vendetta

[Calshockfan]

I call it bad luck, typical crappy ref calls (nothing was unusual. there are bad calls in every single college bb game ever played. if you asked the Illinois State fans Im sure they could say many things about the game this past weekend too) and crappy shooting by our team (lets face it. it wasnt their best offensive performance)... It happens. Statistically, we're bound to win in STL sometime. This year wasnt our year. Great teams lose occasionally. And sometimes they lose to mediocre to bad opponents. It happens. No conspiracy, no driving circumstances. You admit there is no logic...that should be an indicator its time to get off the crazy train.

Holy ****! I know you just recently joined, but did you really believe I was just talking about this one Game? Were you also just born yesterday? I fully expected idiots such as yourself to respond and call me crazy. WSU will never win in St Louis until the officiating is cleaned up.

[shocker2012]

Holy ****! I know you just recently joined, but did you really believe I was just talking about this one Game? Were you also just born yesterday? I fully expected idiots such as yourself to respond and call me crazy. WSU will never win in St Louis until the officiating is cleaned up.

Yes, I did realize you were talking about more than just one game. But clearly this thread was born out of what happened over the weekend. And I would agree officiating needs to be cleaned up across the board...for all conferences. That was my point. Its not like crappy officiating isnt something we wouldnt encounter elsewhere. When were in the NCAA tournament, there are going to be crappy calls. I think WSU is fully capable of winning in STL, even with the officiating we have now, it just hasnt happened yet. But I dont think there is some driving circumstances like gambling or a vendetta as you suggested.

[boyshocker]

I had to turn 1410 off today, they whine about fans saying the mvc is after us but they are the only ones bringing it up. It was just terrible, hopefully something better will replace it when it dies.

[Calshockfan]

Yes, I did realize you were talking about more than just one game. But clearly this thread was born out of what happened over the weekend. And I would agree officiating needs to be cleaned up across the board...for all conferences. That was my point. Its not like crappy officiating isnt something we wouldnt encounter elsewhere. When were in the NCAA tournament, there are going to be crappy calls. I think WSU is fully capable of winning in STL, even with the officiating we have now, it just hasnt happened yet. But I dont think there is some driving circumstances like gambling or a vendetta as you suggested.

Believe what you like, Personally, I'll join those that plan to boycott StLouis in the future. I believe you are naive in believing our difficulty in St louis is simply bad luck. I certainly cannot recall a pattern of bad calls in the NCAA tournaments in past years that even approaches what I've seen in St Louis. I have seen the NCAA tournament games WSU has been in dating back to 1965. I do agree that bad calls occur in most games, however it is the pattern and timing that concerns me and that is all to frequently not in our favor.

[Rlh04d]

You obviously did not read what I wrote. I did not say there is any logic to it. What I said was that it seemed clear something is driving these circumstances, be it gambling, personal vendetta, whatever , I don't know. Your logic explains nothing. Ignore these events and they surely will countinue to be repeated and explained away by people such as yourself saying that it defies logic.

Of course I read what you wrote. You put out a baseless accusation with no proof and absolutely no attempt at explaining that baseless accusation, while completely eliminating the possibility of random luck.

And then you went off and called people idiots who calmly disagreed with you. That makes you look quite sane and rational, by the way. I would think someone old enough to have been watching WSU tournament games since '65 would be a little more mature in handling a slight difference of opinion.

Without a logical explanation to justify your conspiracy theory, my belief is that the simplest and most logical answer is probably the right one. I wonder what's more logical: every year we are cheated out of our just deserts by conspiratorial conference despots, evil referees, gamblers that always cheat to make us lose but never cheat to make us win .... or just blind bad luck. Mixed in with the occasional ref that doesn't like our sometimes-abrasive coach.

[SpanglerFan316]

I don't think the MVC has a vendetta against WSU. However, let us ask some questions:
1. Who picked the refs?
2. Have these refs seemed to have any bias with respect to WSU in previous games?
I have read on SN that Elgin or one of his underlings pick the officials (per MVC bylaws) and that some of these officials seemed to have a bias against WSU. I don't know the facts in either of these areas. If you are "into vendettas" then having Elgin pick biased officials would be a simple way to tilt the table against WSU. A complicated and involved conspiracy is difficult to hide while a simple matter of bias, all within the rules, is imaginable. I don't know the facts and have no personal opinion as to why the officials were so bad.

ADDED: My post seems a bit unclear if you believe "MVC = Elgin." My point is that it is possible that Elgin could have a "vendetta" against WSU without the entire MVC having such a "vendetta."

[vancedave56]

Everyone: take a deep breath.

[Calshockfan]

Of course I read what you wrote. You put out a baseless accusation with no proof and absolutely no attempt at explaining that baseless accusation, while completely eliminating the possibility of random luck.

And then you went off and called people idiots who calmly disagreed with you. That makes you look quite sane and rational, by the way. I would think someone old enough to have been watching WSU tournament games since '65 would be a little more mature in handling a slight difference of opinion.



Without a logical explanation to justify your conspiracy theory, my belief is that the simplest and most logical answer is probably the right one. I wonder what's more logical: every year we are cheated out of our just deserts by conspiratorial conference despots, evil referees, gamblers that always cheat to make us lose but never cheat to make us win .... or just blind bad luck. Mixed in with the occasional ref that doesn't like our sometimes-abrasive coach.

Of course Ii was told to get off this crazy track. Obviously I should not be offended by that. I never claimed I had proof nor did I claim to know what hapenned or why. The fact is neither do you. Seems to me its all opinion, Lets leave it at that shall we? I do find it irritating that something is being read into what i said that wasn't stated. I at no time expressed a conspracy theory, other than the fact strange things keep happening in St Louis and there seem to be a pattern. I do believe something is going on but do not know what. If you choose not to believe it thats fine. I did throw out gambling or a personal vedetta as possible motives but certainly did not claim that either is the case. I simply don"t know. Unless you have some compelling evidence that it is all dumb luck, let it go.

[AZ Shocker]

Totally agree with CalFan! Sorry guys....it's an UGLY WORLD out there. Wichitans and KANSANS are soooooooooooo blessed!!! Unfortunenetly it's ALL about the money. You either are with them (big money) or still have that hope!!! :) HINT........don't spend ANYMORE money in St. Louis.

[BostonWu]

I had to turn 1410 off today, they whine about fans saying the mvc is after us but they are the only ones bringing it up. It was just terrible, hopefully something better will replace it when it dies.

It was day 2 of Sanderson calling out Shocker fans to defend the conspiracy. My jaw hit the ground when he said this thing has taken on a life of its own and Shocker fans just need to let it go and move on!

Plus he was rather on the giddy side when he announced the breaking news on the league reprimand.

[SubGod22]

Sanderson is a tool. Always has been, always will be.

[shoxlax]

Sanderson is a tool. Always has been, always will be.

For a self proclaimed referee and umpire, Sub, he seems to have a short fuse on the show. Maybe it's just an act.

I'm afraid if I was coaching something he was refereeing we might have to get sideways just for the hell of it.

[SubGod22]

For some reason, umpires are allowed to be like that. Basketball officials not so much. I don't know how much Jay still officiates, or if he does, but last I ran into him he was trying to get into the AVCTL a few years back. He's not a horrible guy, but doesn't always think before he reacts to things. Which is also why he and his assistant coach led the YMCA league in technical fouls when he coached there.

I'm really not sure how well his temperment would work as a basketball official over the long haul. It doesn't seem to matter with baseball so I'm sure he's fine there.

[Rlh04d]

Of course Ii was told to get off this crazy track. Obviously I should not be offended by that. I never claimed I had proof nor did I claim to know what hapenned or why. The fact is neither do you. Seems to me its all opinion, Lets leave it at that shall we? I do find it irritating that something is being read into what i said that wasn't stated. I at no time expressed a conspracy theory, other than the fact strange things keep happening in St Louis and there seem to be a pattern. I do believe something is going on but do not know what. If you choose not to believe it thats fine. I did throw out gambling or a personal vedetta as possible motives but certainly did not claim that either is the case. I simply don"t know. Unless you have some compelling evidence that it is all dumb luck, let it go.

True. A conspiracy theory is actually a more brave course of action, because you attempt to logically explain something and stand behind your opinion.

You threw out completely baseless accusations with no proof and no attempt to stand behind any of it. Is the MVC out to get us? Are the referees on the take? Is President Obama involved? What about the New World Order? Could the entire Axis of Evil be allied in a conspiracy that goes back generations to keep WSU from winning Arch Madness? Perhaps the MVC commish actually has a hyper intelligent alien posing as his dog who has traveled back in time because us winning Arch Madness one day results in the destruction of his planet, and he has to stop it through careful manipulation of his owner.

Could those things be true? I don't know. But you don't know that they aren't, so we should just treat them all like valid opinions without any rational look at them. I'm not saying those things happened ... I'm just saying that you don't know that they didn't.

Unless you have some compelling evidence that Elgin's dog is not a time traveling alien manipulating him to WSU's eternal detriment, I suggest you let it go.

[SpanglerFan316]

What about the New World Order????
I want to know "What was the Old World Order?" :confusion: