A look ahead

[shock10]

This is a look at our depth by class.

Catcher:

Bob Arens Sr.
Brandon Kimbrel Jr.
Taylor Sanagorski Fr.
Gunnar Troutwine Fr.

Corner Infield:

Chase Rader Jr.
Ryan Tinkham Jr.
Alex VanPelt Fr.*

Middle Infield:

Tanner Kirk Jr.
Jordan Farris Jr.
Willie Schwanke Jr.*
Wes Phillips So.
Adam Thies Fr.*
Trey Vickers Fr.
Jordan Boyer Fr.
Travis Young Fr.

Outfield:

Mikel Mucha Jr.
Tanner Dearman Jr.
Daniel Kihle Jr.*
Jerrik Sigg So.
Michael Burns Fr.
Josh DeBacker Fr.
Bret Fehr Fr.
Keenan Eaton Fr.

RH Pitcher:

Ray Ashford Sr.
T. J. Looney Sr.
Isaac Anderson Jr.
John Farrendelli Jr.
John Hayes Jr.
Sam Tewes So.
Chase Williams So.
Austin Bright Fr.
Tyler Jones Fr.
Taylor Goshen Fr.
Chandler Sanburn Fr.
Matt Whalen Fr.


LH Pitcher:

Sam Hilliard Jr.*
Reagan Biechler So.
Cody Tyler So.
Jeb Bargfeldt Fr.*
Brad Kinsey Fr.

* TWO WAY PLAYER

[tru2thaduce]

Much needed change but I'd rather have seen Brummett stay and Looney go.

[Cdizzle]

No way. Looney is a power arm. Screw Freshman AAs whose father's pitched the team to a national championship.

[KansasShocker]

Lol cdizzle I like you!!

[ShockTalk]

Much needed change but I'd rather have seen Brummett stay and Looney go.

No way. Looney is a power arm. Screw Freshman AAs whose father's pitched the team to a national championship.

So, does anybody really know what happened to Brummett this year?

Also, do we know if Looney will be on a schollie next year or that Brummett could have stayed but left on his own?

[1972Shocker]

Looney was a walk-on this year, so my guess is he will be a walk-on next year as well. We will normally have 8 walk-ons on the roster every year under the current scholarship and roster rules.

I have no idea if Garrett leaving was a player decision or a coach's decision or somewhere in between. Perhaps playing in the big shadow of his Dad's accomplishments added too much stress on the young man. What we do know is he isn't the 1st nor the last to suffer a sophomore jinx or slump although I have no idea what happened to Garrett this year.

What's unfortunate is Garrett and the other underclassmen that are leaving have to sit out a year if they want to continue playing D-1 ball. College baseball (perhaps college sports in general) should probably reconsider that transfer rule. At the very least I think that transfer rule should not apply to any equivalency sport where athletes generally are not receiving anywhere close to a full ride.

[molly jabali]

Looney was a walk-on this year, so my guess is he will be a walk-on next year as well. We will normally have 8 walk-ons on the roster every year under the current scholarship and roster rules.

I have no idea if Garrett leaving was a player decision or a coach's decision or somewhere in between. Perhaps playing in the big shadow of his Dad's accomplishments added to much stress on the young man. What we do know is he isn't the 1st nor the last to suffer a sophomore jinx or slump although I have no idea what happened to Garrett this year.

What's unfortunate is Garrett and the other underclassmen that are leaving have to sit out a year if they want to continue playing D-1 ball. College baseball (perhaps college sports in general) should probably reconsider that transfer rule. At the very least I think that transfer rule should not apply to any equivalency sport where athletes generally are not receiving anywhere close to a full ride.

TOTALLY agree!

[ShockTalk]

Looney was a walk-on this year, so my guess is he will be a walk-on next year as well. We will normally have 8 walk-ons on the roster every year under the current scholarship and roster rules.

I have no idea if Garrett leaving was a player decision or a coach's decision or somewhere in between. Perhaps playing in the big shadow of his Dad's accomplishments added to much stress on the young man. What we do know is he isn't the 1st nor the last to suffer a sophomore jinx or slump although I have no idea what happened to Garrett this year.

What's unfortunate is Garrett and the other underclassmen that are leaving have to sit out a year if they want to continue playing D-1 ball. College baseball (perhaps college sports in general) should probably reconsider that transfer rule. At the very least I think that transfer rule should not apply to any equivalency sport where athletes generally are not receiving anywhere close to a full ride.

Excellent point.

[WSUwatcher]

Actually, the "transfer and sit out" rule is a fairly recent addition to the college baseball landscape, instituted because in the past players could move around freely and it was almost like free agency: guys would move from lesser programs to what they perceived as the big boys (who possibly also did a little quiet encouraging of such moves on the side). There was a real concern about poaching, and the requirement to sit out as in other sports was added to prevent perceived abuse.

So 1972 has a point, especially as it relates to "equivalency sports," but his preferred system has been tried and found wanting, too. One could argue that poaching can still occur, and one can also look at college basketball (which has had the requirement to sit out all along, although it's now being weakened by waivers and by exceptions) and say that requiring transfers to sit out doesn't really solve the poaching problem. If anything, it's probably worse than ever in basketball -- perhaps partly because the requirement to sit out has been weakened by loopholes?

It's really just a matter of which flaw in the system gets the most emphasis. But there's no doubt that a guy like Brummett comes out on the short end if he wants to play and get some scholarship assistance while he does. As someone else said, at least in Brummett's case, the real mystery is, what the heck happened?

[Iamsecond]

I have a couple of questions: Shock10, how do you know the next year's depth as you have stated in the above post? Did you compile the list from the media releases of signed players and research their positions?
Second...the transfer rule, does anyone know if the "sitting out" for a year applies to everyone that leaves even the players that were cut from the team by the coach? I would think a player should be able to go and play where ever they wanted to if they were cut from the program and not have to sit out a year....in the case of Brummett, if he was cut by HCTB (and I have NO reason nor knowledge that he was cut), but if he was, can he go on to any school he chooses and play? Thank you for educating me

[WstateU]

Does anyone seriously believe HCTB "cut" the son of this guy? Whatever you're smoking, please send me a PM; I want some!

[xazshox]

Next Year's Depth

Iamssecond, the depth provided by Shock10 has also been posted by 1972Shocker although he did not divide it up by position as Shock10 did. I also kept track of al of this via the various press releases that came out over a period of many months & I agree with all of it. There may be a few minor disagreements with how Shock10 arranged the players by position. For example, I tend to think that Alex Van Pelt, a 6-4 player who can play 1st base as Shock10 listed him, can also pitch. I tend to think he will probably be tried as a pitcher first particularly since he is a LHP. Regardless of that, the way Shock10 arranged all the players by position gives the reader a pretty good idea that Butler & his staff have all the positions covered pretty well. The media releases also gave a brief amount of background on each player in terms of their size, their stats & the positions they played in high school or at a community college.

As for your question about the transfer rule, I can't answer that one. As far as I know, any player who transfers from a Div 1 school to another Div 1 school has to lay out a year. If a player transfers to a lower div school, I don't think they have to lay out a year. Regardless, I'm pretty sure that they need to graduate from somewhere because that will be counted against the WSU APR value. My understanding is that each WSU recruit has 6 yrs to graduate even if it is from a different institution because that will somehow be part of the WSU APR calculation. I'm sure someone here can explain that better than I can.

I have never heard of a player being cut and still being able to play somewhere else the following year if it is a Div 1 school. Players may leave of their own accord and that has happened over the years at WSU, too. We eventually hear where they end up at some other school. I doubt it there is a difference between being cut and leaving of one's own accord, but perhaps another reader here can clarify that point.

[1972Shocker]

It does not matter whether you were cut or you left voluntarily. If you transfer from one D-1 school to another D-1 school you have to sit out a year unless you obtain a waiver from the NCAA for special considerations such as being closer to home due to a parent having serious medical issues.

If you are cut, I doubt you would have any issue obtaining a scholarship release from the school that cut you. If you leave voluntarily you might have an issue getting such a release or the release will contain certain stipulations about which schools you can transfer to. The great majority of times these releases are granted and you never hear about them.

Without the release you can still transfer to another D-1 school but not only do you have to sit out a year you also can not be on an athletic scholarship for 1 year.

K-State recently received a lot of negative press when they would not grant a scholarship release to Leticia Romero who wanted to leave K-State after they fired Deb Patterson. K-State finally backed down and granted her a conditional release (she can't transfer to any other Big 12 team). You can follow this saga in the Wichita Eagle a www.kansas.com

Edit: To clarify Romero can transfer to another Big 12 team. If she does she not only has to sit out a year but she can not be on scholarship for that year. If she transfers to any non-Big 12 school she still has to sit out a year but she can be on scholarship for that year.

The main reason scholarship releases are withheld is usually when a school thinks another school has tampered with the player in question. However, there have been cases where a Coach/School just gets pissed about a player leaving and take a revengeful attitude.

[1972Shocker]

Iamssecond, the depth provided by Shock10 has also been posted by 1972Shocker although he did not divide it up by position as Shock10 did. I also kept track of al of this via the various press releases that came out over a period of many months & I agree with all of it. There may be a few minor disagreements with how Shock10 arranged the players by position. For example, I tend to think that Alex Van Pelt, a 6-4 player who can play 1st base as Shock10 listed him, can also pitch. I tend to think he will probably be tried as a pitcher first particularly since he is a LHP. Regardless of that, the way Shock10 arranged all the players by position gives the reader a pretty good idea that Butler & his staff have all the positions covered pretty well. The media releases also gave a brief amount of background on each player in terms of their size, their stats & the positions they played in high school or at a community college.

I agree that @shock10: did a good job with his list. Just keep in mind that this list is still contingent upon what happens with the MLB Draft and players signing pro contracts. This years Draft is held on June 5-7 and includes 40 rounds plus some supplemental picks. Pro contracts must be signed and in place by July 18th. So there still may be some tweaking that takes place.

[shock10]

I have a couple of questions: Shock10, how do you know the next year's depth as you have stated in the above post? Did you compile the list from the media releases of signed players and research their positions?
Second...the transfer rule, does anyone know if the "sitting out" for a year applies to everyone that leaves even the players that were cut from the team by the coach? I would think a player should be able to go and play where ever they wanted to if they were cut from the program and not have to sit out a year....in the case of Brummett, if he was cut by HCTB (and I have NO reason nor knowledge that he was cut), but if he was, can he go on to any school he chooses and play? Thank you for educating me

Iamsecond Yes I compiled my list from the Wichita Eagle and go shocker.com and 72 It is more to show how young this team will be. Two seniors Twelve Juniors 14 out of 36 it will be a young team. Also * shows they are TWO WAY PLAYERS. As far as transfer rules???? Don't drag me in some thing I know nothing about.