James Anacreon to Transfer

[wu_shizzle]

So you have no issue with the revolving door? I happen to have issue with it and am not afraid to say so. Perhaps there should be as much effort put into player development as there is into recruiting over the current players. Yes, college athletics is a huge business, but the kids are still people who are theoretically there to get an eductation. Everyone is elated when the coach gets a contract extension and the coaches demand long term security. Why aren't the players afforded the same luxury?

This ain't Evansville, AceDad.

[Spaulding]

So you have no issue with the revolving door? I happen to have issue with it and am not afraid to say so. Perhaps there should be as much effort put into player development as there is into recruiting over the current players. Yes, college athletics is a huge business, but the kids are still people who are theoretically there to get an eductation. Everyone is elated when the coach gets a contract extension and the coaches demand long term security. Why aren't the players afforded the same luxury?

I have no problem with the standard that is set by GM with regards to the program, both athletically and academically. If a player does not live up to that standard, and or cannot buy in to how the coach wants the program to be run, then they are free to find another place to pursue what they are looking for. By all accounts, this appears to be a mutual understanding, which has been the case with most, if not all, the players that have left under GM's tenure. I trust the coach and his staff.

[rjl]

So you have no issue with the revolving door? I happen to have issue with it and am not afraid to say so. Perhaps there should be as much effort put into player development as there is into recruiting over the current players. Yes, college athletics is a huge business, but the kids are still people who are theoretically there to get an eductation. Everyone is elated when the coach gets a contract extension and the coaches demand long term security. Why aren't the players afforded the same luxury?

Flaws:

1. The kids do not get a basketball scholarship so that they can get an education. They get a basketball scholarship so that they can play basketball for a school that also offers them an education. If they want a scholarship for an education, they should try for an academic scholarship. If they are not good enough in basketball to get a basketball scholarship, or do not have the grades and scores to get an academic scholarship, then they are in the same boat as probably 80% of college students and pay their own way.

2. There are ALWAYS minimum performance requirements attached to scholarships. Just as academic scholarships require minimum GPAs, athletic scholarships require a certain level of work. If a student doesn't put in the time studying or the hours practicing, they may very likely lose their scholarship.

3. This all assumes that Anacreon was asked to leave. Do you know that he was? The tenor of your post certainly indicates this is your belief. Why? Perhaps, just like 90% of the college basketball world might think that WSU is a "small time" school, a student athlete might think that they can just come in there and get all the playing time they want because it's not a "BCS" team. This is probably the key difference between a school like WSU having kids who transfer away vs. a school like KU. By all reports, Anacreon wasn't happy before the season even started. I highly doubt that he was asked to leave before the season even started. Of course, I welcome any fact-based argument in opposition.

[ABC]

Most players want to go where they can play. It is understandable.

[vancedave56]

Most players want to go where they can play. It is understandable.

Bottom line. Everyone thinks they will be able to play...and they should think that. If it becomes obvious their time is very limited...why not go to another institution where they can play? For some, playing time is a priority.

[pie n eye]

Plus it's not like the staff just leaves them out to dry as soon as these guys decide they want to leave. If needed, the coaches have enough connections to help them find a home that better suits them.

[Rlh04d]

So you have no issue with the revolving door? I happen to have issue with it and am not afraid to say so. Perhaps there should be as much effort put into player development as there is into recruiting over the current players. Yes, college athletics is a huge business, but the kids are still people who are theoretically there to get an eductation. Everyone is elated when the coach gets a contract extension and the coaches demand long term security. Why aren't the players afforded the same luxury?

Coaches get contract extension for performance. What performance has Anacreon had?

Successful college basketball players have plenty of long term security. They start and thus obviously keep their scholarships.

Whether James left on his own or it was the decision of WSU, regardless, it was apparent that he would never really play for WSU.

I don't have any sympathy for basketball players on scholarship. If you're good enough to get the scholarship, then awesome ... I would have loved to have a free ride to college. But if you get in on a scholarship and clearly aren't actually good enough to be a part of the team, I don't see where long term security factors in. Perform and keep the scholarship ... don't perform and join the rest of us with loans and jobs and financial aid. Or go somewhere less competitive where the standards of performance are less and keep your scholarship that way.

[ShockTalk]

@hoopsnut:, you may now present your counter argument to each that supplied a retort to your post. :smile-new:

[rialaigh]

So you have no issue with the revolving door? I happen to have issue with it and am not afraid to say so. Perhaps there should be as much effort put into player development as there is into recruiting over the current players. Yes, college athletics is a huge business, but the kids are still people who are theoretically there to get an eductation. Everyone is elated when the coach gets a contract extension and the coaches demand long term security. Why aren't the players afforded the same luxury?

Im sorry, I quit reading the post right here...I laughed...and then I could not stop...so I never finished the post....and...I'm still laughing...and...


sorry...you may now go back to your regularly scheduled pointless discussion....

:highly_amused:

[shoxlax]

So you have no issue with the revolving door? I happen to have issue with it and am not afraid to say so. Perhaps there should be as much effort put into player development as there is into recruiting over the current players. Yes, college athletics is a huge business, but the kids are still people who are theoretically there to get an eductation. Everyone is elated when the coach gets a contract extension and the coaches demand long term security. Why aren't the players afforded the same luxury?

I see by your signature you are a fan of Coach K. Has every player he has signed started and finished their careers at Duke? I smell a personal axe to grind or a troll.

[hoopsnut]

Where to start????

So there are never assumptions made on discussion boards? Kai_, You know that the coaching staff did absolutely nothing wrong how? You are correct, James was reportedly unhappy since last fall and if his friend leaving made up his mind, so be it. Maybe my comments don’t apply directly to James’ situation. However, every spring we see multiple players with remaining eligibility heading out of town. These are the same kids that a year earlier, people were on this board gushing over how they would instantly take the program to new heights (yes, a slight exaggeration, but hopefully you get the point). I take exception to the attitude that it’s OK for them to leave because we will be upgrading the talent. If they truly want out, fine, but I don’t think it’s that simple. These kids are not disposable and should not be treated as if they are.

I’m glad my fumble fingers on spelling education provided some comic relief.

No idea how many players leave the Duke program early for other reasons than going pro. Now if we wind up with a steady stream of guys leaving early for the NBA, that would be something to be proud of. An axe to grind or a troll? Nope, I just have my perspective, which obviously differs from most on here, but that is what keeps discussions going.

[WSUwatcher]

I choose to think of it as the annual talent upgrade.

Very true, shizzle. Besides, anytime you think of anything in a way differently from hoopsnut, you're off to a good start.

[_kai_]

Where to start????

So there are never assumptions made on discussion boards? Kai_, You know that the coaching staff did absolutely nothing wrong how? You are correct, James was reportedly unhappy since last fall and if his friend leaving made up his mind, so be it. Maybe my comments don’t apply directly to James’ situation. However, every spring we see multiple players with remaining eligibility heading out of town. These are the same kids that a year earlier, people were on this board gushing over how they would instantly take the program to new heights (yes, a slight exaggeration, but hopefully you get the point). I take exception to the attitude that it’s OK for them to leave because we will be upgrading the talent. If they truly want out, fine, but I don’t think it’s that simple. These kids are not disposable and should not be treated as if they are.

I’m glad my fumble fingers on spelling education provided some comic relief.

No idea how many players leave the Duke program early for other reasons than going pro. Now if we wind up with a steady stream of guys leaving early for the NBA, that would be something to be proud of. An axe to grind or a troll? Nope, I just have my perspective, which obviously differs from most on here, but that is what keeps discussions going.

All I'm going to say is that there sometimes are reasons why players don't get playing time, and it's not because they aren't able to perform, and has nothing to do with Coach "upgrading" talent, at the expense of current players. The "revolving door" of talent you speak of is not because we're upgrading talent, that is just a side effect of players leaving. This program is on an upward trend, and the players we pick up late in the recruiting period are typically better than the players leaving because that's what Coach is supposed to do. I'd think most would be happy about that.

[The Mad Hatter]

Where to start????

So there are never assumptions made on discussion boards? Kai_, You know that the coaching staff did absolutely nothing wrong how? You are correct, James was reportedly unhappy since last fall and if his friend leaving made up his mind, so be it. Maybe my comments don’t apply directly to James’ situation. However, every spring we see multiple players with remaining eligibility heading out of town. These are the same kids that a year earlier, people were on this board gushing over how they would instantly take the program to new heights (yes, a slight exaggeration, but hopefully you get the point). I take exception to the attitude that it’s OK for them to leave because we will be upgrading the talent. If they truly want out, fine, but I don’t think it’s that simple. These kids are not disposable and should not be treated as if they are.

I’m glad my fumble fingers on spelling education provided some comic relief.

No idea how many players leave the Duke program early for other reasons than going pro. Now if we wind up with a steady stream of guys leaving early for the NBA, that would be something to be proud of. An axe to grind or a troll? Nope, I just have my perspective, which obviously differs from most on here, but that is what keeps discussions going.

Can we all agree that players transferring out is perfectly appropriate in the following situations?

1. The player had little or no prospect of playing time and decided they wanted to use their college eligibility actually seeing the court.

2. The player showed discipline problems and was eventually kicked off the team for failing to follow the rules.

Assuming that we agree on the above, let's look at what has happened over the past several years. As far as I can recall, every transfer has either been buried deep on the bench or had a history of breaking team rules (usually those that broke rules were also deep on the bench). Therefore, there have been no players were their situation does not logically correlate with the acceptable transfer situations.

Occam's razor would dictate that the the theory that makes the "fewest assumptions and thereby offers the simplest explanation of the effect" ought to be preferred. Since the stated reasons of playing time and discipline issues has been completely consistent with the situations of the transferring players it takes an added layer of assumptions to assert that their is an ulterior motive driving the process. In other words, without evidence that the players were forced out, there is nothing in the situation to suggest that theory over the stated cause.

Furthermore, perhaps the greatest insight we have into how transfers are handled is Graham Hatch. Graham has stated that after struggling as a freshman and feeling that he couldn't compete for playing time he discussed transferring with Marshall and Marshall, who had not even recruited him, convinced him to stay. Neither the circumstances of the transfers nor the accounts of how players have been handled give any hint of player abuse, so if such an accusation is to be made, it ought to be substantiated.

[shocka khan]

I can see both sides of this argument, but here's the truth:
Many of us who have not been fortunate enough to finish our careers will absolutely tell you that companies are doing more with less, employees are getting pushed harder and the bad ones are thrown over the side. If it can happen in corporate America, why not with a basketball program.

Secondly, I think that James was given plenty of opportunity to turn this around. He appeared to get a sour attitude early on and did nothing to turn it around. In this case, I can't blame the coach for getting rid of a potential issue. If you don't think that a player can bring a program down, go back to ancient history and read about what all the gyrations involving Marcus Dupree did to Barry Switzer.

Lastly, and as many people have posted here, it could have been James' decision, it could have been coach's decision or a joint decision. If you get sit down at the end of the season and get told that your performance doesn't match your talents and you are not going to be the #1, #2 or even #3 option next year, you have two choices: either accept what is being communicated to you and improve your performance or you look for a better option for yourself.

While we all wish for the good ole' days of Andy Griffith and Mayberry at times, the fact is that we live in a totally different environment. Kids have so much pressure put on them at younger and younger ages. Why should our BB team be any different. My daughter didn't get into the school that she wanted to go to because her grades were too low. I warned her when she started her freshman year that if she didn't really, really get with it, she wouldn't go where she wanted to go. She did just enough to get by, got into U of H and got her degree. U of H is a nice school, graduates lots of very well-adjusted, intelligent people, but it is not the flagship school that she wanted to attend.

Again, why should our BB team be run any different than the way the rest of the world is. May be a little sad, but it is reality.