rocky Mountain Shock]

Even if done only rarely, Early, Van Vleet, and possibly Baker will get serious consideration base on individual awards and team accomplishment. There does come a point, however, where a program can no longer retire numbers based on an overwhelming pool of candidates. We aren't there yet, but if we continue this trend, we will be soon.

At that point we can do what some other programs do and retire jerseys, not numbers.

[Cdizzle]

I am in the same school of thought as @ShockTalk retiring jersey numbers should be done only on extremely rare circumstance. In my opinion two years is not enough time to warrant a retirement without being a national stats leader.

I would rather have someone lead their team to a Final 4 than someone lead the nation in scoring (Would you rather be WSU or Creighton?). By your standards, I'm not sure anyone on a Marshall-coached team would ever be eligible. I'm not advocating specifically for any of the proposed, but I think full body of work should be considered, including success in the W/L column and performance on the national stage. I'm also a fan of waiting 15 years to remove emotion and gain perspective.

[ShockTalk]

I would rather have someone lead their team to a Final 4 than someone lead the nation in scoring (Would you rather be WSU or Creighton?). By your standards, I'm not sure anyone on a Marshall-coached team would ever be eligible. I'm not advocating specifically for any of the proposed, but I think full body of work should be considered, including success in the W/L column and performance on the national stage. I'm also a fan of waiting 15 years to remove emotion and gain perspective.

I agree on waiting, but 15 years? If it's going to happen, I'd kinda like to still be around to join in on the fun. :highly_amused:

You also bring up a good point with "Marshall-coached team". Not only from a player statistical point, but from Marshall's recruiting, staff, and other factors. The hard question is comparing great players on poorer teams with players on great teams that actually may not be as good individually. How would a Jason Perez or Warren Jabali do on Marshall's teams of the last 2 years? How would Early have done on those players' teams? All-American status is easier to come by for a player who plays on a quality team with a highly regarded coach and staff that has national success.

[Dan]

From team accomplishments come individual awards. So long as Marshall is here and we are a major program, we will continue to place guys on various all-american teams. I agree with the concept of retiring jerseys, not numbers.

[MadaboutWu]

What actually happens when you retire a jersey? A ceremony and you put the jersey in the rafter or what? I understand future players can use the number and it seems to make sense given the limited numbers available for college basketball jerseys (26?).

[jdshock]

What actually happens when you retire a jersey? A ceremony and you put the jersey in the rafter or what? I understand future players can use the number and it seems to make sense given the limited numbers available for college basketball jerseys (26?).

The first number I thought of was also 26. I don't think that's right, though. I think it's actually 37. I think the numbers that you and I missed in our initial calculation were 00, 10, 20, 30, 40, 50, 51, 52, 53, 54, and 55. My understanding is that you can have 0 or 00 but you can't have both at the same time. I did the math again because I know Duke has retired over ten numbers or something, and that would basically limit them to the exact same numbers every year give or take a couple.

Also, my understanding is the same as yours about retiring a jersey, though. If that's accurate, I'm all about that.

[AZ Shocker]

If it were up to me (lol).....I would hang Early's jersey the season after all the guys from the Final Four team are gone (graduated, pro, etc). Do a cool little "celebration" before a big game or something. He was an All-American so hang it!!! Just give it a couple more years though. If he has some nice success with the Knicks...in a couple years....recruits will see his jersey hanging and be like...."Oh yeah, he's one of my fave players in the NBA...I wanna play here too!!!"