Gorillas at Shockers: Postgame Discussion

[DistrictBaller]

One of the problems with the MVC is that a lot of its history has left the conference. For instance, at least three of the greatest players to ever play in the conference:

Ed Macauley, Saint Louis (1946-49) - 4-time all-MVC; 3-time First Team; 2-time All-American (1948, 1949); MVC Hall of Fame; Naismith Hall of Fame; National Player of the Year (1949) Oscar Robertson, Cincinnati (1957-60) - 3-time all-MVC; 3-time First Team; 3-time All-American (1958, 1959, 1960); MVC, Naismith and NABC Hall of Famer; 3-time National Player of the Year; No. 2 MVC scoring; No. 3 MVC rebounding
Wes Unseld, Louisville (1965-68) - 3-time first-team all-MVC; 3-time All-American (1966, 1967, 1968); MVC, Naismith Hall of Fame

Along with coaches like:

Phog Allen (Kansas)
Denny Crum (Louisville)
Henry Iba (Oklahoma A&M)
Tubby Smith (Tulsa)

I mean, a lot of the conference's history comes from teams no longer in the conference. Sure, some of the remaining teams have history (Bradley and Wichita State's Final Fours, Larry Bird for Indiana State, etc.) but the conference's teams are getting weaker except at the top from a lack of adequate funding. It is bad enough that the league is held together mainly because the smaller schools cannot afford to go anywhere else, but the league is also handicapped because they can't accept new members that aren't within the travelling constraints of the smaller schools, while Wichita State and Creighton can bring enough fans to preseason tournaments like Maui to rival major conference schools.

Interesting that you bring up Saint Louis. From my experiences with them since we joined, there seem to be a couple of fans that wish they were still in the MVC due to being a geographical outlier in the A-10. That's not the prevailing opinion among most of their fans, but there are a few that pine for the old days.

Thanks for explaining the situation with the relative decline of the MVC from several decades ago. It sounds like the same trend as the SoCon had except not quite as bad. It's amazing that basically the entire ACC and SEC was spawned from that conference and what's left now.

[1972Shocker]

The Missouri Valley basically spawned the Big Eight (now the Big 12 minus 2). OTOH, some argue the Big Eight spawned the MVC.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Missouri_Valley_Conference

In any case, they share a common geneology.

Who says conference re-alignment is something new.

[CBB_Fan]

Interesting that you bring up Saint Louis. From my experiences with them since we joined, there seem to be a couple of fans that wish they were still in the MVC due to being a geographical outlier in the A-10. That's not the prevailing opinion among most of their fans, but there are a few that pine for the old days.

Thanks for explaining the situation with the relative decline of the MVC from several decades ago. It sounds like the same trend as the SoCon had except not quite as bad. It's amazing that basically the entire ACC and SEC was spawned from that conference and what's left now.

The interesting thing is that had things gone differently, it could be the MVC and SoCon controlling college hoops right now (Along with New York Community College). Little things at the time can have large ripple affects we are STILL feeling today. Imagine the MVC with KU, Oklahoma A&M (now State), Memphis, Missouri, Louisville, Saint Louis, Creighton, Wichita State, Vanderbilt, and Kansas State. That would be a heck of a basketball conference, perhaps a dominant one.

[DistrictBaller]

Indeed although some of those schools were only in the league for a short time (Louisville 12 years, Cincinnati 13 years, Memphis 5 years) or left several decades ago (Kansas, Missouri, Oklahoma, OSU etc.) that would be a heckuva conference. The SoCon would be absolutely absurd, but the same is true with most of those schools as well. Funny how history pans out and the role football played in it all.

[shockmonster]

He actually came back within a week of going to Tulsa to ask for his job back at VCU when he initially left in '85. You're absolutely right on about falling off the face of the earth after several seasons at Tulsa. He ended at some obscure school in Louisiana after that (Northwestern State, not sure who decided to name a school in Louisiana that haha).

He followed Nolan Richardson at Tulsa and they weren't too happy with his slow down style. Tulsa, under Richardson was a consistent Top 20 Team along with Wichita State, and Bradley.