The Official 2019-20 Preseason Thread-Spring Edition

[wufan]

I will add some nuance for my Torres support:

he is slightly built and a mediocr defender at best. That was not surprising based on what we knew of him coming in, and shouldn’t disappoint anyone if that is what they saw. He was not recruited due to either of those factors. That said, those things need to improve.

Ricky was the BEST at running the offense for WSU last year. He has to limit the atomic bombs, and other than the last game (or three), he showed marked improvement over the year. This is what you need out of a PG; it was delivered, and it should improve.

Ricky was recruited as a three point stud. He underperformed in this regard in historic fashion. If he is to be a viable contributor next year, this HAS to improve. If he reaches his JUCO freshman numbers in this regard, he will be a top flight PG in the AAC.

[GreatWhiteBuffalo]

All of that is true. Also true is the fact that he MUST be capable of knocking down an open shot occasionally. If he is not capable of this, the offense is playing 4 on 5. His shooting percentage from beyond the arc is an abomination.

[ShockTalk]

GreatWhiteBuffalo , you are totally right about RT needing to get his mojo back regarding his 3pt shot. He excelled at it in JUCO and needs to get it close to the .333 range to draw the player guarding him out.

That's not the case with his shooting inside the arc. Outside of our post men, he was first in 2pt % and it's not even close: RT .532 / MM .466 / JB .420 / ES .415 / SHJ .410 / DD .398. Particularly important to the team when you take MM's numbers out.

[WstateU]

Ricky...

https://media.giphy.com/media/mD44sZ...ChoB/giphy.gif

[shoxlax]

Go watch the YouTube vids of Teddy especially the one at KState and notice the angles he takes to get the ball off the glass just right. There are few with that type of skill which is why he can play an undersized four.

[calfan]

I don’t see what some of you see. I have not watched Allen play. If WSU plays with a starting perimeter of Burton-PG, Stevenson-2G, Dennis-SF, Allen-PF, they will have a worse 3 point shooting team than this year. I think if Marshall thought Chandler could play 4, McDuffie woouldn’t have played nearly as many minutes as he did. I think WSU still needs another PF at least, with a SF as well. That is my opinion.

[wufan]

You should search Teddy Allen on YouTube.

Since we lose our best 3 point threat, yeah our % will go down on expected. Pretty much everyone except McD underperformed this year vs historical performance expectations. He will be hard pressed to perform as bad next year, even w/o MM.

[ShockerFever]

RT will not be any worse than who we had running the show this year. He doesn't need to be a big time 3-point shooter. Sure it would help, and I expect him to be closer to his JUCO averages next year after he shakes off all of the nerves transitioning to D-1. He will absolutely be a better asset at the point than what he had for most of the year this year. Not even close.

[SHOCKvalue]

I think Ricky is a buy stock, personally. I think he will emerge from his cocoon early next year as a clear asset.

No one is paying me for that take though.

[Stickboy46]

The biggest thing Ricky needs to improve on is something that he has shown he's capable of in the past. 3pt shooting.

[WstateU]

A little confidence and Ricky will be set...

https://media.giphy.com/media/5W5cc5TDmY8Fi/giphy.gif

[wichshock65]

[ShockTalk]

I'm going to change players here and look at things JE, AM, and IPBC need to improve upon.

AM was lights out with his FG% at .632. JE shoots some 3s, so his overall FG% of .543 goes to .565 without the 3s. Still almost 70 points less than AM. IPBC also shoots some 3s so his FG% goes from .500 to .529 without the 3s. IPBC was a freshman so we should expect his numbers to go up. This will be Jamie's last year. Frankly, he needs to become less of a "black hole" and other times dunk with authority instead of some of his funky/awkward missed layups. The incident with DD might not happen if the passer knows JE will kick the ball back out to him if the man guarding the passer drops down to help.

That leads to assists and turnovers. Per/40 A & TO: JE 0.78 / 2.89. AM 0.60 / 2.09. IPBC 1.42 / 2.25. IPBC's ratio as a freshman isn't bad for a big man. AM needs to improve his assists, while JE has a problem with both. If JE kicks out more often, he might see both those numbers improve along with his FG%.

Lastly, Personal Fouls. It's a damn good thing we had 3 centers. Per 40 minutes PFs: JE 6.8 / AM 6.3 / IPBC 5.8 (for comparison, Shaq Morris was 5.3 his senior year). Again, IPBC's PFs are not that bad for a freshman. AM's foot speed and agility may limit how much AM can improve, but he was only a sophomore with very few minutes as a freshman, so there is hope. It is critical that JE figures it out quickly as he'll be a senior and we really need him on the floor more than the 17.9 mpg he averaged this year. Needs to get his minutes up close to 25 mpg. Shaq Morris went from 18.0 mpg to 23.7 mpg keeping his fouls per game at 2.4 both years. While JE averaged 17.9 mpg this year, he also averaged 3.05 fouls per game. Need big improvement on both.

[wufan]

I agree with the breakdown, but not the conclusion. We really don’t need JE to play more than 18 mpg next year, in fact I hope he stays under 22. A well rested and motivated JE is what we need because we have other weapons at the five. Just get stronger JE!

AM needs to dramatically improve his lateral quickness (if he is able...dude is built like a tank). He also needs to get better position. He will probably remain a match-up player next year.

IPBC is a five tool player with a five cent head. He looked lost on both ends of the court for large portions of the season. I will keep saying it...he’s on the Durley/Morris path to success. If he can handle it, he will be a big time player starting in 2021.

Really loved me some Udeze until the injury! Tank junior can screen and D. He bulldozes his way to the basket. Just 10 TOs in 16 games at 12.6 mpg. He’s still raw, but he understands the game.

I have zero worries about our centers. They will deliver crushing body blows for 40 minutes.

[ShockTalk]

Guess we can agree to disagree on the conclusions of JE's playing time. JE had the second highest scoring per minute (.514) just behind MM (.545). After that, it dropped a lot to SHJ .368, AM .348, DD .323.

We've got a lot of scoring to replace. The biggest reason for his lack of playing time was first, fouls, second, stamina (out of shape), and possibly a distant third, his foot. If he's only playing the same number of minutes next year, it will be for the same reasons as this year. Motivation should not be a problem or he'll be playing less than this year.

We are kind of splitting hairs with me saying close to 25 (think 23-24) and you staying under 22. We will be playing games next year where 2nd best, even if it's good, is not good enough.

There were 10 games this year where we had 4 close wins and 6 close losses and JE averaged only 16.1 mpg and had 42 fouls. Maybe 1 less foul in those 6 losses would have gotten us 3 more wins and we replace Temple in the Dance or not sweating making the NIT.

He did do better the second half of the season as only 3 of the above 10 games happened then. He also averaged 18.5 mpg as opposed to 17.3 mpg the first half.

He did play 22-27 minutes in 7 games (we won 6 and lost 1 to Memphis by 3 where he had 17 points) and another 6 games 20-21 minutes (winning 5 and losing to Alabama where he had 13 points). That's WSU going 11-2 where he averaged 22.7 mpg. He can handle 22-25 minutes just fine. He just needs to be able to stay in some games longer. In WSU 15 losses, he played 15.6 mpg including the 2 games above. Not counting those 2 games, the other 13 losses he played 14.6 mpg.

If he was important to stay in games this year, it will be more important next year without MM.

[Shock Top]

Ricky was recruited as a three point stud. He underperformed in this regard in historic fashion. If he is to be a viable contributor next year, this HAS to improve. If he reaches his JUCO freshman numbers in this regard, he will be a top flight PG in the AAC.

Looking at the numbers from last season and this season, you would have thought Ricky was the one who had to switch shooting hands and not Dexter.

[wufan]

Most on this board could do better than 4 of 45 in D-I competition. Absolute shanks

[WstateU]

Shhhh... I’ve had the shanks. :(

[molly jabali]

Doubt it... I’m pretty the playing level of this board is pretty low....

[Wooglin]

Doubt it... I’m pretty the playing level of this board is pretty low....

I'm thinking catching iron on 4-45 would be impressive

[Aargh]

A few years ago (maybe 10) I picked up a basketball for the first time in many years. Made 4 of 8 FT's. 3 were nothing but net. I got to feeling pretty good, so I stepped back to the 3-point line. Had I taken 45 attempts, I wouldn't have made 4.

[GreatWhiteBuffalo]

There is a contextual caveat in that story. It was one day and 8 FTs. It was not an off-season and a season of practices and shoot arounds. I would guarantee that I could knock down 10 of 45 in a season after that much time back in the gym and I haven't played competitive basketball in almost 25 years. Is it really asking too much for a supposed JUCO All-American GUARD to knock down 22% from beyond the arc??

[OregonShocker]

I could've done it before I tore my Achilles. Getting old sucks... but it beats the alternative.

[BOBB]

A 3 pointer is quite a heave for those of usbwith poor technique that are not hoisting 500 a day. Just like a 2 mile run is out of reach for thise of us more used to running to the kitchen for more beer and then back to the couch.

[shocker43]

We should keep RT. Experience at the pg position is important. We just went through an entire season without a pg who had ran our system before, and people are wanting to get rid of 1 of the 2 guys that have done it because they think our freshman coming in will be able to fill the gap? We aren't going to be able to find anyone better than RT at this point in recruiting. The best grad transfers are going to bigger schools and the best HS recruits are already signed.

[pinstripers]

I imagine that RT stays unless we land Grant Sherfield. On the other hand, I would guess that we search high and low for a frontcourt guy (Trey Wade?....or anybody at all) and RB ends up at Newman or Emporia.

[Windiwu]

RB would more likely go to a juco for a year then try for another div1 school.

[Aargh]

Sherfield IS NOT a PG.

[pinstripers]

Anybody think RB can play at a juco?

[Aargh]

To my way of thinking Torres is about #4 on the list of potential transfers, and two of the guys ahead of him might leave by their choice, and not Marshall's.

[TGOWJ GOSHOX]

What 2?

[Aargh]

I'd rather not go into that. I've incurred the wrath of ShockerNet before, and I'm certain some would have apoplexy if I would name names. Then everybody would want to know why I felt that way. Then I'd be under attack for possibly thinking that way.

I will simply assure all of SN that it isn't always Marshall's decision on who leaves the program.

[TGOWJ GOSHOX]

I hear ya