At-large chances

[ShockerFever]

So is SWOMO more deserving to go to the tournament than WSU? SWOMO has a 15-2 conference record?

RPI - WSU 28, SWOMO 44
Tier 1 Record - WSU 7-11, SWOMO 1-7
Tier 2 Record - WSU 6-4, SWOMO 11-3
Tier 3 Record - WSU 8-2, SWOMO 7-1
Tier 4 Record - WSU 11-0, SWOMO 13-3

If WSU was playing in the MVC - I think they roll through the league.

There will be some teams that will be selected to go to the tournament with sub 0.500 records. The NCAA selection criteria are to look at the full body of work. If WSU is one of them, good for them, the move to the AAC paid off. That is the benefits of playing in a major conference.

The key thing is you have to find a way to get to the NCAA tournament because you never know when a team will put it all together and make a post-season run.

Aargh pretty much called you out, but that was bad. Everything we've complained about for eternity now all of a sudden gets flipped to benefit us. Looks very, very hypocritical.

You can break down WSU's tier wins all you want, but they can't win on weekends when it matters the most. WSU's RPI is inflated because they play in a very good conference with very good teams, of which they can't beat in a 3-game series. They also benefited by beating up a bunch of patsies in the non-con (minus the midweek games) and have a very gaudy non-con record to show for it. Look at their non-con SOS. It's not very good at all.

lol, you think they "roll" through the Valley? A conference where they've finished bottom half more times than not through the Butler regime? Are you sure about that? I mean, yah, there's a lot of patsies there to beat up, but does that make WSU a better team?

WGAF about Missouri State or the Valley anymore? It's about the AAC and how WSU is performing in it. They are flunking with flying colors and aren't even an NCAA at-large worthy team. In year FIVE. STOP making excuses for this crap. It's over with. And Boatright better be scribbling out a short list of candidates as we speak.

[BOBB]

Is there a dislike because too true button?

[Play Angry]

Today was an odd outcome and provides little closure in either direction. Shockers will need to sweep Memphis to keep hopes alive.

[C0|dB|00ded]

Rational thinking on the issue found closure in game #2 of the USF series. Today's events just provided a confirming nod from the gods. The Mini-B experiment has been a disaster. It's time to quietly fold our hands and wait now.


T


...:cool:

[Play Angry]

Eh, like it or not, our resume remains in play for a bid at this point. We still stack up favorably versus a lot of bubble teams - a quick glance at Nitty Gritty sheets bears this out.

A 2-2 week probably torpedoes those hopes. 3-1 (with a sweep of Memphis) keeps them on life support heading into Florida. 4-0 puts us in a position where we may be bubble-in heading into the postseason.

It is what it is. Still unresolved.

[SB Shock]

Aargh pretty much called you out, but that was bad. Everything we've complained about for eternity now all of a sudden gets flipped to benefit us. Looks very, very hypocritical.

All I care about what happens with WSU. I don't care what happens anywhere else.

You can break down WSU's tier wins all you want, but they can't win on weekends when it matters the most. WSU's RPI is inflated because they play in a very good conference with very good teams, of which they can't beat in a 3-game series. They also benefited by beating up a bunch of patsies in the non-con (minus the midweek games) and have a very gaudy non-con record to show for it. Look at their non-con SOS. It's not very good at all.

The breakdown is what the NCAA selection committee will look at. WSU has their warts, but the teams they will be competing against for the at-large bids will have their own warts. WSU non-con SOS is not great, but it not terrible either. A third of the teams ahead of them in RPI have worse non-conference SOS.

WSU conference finish will be their biggest wart. How big will be determined probably by how they do at Memphis and in the AAC tournament.

They are flunking with flying colors and aren't even an NCAA at-large worthy team. In year FIVE. STOP making excuses for this crap. It's over with. And Boatright better be scribbling out a short list of candidates as we speak.

I don't think Butler will be fired. Maybe if WSU didn't make the AAC tournament, but the tie today gets them into the AAC tournament. My only hope is that Butler seeks another job after the season.

[SB Shock]

Today was an odd outcome and provides little closure in either direction. Shockers will need to sweep Memphis to keep hopes alive.

It did secure the participation in the AAC tournament.

[ShockTalk]

Well, when reading that, I thought we were back in the MVC. Where's are ribbon?

[ShockerFever]

All I care about what happens with WSU. I don't care what happens anywhere else.



The breakdown is what the NCAA selection committee will look at. WSU has their warts, but the teams they will be competing against for the at-large bids will have their own warts. WSU non-con SOS is not great, but it not terrible either. A third of the teams ahead of them in RPI have worse non-conference SOS.



I don't think Butler will be fired. Maybe if WSU didn't make the AAC tournament, but the tie today gets them into the AAC tournament.

All of your points are alarming.

Ok, so you don't care if you're a hypocrite. That's fine.

Why don't we throw some bubble resumes out there then? WSU has not won a SINGLE weekend series against a team with a pulse. Not ONE. Baseball America bases their rankings on weekend series so don't get mad at me when I point that out. Your weekend series are indicative of what will happen in an NCAA regional. Their best against your best. Our best hasn't held up at all.

You don't think Butler will be fired? You're saying WSU's expectations now are just to make the AAC Tournament (8th place out of 9 teams)? Are you f****** kidding me? In year FIVE? With his supposed best lineup EVER?

That's insanely pathetic.

[ShockerFever]

It did secure the participation in the AAC tournament.

Well let's bring out the champagne and caviar. WOOOOOOOOOO!!!1!!1

[SB Shock]

Why don't we throw some bubble resumes out there then? WSU has not won a SINGLE weekend series against a team with a pulse. Not ONE. Baseball America bases their rankings on weekend series so don't get mad at me when I point that out. Your weekend series are indicative of what will happen in an NCAA regional. Their best against your best. Our best hasn't held up at all.

You could pull Louisville, Vandy or Mississippi State resume Each have some similiar but different warts and are projected No. 3 seeds.

Louisville

RPI: 26
Non-SOS: 206
Tier I: 8-9
Tier 2: 6-5
Tier 3: 9-0
Tier 4: 14-1

Their only conference series they won against good competition was UNC (2-1). They lost all their other good conference series. Luckily for them they have some bad teams in their conference they could beat up on.

Mississippi State
Record: 27-24
Conference Record: 11-15
RPI: 39
Non-Conf SOS: 142
Tier 1: 13-15
Tier 2: 7-4
Tier 3: 0-2
Tier 4: 9-5

They are barely above 0.500 for the year.

You don't think Butler will be fired? You're saying WSU's expectations now are just to make the AAC Tournament (8th place out of 9 teams)? Are you f****** kidding me? In year FIVE? With his supposed best lineup EVER?

That's insanely pathetic.

WSU playing a top 25 team in an important conference must win series and attendance was 2504, 2276, 1713. I don't believe there are any expectation for this program any more.

[ShockerFever]

You could pull Louisville, Vandy or Mississippi State resume Each have some similiar but different warts and are projected No. 3 seeds.

Louisville

RPI: 26
Non-SOS: 206
Tier I: 8-9
Tier 2: 6-5
Tier 3: 9-0
Tier 4: 14-1

Their only conference series they won against good competition was UNC (2-1). They lost all their other good conference series. Luckily for them they have some bad teams in their conference they could beat up on.

Mississippi State
Record: 27-24
Conference Record: 11-15
RPI: 39
Non-Conf SOS: 142
Tier 1: 13-15
Tier 2: 7-4
Tier 3: 0-2
Tier 4: 9-5

They are barely above 0.500 for the year.



WSU playing a top 25 team in an important conference must win series and attendance was 2504, 2276, 1713. I don't believe there are any expectation for this program any more.

Uh, you're joking right? Louisville beating #3 North Carolina in a weekend series is WAY better than anything WSU has accomplished. UL > WSU
And with Mississippi State. They are borderline. I personally wouldn't have them in. BUT, they beat #9 Ole Miss in a weekend series and SWEPT #5 Arkansas in a weekend series. That blows WSU out of the water in terms of comparisons. Once again, MSU > WSU.

Next?

[ShockTalk]

WSU playing a top 25 team in an important conference must win series and attendance was 2504, 2276, 1713. I don't believe there are any expectation for this program any more.

Not true. I don't believe there are any expectations for Butler's program any more. He got a high paying contract and fans expected results in 3-4 years minimum.

His teams will now need to do something that will bring people back.

I guarantee you if a former Shocker takes over, regardless of what teams have done in the past, the fans will come out.

[Aargh]

For fan perception, WSU hiring Standiford or Hooper would be like Memphis hiring Hardaway, except that Tubby had a much better year in basketball than Butler had in baseball. And Standiford and Hooper both have a lot more relevant experience than Hardaway.

[Shockm]

For fan perception, WSU hiring Standiford or Hooper would be like Memphis hiring Hardaway, except that Tubby had a much better year in basketball than Butler had in baseball. And Standiford and Hooper both have a lot more relevant experience than Hardaway.

Hooper's the only coach I'd get behind. Well Wedge would be my first choice (if swinging for the fences), but he isn't interested. Neither have proven themselves as a Division 1 coach (with recruiting responsibilities) but they have been coaches on high levels. Standiford was a great player but he hasn't proven himself as a coach of a high level program. NAIA ready isn't what we need.

However, unless a high level donor (someone who really makes a difference) gets to Boatright, nothing is going to happen (SB is right). You are just living in a "dreamworld".

[Aargh]

...
However, unless a high level donor (someone who really makes a difference) gets to Boatright, nothing is going to happen (SB is right). You are just living in a "dreamworld".

So, what you're saying is that unless someone who can financially affect the athletic department insists that Butler be replaced, finishing 8th in a 9-team league with the best team we've had in 5 years is good enough.

That's giving Butler more rope than Missouri State gave Paul Lusk. We chuckled up our sleeves at the miserable state Lusk took MSU to, but when it's our guy, we're supposed to expect more mediocre results than Missouri State would accept in their basketball program?

We have the baseball equivalent of Scott Thompson as our baseball coach, but since he's our guy we're supposed to be good with that? Have you no pride? Seems like not an ounce of pride in the program. What else could explain accepting the state the program has fallen to?

[C0|dB|00ded]

Hooper's the only coach I'd get behind. Well Wedge would be my first choice (if swinging for the fences), but he isn't interested. Neither have proven themselves as a Division 1 coach (with recruiting responsibilities) but they have been coaches on high levels. Standiford was a great player but he hasn't proven himself as a coach of a high level program. NAIA ready isn't what we need.

However, unless a high level donor (someone who really makes a difference) gets to Boatright, nothing is going to happen (SB is right). You are just living in a "dreamworld".

Posts like these get my blood pumpin'! What's Wedge making in his player development position? Any chance he could be lured back to Wichita with the primary motivation being a shot at a national championship and coaching in front of a packed house?

What about hiring Gene back and giving him a player development title. He's relentless in teaching the fundamentals. That would get him in the dugout for games and potentially mend a great Shocker's broken spirit.

Should Brent get an interview?

Hooper should be near the top of the list.


T


...:cool:

[1972Shocker]

I don't think it is a matter or pride. I think it is mostly a matter of $640,000. Now I think an argument could be made that we could recover that buyout fairly rapidly with increased revenues with the right hire but there is no assurance of that. This is where maybe the deep pocketed boosters come in to play and while we have a boatload of them willing to step up for men's basketball not sure the same is true for our baseball program at the current time.

I really don't know how much of a financial impact the transition to the AAC has had but it has had to be significant and that could play a part as well in how palatable a $640,000 buyout would be right now.

And if the Shockers catch fire in the AAC Tournaent and win the thing you are probably not going to get a buyout anyway.

I just hope that if that happens and they decide to grant a contract extension to Coach Butler for recruiting purposes that they include a reasonable buyout provision that would kick in at the end of next year.

[WuDrWu]

I said a couple of weeks ago that I was going to stay out of these arguments for a variety of reasons. I've tried for the most part.

Everyone is entitled to their opinion.

Anyone that thinks Gene or Brent or anything remotely resembling the 80s and 90s needs to have their heads examined. Not happening folks, and if you want someone to blame, then look in the mirror and blame your freaking self because we are losing the baseball arms race and it's because of lack of support. You want better? Open your wallet BEFORE we go to CWS, not after. That's how it works.

Most hear really don't have a particularly good grasp on college athletics.

I've had a great time watching and supporting this program this year. I feel that they've taken a big step forward. Did they max out, so to speak? Clearly no. Is the season over? Clearly no.

I will continue to support them until the season is over.

Am I concerned about the future? Of course. But I have complete confidence that ADDB will do what's best for WSU and WSU Baseball.

Go Shox and go HCTB!