Sexton calls Coy's Dad

[shockfan89_]

I'm not saying he should have retained his scholarship I am saying his books shouldn't have been taken away. He could pay the basketball program for his books and keep them. Then it would be a wash. He paid for his own books so no money from the basketball program went to his books. There is absolutely NO JUSTIFICATION for a student going without his books for a week because of these unfortunate events.

Maybe you missed my post or you just pick and choose what you want (which often seems to be what you do) but I said I like HCGM and think he is the right choice for WSU!!!!!!!!!! I have no agenda against HCGM other than to hold him to the same standard that other coaches are held which seems very reasonable.

[shockfan89_]

Could we stop ---- please.

Again why?

Shox21 - I respect your opinion on most things but I don't understand how people commenting on this situation hurts anything? Please send me a private message if you don't wish to post it on the site.

Coy's family was berated for being thin skinned. While I would agree it is probably not a good idea for family members to post on here, it appears many others are very thin skinned when it comes to a certain program? Just curious as to why?

[SB Shock]

There is absolutely NO JUSTIFICATION for a student going without his books for a week because of these unfortunate events.

Did you ever attend college? Then you know this is not an issue. Like anything really happens in school in the first week of september. Also if there was something going on I can give you plenty of workarounds.

I have no agenda against HCGM other than to hold him to the same standard that other coaches are held to which seems very reasonable.

Like the standards that Gene Stephenson has been held to?

[shockfan89_]

There is absolutely NO JUSTIFICATION for a student going without his books for a week because of these unfortunate events.

Did you ever attend college? Then you know this is not an issue. Like anything really happens in school in the first week of september. Also if there was something going on I can give you plenty of workarounds.

I have no agenda against HCGM other than to hold him to the same standard that other coaches are held to which seems very reasonable.

Like the standards that Gene Stephenson has been held to?

Yes, I actually attended college on a sports scholarship and my roommate my freshmen year quit and didn't have his books taken away even though he was no longer on scholarship. The NCAA could have easily changed this since then, but I actually do have something I am basing my opinion on.

Thanks for your comment because now it is clear who has the agenda...

[SB Shock]

There is absolutely NO JUSTIFICATION for a student going without his books for a week because of these unfortunate events.

Did you ever attend college? Then you know this is not an issue. Like anything really happens in school in the first week of september. Also if there was something going on I can give you plenty of workarounds.

I have no agenda against HCGM other than to hold him to the same standard that other coaches are held to which seems very reasonable.

Like the standards that Gene Stephenson has been held to?

Yes, I actually attended college on a sports scholarship and my roommate my freshmen year quit and didn't have his books taken away even though he was no longer on scholarship. The NCAA could have easily changed this since then, but I actually do have something I am basing my opinion on.

Thanks for your comment because now it is clear who has the agenda...

No clearly you have the agenda, as you continue to beat a dead horse. You keep beating, and beating. Also, there is a difference between the situation you just described.

The situation you described is totally different. I'm really at a loss at why you can't understand how Coy circumstances wouldn't require any compensation be taken back except for saying something that would come across as a personal attack.

Croy had a B-ball scholarship. He quit. But he is also playing baseball that has limited scholarships (and there were none left). If the basketball program just said we don't care - just keep your books, we don't care. Then it would be clear to me that NCAA would investigate WSU because the Baseball program would be getting an unfair advantage over other baseball programs.

Now if Coy quit basketball and also chose to not participate in baseball, then there would be no advantage to any program and nobody will care.

[shockfan89_]

Not beating at all. I asked one question in my initial post and we have gone back and forth discussing everything but the question I asked. :-)

The situation I described is exactly like this one. Maybe you are misunderstanding my point? I am not saying Coy's books should be paid for by the basketball team. I am saying they didn't need to be taken away from him. If he is no longer on a scholarship he should have to pay back the basketball program for his books.

My college roomate actually wrote a check to cover the amount he received, in effect making it so he never received a scholarship for books. That is what I am saying could/should have been done in this case rather than physically taking his books. If you give me something free and then later I pay you the exact amount that it costs, you didn't actually give me anything. You don't have to take back what you gave me and I go out and buy a new one. Does that help?

That is why I am saying it appears it was done out of spite rather than for purposes of not committing an NCAA violation. Add in the fact that everyone wants to just stop talking about it and it appears fishy? That's all I am saying. When things happen with Gene (lately mostly personal and unrelated to coaching) we come on here and talk about it all the time and very few, if any, say we should not discuss it. I asked why the difference?

No agenda, no axe to grind, I honestly don't get why this is so taboo? ShockerFever went on and on about how this was a result of Gene not being able to share time and changing his mind. Nobody accused ShockerFever of having an agenda then and I actually agreed that was probably what happened until it came out that HCGM was the one that, according to family members, changed his mind about what was agreed to and then all of a sudden people are saying we should just drop this and not discuss it anymore?????

[SB Shock]

Not beating at all. I asked one question in my initial post and we have gone back and forth discussing everything but the question I asked. :-)

The situation I described is exactly like this one. Maybe you are misunderstanding my point? I am not saying Coy's books should have been paid for by the basketball team. If he is no longer on a scholarship he should have to pay back the basketball program for his books.

Sorry, I did misunderstand.

My college roomate actually wrote a check to cover the amount he received, in effect making it so he never received a scholarship for books. That is what I am saying could/should have been done in this case rather than physically taking his books. If you give me something free and then later I pay you the exact amount that it costs, you didn't actually give me anything. You don't have to take back what you gave me and I go out and buy a new one. Does that help?

Sure does.

That is why I am saying it appears it was done out of spite rather than for purposes of not committing an NCAA violation. Add in the fact that everyone wants to just stop talking about it and it appears fishy? That's all I am saying. When things happen with Gene (lately mostly personal and unrelated to coaching) we come on here and talk about it all the time and very few, if any, say we should not discuss it. I asked why the difference?

There is no doubt that Marshall did what he did to make a point.

1) In light of the BA article in the summer I have come to the conclusion to me that Coy made the decision to give up Basketball during the summer. BA would not say something like that just out of the blue. If I am coming to that conclusion what do you think Marshall is coming up with?

2) Coy chose to delay giving the bad news to Marshall. Evidently he never has heard the old saying that "Bad news never gets better with time".

Meanwhile Coy has been taking up a basketball scholarship which is very valuable to Marshall because it is part of his livelihood. The honeymoon for Marshall is over starting this year. He's being paid big bucks and if want to continued to be paid this way he needs to put a team on the floor that can get to the post-season. So he got pissed. He complied with the letter of the law. Is there or was there other ways to go about it (such as you what you describe wit your friend?) Probably. But Coy basically took something from Marshall that is very valuable and Marshall got nothing back in return.

My perception of Marshall is he is very loyal to his players (recall what his players/fans at Winthrop thought of him). This is not the picture of a guy that some of have tried to paint Marshall out as a guy just looking after himself. But he does expects that loyalty back. If you violate that trust - you better watch out. Marshall come from blue collar background. He doesn't have a Bill Self or Roy Williams trying to help him along.

No agenda, no axe to grind, I honestly don't get why this is so taboo? ShockerFever went on and on about how this was a result of Gene not being able to share time and changing his mind. Nobody accused him of having an agenda and I actually agreed that was probably what happened until it came out that HCGM was the one that, according to family members, changed his mind about what was agreed to and then all of a sudden people are saying we should just drop this and not discuss it anymore?????

I suspect there some who just don't like seeing WSU dirty laundry air publically and just want the story to go away. I would also suspect that the athletic administration would like the story to end because it does not paint a very pretty picture of college athletics (being a business), also demonstrates that there may be some communication issues and they probably don't appreciate certain family members going public.

Of course I don't know what was or was not promised. But I can not see any scenario where Coy could really have thought when fall came around that basketball wasn't going to be his first priority [maybe that is just me]

IMO Gene probably told Coy that fall ball is important for the preparation for spring ball and that he was not a lock for anything, especially if he was not able to participate in fall ball.

Then when Marshall told him what all his expectations would be and Coy knew in his heart he wanted to play baseball more than basketball and he decided to make the decision he really had made earlier in the summer official.

There is nothing wrong with that - you should follow your passions. Problem is he lead Marshall on for 7-8 months and to not expect Marshall to be angry - well there are consequences for our decisions we make.

Just my opinion.

[shockfan89_]

That all makes perfect sense to me. Sorry for any confusion i caused with my post(s). I can understand being upset at losing a player but I think it would have eventually happened this way anyway. I will try to stop beating this horse now. :D

[SB Shock]

That all makes perfect sense to me. Sorry for any confusion i caused with my post(s).

No problem and please accept my apologies for misreading your intent of what you were trying to say. I understand where you were coming from now.

[shockfan89_]

No problem! :goshocks:

[ShockerGorilla]

Get a room!! :D

[spinner]

Things are so easy to figure out, just call Baseball America, JC has never talked one time to them. Again JC was told by Marshall that there never would be any problems. When basketball started officially in Nov. no baseball.( Does people get that.) Than Marshall changed his 3 man practice time, not team practice to conflict with baseball fall baseball. They can't practice as a team until Nov.(does people get that.) Baseball fall ball was all 30 kids until Nov. No problems for anyone, right. Every thing worked out great. (Do you people get that.) Than Marshall went back on his word so he could not play Baseball in the fall. Every body understand. Johnny was begged to come to WSU, DOES ANYONE REMEMBER? Johnny could have done the workout as long as they were not the same time, was promised there would never be any problems, and there never was for a whole year untill what, Marshall did'nt want him playing baseball. He made Johnny choose, Johnny was alowed to play baseball in summer, talked with Janse the asst. all the time. And last i lied, i said i would never post again. Just like Marshall lied to JC about playing two sports. Would work out any problems. What is worse my lie or his? If Johnny wanted to he could have gotten a baseball scholl. or went some where else last summer, why should he, because he was committed to playing two sports at WSU or aleast trying to. Johnny and his family had no clue about quiting basketball until the speaker phone deal with his brother, his brother than told the rest of his family. As the AD told his dad, Johnny did not one thing wrong. If you people don't get it, i give up. So at least call Baseball America if your interested. Best of luck to everyone. Some of you people can take a hike, like Johnny's brother was told to do, i was told to not let the door hit me on the way out. I guess i left the door open, if anyone needs me just call i will come back to help.

[GoShockers89]

Sounds like you have a bone to pick with Coach Marshall, not the members of this board.

[RoyalShock]

Spinner, unless you are Johnny himself, you only have one side of the story. And it's probably being heavily filtered.

I don't think you are going to convince us that Johnny or someone very close to him didn't talk to Baseball America. They aren't going to just make something like that up. They have nothing to gain from it, but plenty to lose.

And for the record, basketball team practice begins in mid-October, not November.

[7hottamales]

Spinner, unless you are Johnny himself, you only have one side of the story. And it's probably being heavily filtered.

I don't think you are going to convince us that Johnny or someone very close to him didn't talk to Baseball America. They aren't going to just make something like that up. They have nothing to gain from it, but plenty to lose.

And for the record, basketball team practice begins in mid-October, not November.

BA's sources largely consist of scouts. Scouts talk to prospects & coaches. Pretty easy to connect the dots on this.

I feel for Coy as he was obviously mislead to some degree, but basketball would have most likely cost him $ in the long run so while this sucks from a idealistic youthful perspective it's beneficial to him from a business standpoint.