Roster Next Year

[ShoxFan963]

Yea, I hate to pile on, but EO is a spot I would love to have back. He holds an unofficial NCAA Division I record of most pages (143+) on a fan board.

Come on, what a disappointment. His lacking on offense and natural instinct for the game is too much to overcome with athletisism, rebounding & block shots.

With all the hoopla, energy and excitment that surrounded him three years ago, what we have seen is simply not worth it.

I would ask everyone on this board "With what was advertised with EO did we expect him to be further in his progress at this point in his development?"

Is there anything wrong with a defensive specialist? It worked well for Aaron Ellis. I'll take 5-8 rebounds with a couple blocks every time. He doesn't even have to block a shot; his size is enough to stop penetration coming down the lane. Give him another year for his offensive game to come around. He will be a force then.

[forevershockerfan]

HCGM recruits players that he thinks are quality folk, will buckle down on the books, and that thinks have to potential to be a starter and or rotation player some day. He has seen development in practice lately that he likes on EO and it helps that EO is doing the above areas to the best of his ability.

[SHOXAAC]

The answer is yes, SHOXMVC. However, once he learns the game and things click, watch out. 7-0' tall with a great attitude and a solid work ethic. He is well worth the wait and being patient. He has a lot of basketball yet to play including a long summer and some Overeas games to improve areas of concern. One last thought. If AE would have sit out this last Season, EO would have had to play several more minutes. Who knows what such future experience to come as to what can occur when it all begins to come together for EO. HCGM will work him very very hard.

:good: :yes: :posterwu: :poster_eo: :poster_eo: :poster_eo: 8)

I have to admit, I have been drinking the koolaid up til now...I just think the natural instinct of a young boy growing up playing the game vs. a case like EO, who just doesn't seem to possess the instinct, is hard to overcome.

Don't under estimate instinct. It slows the game up so much. With EO the game must seem like warp speed. He is seemingly a bright, smart, intelligent young man who is very well spoken, but to overcome instinct and become a quality Division I basketball player just doesen't seem to me to be in the cards for EO. I hope I'm wrong and have to eat my words (I know, hope and expect many of you to bump my words when the time comes).

[SHOXAAC]

HCGM recruits players that he thinks are quality folk, will buckle down on the books, and that thinks have to potential to be a starter and or rotation player some day. He has seen development in practice lately that he likes on EO and it helps that EO is doing the above areas to the best of his ability.

Come on, HCGM doesn't exactly have a shiny resume when it comes to consistent recruits as you talk about.

[shockall]

On EO, we can really only go by how HCGM said he was doing in practice over about the last month or so. He seemed to think EO was improving enough that he could play up to 20 minutes a game. And the trip overseas this summer can't hurt any to give him more playing experience against other competition.

How can you assume that the overseas trip will advance EO? The trip GS took to Eastern Europe last summer didn't seem to increase his basketbal ability very much.

[Steeleshocker]

I think we will be okay. We probably will recruit 1 or 2 more players. It's too bad though, because Hamilton is so athletic, I would have liked to see what he could do with more minutes. I think we will recruit at least 1 more big man, probably a 4 man, who might also be able to play the 5.

I was a little worried about replacing Durley/Blair's offensive production, so Stutz has to step up offensive scoring, and I think Hall will give us some offense too. Jake White is a little bit of a question mark, depends how fast he adapts to D-1 ball. He could end up a small contributor, or a more significant one, just depends. I am not sure whether Jake White will play the 3/4 at times, or just the 4 and relieve Hall.

It has seemed to me, anyways, that Nigerian players blossom about a year later than expected, so it is possible that Orukpe may improve quite a bit before next fall. I would love to see him go to a Big Man's camp over the summer. (If 3G wanted him to go to a Big Man's Camp, would it be legal for the coach to pay for it for Orukpe?). I did notice that he was trying to develop a baby hook shot around the basket, and that could be gold for us if he improves it.

Certainly recruiting another big man or two (I really think 1 big man and another guard) would change the rotation outlook. I am looking for about a 9 man rotation next year.

Personally, I am not excited about T-Rich. Everytime I saw him play this last season, he couldn't keep up on defense, and quite frankly, his shot doesn't seem to be what it was advertised to be.

While I can understand the skepticism regarding T.Rich, I will withhold judgment until next season. He now has two years under his belt in the system. The only time we ever saw him was during mop up minutes. I can't possibly imagine that is good for the jump shot, coming in cold after an hour of sitting on the bench.

Now, if he can't get off the bench next year for a few meaningful minutes, and is beat out by a combination of TM/Ben/EW, then I will be concerned. With his experience, he should be able to come in and give us a few minutes each game, and if those other guys are keeping him on the bench, I don't know what he will offer in future years. It's important to keep in mind that we still have TR for 3 years, and if he is able to do a little bit next year, I like his chances to do a lot the next two years between him and EW.

[Steeleshocker]

On EO, we can really only go by how HCGM said he was doing in practice over about the last month or so. He seemed to think EO was improving enough that he could play up to 20 minutes a game. And the trip overseas this summer can't hurt any to give him more playing experience against other competition.

How can you assume that the overseas trip will advance EO? The trip GS took to Eastern Europe last summer didn't seem to increase his basketbal ability very much.

Except that the trip this year will be with only WSU players, running GM's system and plays, with the same guys he will be playing with the entire year, with an extra couple of weeks of practice.

It will definitely help.

[notquiteBWing]

Interesting that you bring up EO.

I was talking to a player just a bit ago. We discussed the expectations for next year.

I said that I didn't expect EO to get much PT.
He kinda shrugged and said he wasn't sure. EO has been making some of his best strides lately. If he continues learning at the current pace. He thinks EO will get a healthy share of minutes.

Said there are two reasons EO doesn't get minutes (i guess DIDN'T would be more appropriate now):

1. He is BAD at catching the ball. butterfingers.
2. He doesn't/didn't know the system.

Everyone else knew th plays. but he'd forget or get lost from time to time. That's not very encouraging...
BUT

He then went on to say that EO can get it together. and he thinks that the odds are in his favor. They work on his offensive skills (and ball catching skills) constantly.

There are times in practice where he's dunking on everyone.
One practice where they played pickup, he had 16 blocks. 16

They love to do a full court press with him as the anchor. good things happen.

i think he can pull it together. it will slow down a little bit for him next year i bet.
I try to tell myself that he is(was), in effect, a freshman this year. Just wasn't ready for the speed of the game.

I feel that it will be worth it if he's a presence on D and O on his senior year.

hopefully by then we will see alot of these - :poster_eo: :poster_eo: :poster_eo:

[forevershockerfan]

SHOXMVC--I for one appreciate your honesty here on SN. You and I agree many times, but not this time. We both hope I am correct for EO to show solid improvements. We can all learn from each other on here and all of us have made various observations that are correct, and heaven forbid--sometimes wrong.

My insticnts tell me that EO has all kinds of room for improvement and the sky is the limit. The question seems to be, when will it all come together for EO? Right now, we don't need him to be a star. However, if he could come in for 10-15 minutes a game next Season, clean the glass spotless, set some picks, alter and swat some shots, score some points, and play tough D to the max, then we will all enjoy the benefits that will be the end result.

[notquiteBWing]

I think we will be okay. We probably will recruit 1 or 2 more players. It's too bad though, because Hamilton is so athletic, I would have liked to see what he could do with more minutes. I think we will recruit at least 1 more big man, probably a 4 man, who might also be able to play the 5.

I was a little worried about replacing Durley/Blair's offensive production, so Stutz has to step up offensive scoring, and I think Hall will give us some offense too. Jake White is a little bit of a question mark, depends how fast he adapts to D-1 ball. He could end up a small contributor, or a more significant one, just depends. I am not sure whether Jake White will play the 3/4 at times, or just the 4 and relieve Hall.

It has seemed to me, anyways, that Nigerian players blossom about a year later than expected, so it is possible that Orukpe may improve quite a bit before next fall. I would love to see him go to a Big Man's camp over the summer. (If 3G wanted him to go to a Big Man's Camp, would it be legal for the coach to pay for it for Orukpe?). I did notice that he was trying to develop a baby hook shot around the basket, and that could be gold for us if he improves it.

Certainly recruiting another big man or two (I really think 1 big man and another guard) would change the rotation outlook. I am looking for about a 9 man rotation next year.

Personally, I am not excited about T-Rich. Everytime I saw him play this last season, he couldn't keep up on defense, and quite frankly, his shot doesn't seem to be what it was advertised to be.

While I can understand the skepticism regarding T.Rich, I will withhold judgment until next season. He now has two years under his belt in the system. The only time we ever saw him was during mop up minutes. I can't possibly imagine that is good for the jump shot, coming in cold after an hour of sitting on the bench.

Now, if he can't get off the bench next year for a few meaningful minutes, and is beat out by a combination of TM/Ben/EW, then I will be concerned. With his experience, he should be able to come in and give us a few minutes each game, and if those other guys are keeping him on the bench, I don't know what he will offer in future years. It's important to keep in mind that we still have TR for 3 years, and if he is able to do a little bit next year, I like his chances to do a lot the next two years between him and EW.

yeah. i hate to say this about a player on our team BUT

I don't feel like tyler is very good. not a D-1 type player IMO.

Shot is bad. he starts descending before he releases the ball. He doesn't have good accuracy in shoot around, I don't think it would get any better with more minutes.

I think he has a strong body. But his lateral quickness is... isn't much. gonna get beat on D alot.

[Steeleshocker]

I think we will be okay. We probably will recruit 1 or 2 more players. It's too bad though, because Hamilton is so athletic, I would have liked to see what he could do with more minutes. I think we will recruit at least 1 more big man, probably a 4 man, who might also be able to play the 5.

I was a little worried about replacing Durley/Blair's offensive production, so Stutz has to step up offensive scoring, and I think Hall will give us some offense too. Jake White is a little bit of a question mark, depends how fast he adapts to D-1 ball. He could end up a small contributor, or a more significant one, just depends. I am not sure whether Jake White will play the 3/4 at times, or just the 4 and relieve Hall.

It has seemed to me, anyways, that Nigerian players blossom about a year later than expected, so it is possible that Orukpe may improve quite a bit before next fall. I would love to see him go to a Big Man's camp over the summer. (If 3G wanted him to go to a Big Man's Camp, would it be legal for the coach to pay for it for Orukpe?). I did notice that he was trying to develop a baby hook shot around the basket, and that could be gold for us if he improves it.

Certainly recruiting another big man or two (I really think 1 big man and another guard) would change the rotation outlook. I am looking for about a 9 man rotation next year.

Personally, I am not excited about T-Rich. Everytime I saw him play this last season, he couldn't keep up on defense, and quite frankly, his shot doesn't seem to be what it was advertised to be.

While I can understand the skepticism regarding T.Rich, I will withhold judgment until next season. He now has two years under his belt in the system. The only time we ever saw him was during mop up minutes. I can't possibly imagine that is good for the jump shot, coming in cold after an hour of sitting on the bench.

Now, if he can't get off the bench next year for a few meaningful minutes, and is beat out by a combination of TM/Ben/EW, then I will be concerned. With his experience, he should be able to come in and give us a few minutes each game, and if those other guys are keeping him on the bench, I don't know what he will offer in future years. It's important to keep in mind that we still have TR for 3 years, and if he is able to do a little bit next year, I like his chances to do a lot the next two years between him and EW.

yeah. i hate to say this about a player on our team BUT

I don't feel like tyler is very good. not a D-1 type player IMO.

Shot is bad. he starts descending before he releases the ball. He doesn't have good accuracy in shoot around, I don't think it would get any better with more minutes.

I think he has a strong body. But his lateral quickness is... isn't much. gonna get beat on D alot.

That's all good and well, but look at what you are basing this on.

1) Shoot around
2) 2-3 mop-up minutes coming off the bench cold

and if you time it right...

3) Pick up games

Those are not good barometers of how good or bad a player is going to be.

He will have plenty of time to prove himself in practice to Coach. If he is the best option, and has earned it, and is making strides he will see a few minutes. If he does see around 5 mpg next season, then I bet he is doing things the right way and improving. If not, THEN I will get concerned. A redshirt sophomore should be starting to emerge as a future impact player.

[jocoshock]

Yea, I hate to pile on, but EO is a spot I would love to have back. He holds an unofficial NCAA Division I record of most pages (143+) on a fan board.

Come on, what a disappointment. His lacking on offense and natural instinct for the game is too much to overcome with athletisism, rebounding & block shots.

With all the hoopla, energy and excitment that surrounded him three years ago, what we have seen is simply not worth it.

I would ask everyone on this board "With what was advertised with EO did we expect him to be further in his progress at this point in his development?"

I agree however, you gotta roll the dice. As a non-BCS program trying to stay relevant and competitive on the national scene, I don't have a problem with them trying to find a diamond in the rough. GM has said it himself that he tries to recruit guys that are under the radar and can be developed into good players in college.

You win some and you lose some. I have more of a problem of guys that were recruited like Kenny M and J Hamilton that were potential MVC All-Stars not panning out.

You could have said the same thing about Henry Carr, Tom Kosich, and even Zarko their first year or two. Zarko turned into a VERY good post man by his senior year, and I have heard some people say that Henry wasn't bad by his senior year.

You won't know about EO until he gets some serious playing time.

[forevershockerfan]

If EO really works at it, and does get more minutes, I truly think his #1 strength could be rebounding. If he can swat shots without fouling to a fellow teammate, that results in another Shocker possession.

[tropicalshox]

Yea, I hate to pile on, but EO is a spot I would love to have back. He holds an unofficial NCAA Division I record of most pages (143+) on a fan board.

Come on, what a disappointment. His lacking on offense and natural instinct for the game is too much to overcome with athletisism, rebounding & block shots.

With all the hoopla, energy and excitment that surrounded him three years ago, what we have seen is simply not worth it.

I would ask everyone on this board "With what was advertised with EO did we expect him to be further in his progress at this point in his development?"

I agree however, you gotta roll the dice. As a non-BCS program trying to stay relevant and competitive on the national scene, I don't have a problem with them trying to find a diamond in the rough. GM has said it himself that he tries to recruit guys that are under the radar and can be developed into good players in college.

You win some and you lose some. I have more of a problem of guys that were recruited like Kenny M and J Hamilton that were potential MVC All-Stars not panning out.

You could have said the same thing about Henry Carr, Tom Kosich, and even Zarko their first year or two. Zarko turned into a VERY good post man by his senior year, and I have heard some people say that Henry wasn't bad by his senior year.

You won't know about EO until he gets some serious playing time.

I agree with Dave.

[wufan]

Yea, I hate to pile on, but EO is a spot I would love to have back. He holds an unofficial NCAA Division I record of most pages (143+) on a fan board.

Come on, what a disappointment. His lacking on offense and natural instinct for the game is too much to overcome with athletisism, rebounding & block shots.

With all the hoopla, energy and excitment that surrounded him three years ago, what we have seen is simply not worth it.

I would ask everyone on this board "With what was advertised with EO did we expect him to be further in his progress at this point in his development?"

I agree however, you gotta roll the dice. As a non-BCS program trying to stay relevant and competitive on the national scene, I don't have a problem with them trying to find a diamond in the rough. GM has said it himself that he tries to recruit guys that are under the radar and can be developed into good players in college.

You win some and you lose some. I have more of a problem of guys that were recruited like Kenny M and J Hamilton that were potential MVC All-Stars not panning out.

You could have said the same thing about Henry Carr, Tom Kosich, and even Zarko their first year or two. Zarko turned into a VERY good post man by his senior year, and I have heard some people say that Henry wasn't bad by his senior year.

You won't know about EO until he gets some serious playing time.

I agree with Dave.

Me too. Troy Mack is another one you could add to the list for his first 4 years in college. Nice RS senior season though!