Warren (Armstrong) Jabali Recognized Finally

[Shocker1976]

Warren (Armstrong) Jabali, an all time Shocker Great (IMHO) receiving some long over due recognition -

WARREN JABALI – Kansas City (MO) Central H.S., 1964 / Wichita State University, 1968
Known as Warren Armstrong during time at Wichita State. Three-time first-team All-Missouri Valley Conference basketball player at Wichita State. Averaged a double-double in points and rebounds as a sophomore and senior. Left WSU as school’s all-time leader in assists, was second in rebounds, and fourth in scoring. Played seven seasons in the American Basketball Association (ABA). Four-time ABA All-Star while averaging 17.1 points, 5.3 assists, and 6.7 rebounds for his professional career. ABA Rookie of the Year in 1969. Inductee of the Shocker Athletics Hall of Fame in 1985 and namesake of Kansas City (MO) Central High School gym.

[Shocker1976]

Grant Sherwood wearing #52 has some big shoes to fill! I trust/hope he proves worthy.

[1972Shocker]

Way over due for Warren. I see he is joined by Mike Pelfrey and Nate Robertson.

Three Former Shockers to Be Enshrined in KSHOF

[TheShocktocles]

Grant Sherwood wearing #52 has some big shoes to fill! I trust/hope he proves worthy.

Well I am glad Warren is finally getting some of the credit he deserves. It's way overdue. But I am still waiting on the answer from the WSU Athletic Department on what is the criteria for retiring a jersey ? I guess it must be a secret.

[forevershockerfan]

Warren was one of my favorite all time Shocker players. He could do it all and had a vertical leap that was off the charts.

[Kung Wu]

Warren was one of my favorite all time Shocker players. He could do it all and had a vertical leap that was off the charts.

FSF sighting!!

[WSUwatcher]

Grant Sherwood wearing #52 has some big shoes to fill! I trust/hope he proves worthy.

Kudos well deserved for Armstrong (Jabali).

Meanwhile, Grant Sherwood? Who he?

I assume you mean Sherfield, and they are big shoes indeed. Very springy ones, too. Sherfield is actually about as tall, although not built like a linebacker the way his predecessor #52 was.

[Shocker1976]

Yes, I meant Sherfield, thanks for correcting my error.

[Aargh]

The relationship between WSU and Jabali was strained, to say the least, when Jabali left WSU.

Jabali was a Soph when Gary Thompson took over as coach in 1965. I graduated from a small town high school in 1967. In small town Kansas, Ralph Miller's teams weren't well-received because Miller broke the color barrier. Thompson's teams were better received because Thompson's recruits ended that criticism.

With each recruiting class, it seemed Thompson reduced the ethnic diversity on the team. If I was able to notice that as a high school kid following WSU basketball, I'm pretty confident Jabali noticed it from actually being on the team.

I suspect that contributed to the strained relationship between Jabali and WSU, which, I believe, is why his jersey never made it to the rafters.

[Shocker1976]

The relationship between WSU and Jabali was strained, to say the least, when Jabali left WSU.

Jabali was a Soph when Gary Thompson took over as coach in 1965. I graduated from a small town high school in 1967. In small town Kansas, Ralph Miller's teams weren't well-received because Miller broke the color barrier. Thompson's teams were better received because Thompson's recruits ended that criticism.

With each recruiting class, it seemed Thompson reduced the ethnic diversity on the team. If I was able to notice that as a high school kid following WSU basketball, I'm pretty confident Jabali noticed it from actually being on the team.

I suspect that contributed to the strained relationship between Jabali and WSU, which, I believe, is why his jersey never made it to the rafters.

For counter balance - I too graduated from a small Kansas town high school (<1700 people within an hours drive of WSU) in 1966. In my small town and surrounding small towns Ralph Miller and his teams were well-received; Thompson on the other hand was not so well-received.

As a Freshman/Sophomore at WSU I met Warren but did not know him well. I can offer that he was intelligent and willingly outspoken about racial matters University authorities would have preferred he not publicly discuss. I believe this personality trait kept Warren from the NBA but he had a great career in the ABA (read teammate Rick Barry's description of Warren) and may have contributed to why his Jersey never made it to the rafters.

[TheShocktocles]

Thanks for confirming my suspicions about this. It looks like the establishment or the good old boy's at WSU said we will not consider Warren for jersey retirement on his basketball accomplishmen's because we believe he should be seen and not heard. How dare he talk about these issues? Looks like he has paid the price for being outspoken on the racial injustice in this country. Just like Jackie Robinson and Muhammad Ali did. That's too bad. I thought Wichita State was better than that.

You heard the old saying the more things change the more they stay the same. I guess that's why Colin Kapernick won his arbitration case and forced the NFL to settle their case against them on blackballing him from the league. You don't settle a case like that unless you know you did something wrong. Maybe one of these days WSU will do right by Warren. It's hard to argue against his statstics. Go shocks.

[Shockm]

I don’t know very much about WSU politics in the 60s. But I know that Warren was born to a poor black family during a time of true racist turmoil and Division.

Colin K. was a rich and privileged adopted black boy to a white family. From what I read, he never spoke out about racism his whole life until he kneeled during the National Anthem. I think he was and is a confused boy who didn’t know how he fit into his story as a black privileged person in a white family and probably wanted to make a statement to perhaps feel better. His lack of understanding about how to do that mixed in with a mixed up understanding of history (see his stand against the Betsy Ross flag, a flag that was a symbol against British tyranny and had nothing to do wit slavery in the colonies). He also hurt a lot of people (veterans, etc.) with his disrespect of the flag. He pushed as many as 10percent of football fans away with his disrespect. While he gained a lot of notoriety and publicity, I wish he would have found a more positive and unifying way to make his beliefs clear Because I doubt that anyone on Shockernet disagrees with his end goal and would have been behind him.

[TheShocktocles]

I don’t know very much about WSU politics in the 60s. But I know that Warren was born to a poor black family during a time of true racist turmoil and Division.

Colin K. was a rich and privileged adopted black boy to a white family. From what I read, he never spoke out about racism his whole life until he kneeled during the National Anthem. I think he was and is a confused boy who didn’t know how he fit into his story as a black privileged person in a white family and probably wanted to make a statement to perhaps feel better. His lack of understanding about how to do that mixed in with a mixed up understanding of history (see his stand against the Betsy Ross flag, a flag that was a symbol against British tyranny and had nothing to do wit slavery in the colonies). He also hurt a lot of people (veterans, etc.) with his disrespect of the flag. He pushed as many as 10percent of football fans away with his disrespect. While he gained a lot of notoriety and publicity, I wish he would have found a more positive and unifying way to make his beliefs clear Because I doubt that anyone on Shockernet disagrees with his end goal and would have been behind him.

Sorry I don't understand the point you are trying to make. I know very little about the childhood history of Warren Armstrong Jabali or Colin Kapernick. In any event, I dont beleve their childhood history is relevant or significant. What is important is what they did. And how they did it. For example:

Both men are African American men. And both were basically young men at the time of their controversy.

Both played professional sports at the highest level in this country. ABA and NFL

Both protested racial injustice treatment within this country.

Both protested by utilizing free speech which is a guarantee under the U.S. Constitution.

Both protested in a non-violent manner.

Both were retaliated against by the establishment and good old boy network in this country.

Both paid a price for being outspoken on these issues.

Thus even though these two men grew up differently and at different times in our history, they have a lot in common. Each man risked everything and took a stand for what they believed in. That is a quality in my opinion that can be admired and respected.

[wufan]

TheShocktocles, I replied to your post in a new thread in order to help keep politics off the basketball forum.

https://shockernet.net/forum/miscellaneous/politics-guns-and-beer/1196222-jabali-and-kapernick

[ShockTalk]

Thanks for confirming my suspicions about this. It looks like the establishment or the good old boy's at WSU said we will not consider Warren for jersey retirement on his basketball accomplishmen's because we believe he should be seen and not heard. How dare he talk about these issues? Looks like he has paid the price for being outspoken on the racial injustice in this country. Just like Jackie Robinson and Muhammad Ali did. That's too bad. I thought Wichita State was better than that.

You heard the old saying the more things change the more they stay the same. I guess that's why Colin Kapernick won his arbitration case and forced the NFL to settle their case against them on blackballing him from the league. You don't settle a case like that unless you know you did something wrong. Maybe one of these days WSU will do right by Warren. It's hard to argue against his statstics. Go shocks.

So that you understand the following, I'm not saying Warren wasn't a great player, had great numbers, and a freak athlete, all of which got him to the ABA where he was successful.

However, I wouldn't go so far as to say he was simply a victim of "the good old boys".

1) To my knowledge, he was never an All-American in any shape or form. Something all 5 current retired numbers were, even if Levingston's was pretty weak.

2) One Shocker team (17-10) did make the NIT (which was second tier by that time), but was filled with Ralph Miller holdovers. His other 2 teams finished 14-12 and 12-14. The other 5 all played on successful to very successful teams. This may not be "fair", but it is what it is.

3) While he had great overall stats, he never led the Shockers in scoring finishing tied for 2nd, 3rd, and 2nd. Jamie Thompson led the team 2 years and Ron Washington the other year. Scoring is by far not everything, but it does speak loudly. He did lead the Shocks in rebounding all 3 years.

4) It may be more correct to say he was a victim of playing on lesser teams and for Gary Thompson.