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  • #61
    Lets not forget, this downward spiral started the day Gene and Brent put on OU jerseys.

    We should not have taken them back. That is on JS.
    • Likes 3

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    • C0|dB|00ded
      #61.1
      C0|dB|00ded commented
      May 28, 2018, 02:53 PM
      Editing a comment
      Hindsight is 20/20 on that one. I was beside myself when Gene went to OU - elated when he returned.


      T


      ...:cool:
      • Likes 1
    • WuShock16
      #61.2
      WuShock16 commented
      May 28, 2018, 02:53 PM
      Editing a comment
      Rumor has it that Schaus was on vacation and that Gene went to Don Beggs to ask for his job back. Had Schaus not been on vacation, he probably wouldn’t have taken Gene back.
    • C0|dB|00ded
      #61.3
      C0|dB|00ded commented
      May 28, 2018, 05:16 PM
      Editing a comment
      In Schaus we Trust!


      T


      ...:cool:
  • #62
    There were plenty of reasons to make a change from Gene. The fact that Butler has not been a good hire doesn't mean that Gene should have been retained. These are not mutually exclusive things . . .
    • Likes 6

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    • WuShock16
      #62.1
      WuShock16 commented
      May 28, 2018, 02:54 PM
      Editing a comment
      Could you say this a little louder for those sitting in the back?
    • ShockTalk
      #62.2
      ShockTalk commented
      May 28, 2018, 04:29 PM
      Editing a comment
      Amazing isn't it.
    • Sam Axe
      #62.3
      Sam Axe commented
      May 28, 2018, 06:29 PM
      Editing a comment
      So true
  • #63
    Originally posted by ABC View Post
    There were plenty of reasons to make a change from Gene. The fact that Butler has not been a good hire doesn't mean that Gene should have been retained. These are not mutually exclusive things . . .
    Nor does it mean Gene should be used as an excuse to retain Butler.
    • Likes 2

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    • #64
      Originally posted by Downtown Shocker Brown View Post
      Lets not forget, this downward spiral started the day Gene and Brent put on OU jerseys.

      We should not have taken them back. That is on JS.
      Wake me up when we start another downward spiral by hosting a Super Regional.

      I guess downward spirals are only possible if you aren't already on the ground.
      • Likes 5

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      • ShockTalk
        #64.1
        ShockTalk commented
        May 28, 2018, 04:41 PM
        Editing a comment
        Gene's quality freshmen and sophomores were already in place before he took the OU job. The depth and quality level of recruits didn't become noticeable until those classes were gone. So, in a way, the downward spiral had started, it just wasn't as easily noticeable until later.
    • #65
      Originally posted by Cdizzle View Post

      Wake me up when we start another downward spiral by hosting a Super Regional.

      I guess downward spirals are only possible if you aren't already on the ground.
      That group was already intact for 2007/2008. Dirks, Gillespie, Schafer and company. If we had new blood at the time, then we might have been able to continue. But starting after that group left (draft/graduation) We have not been at large worthy a single time. The two times since then we made the tournament was due to winning MVC Tourney. Thats it. And one of those doesn’t count.
      • Likes 1

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      • 1972Shocker
        #65.1
        1972Shocker commented
        May 28, 2018, 03:58 PM
        Editing a comment
        One of those may not count in the NCAA record book due to a rules viloation that had lttle, if anything, to do wiht on the field perfourmance. So yes, technically, it doesn't "count" but actually it did happen. Granted Gene was in charge but that's an issue apart from on the field performance.
        Last edited by 1972Shocker; May 28, 2018, 04:10 PM.
      • ShockTalk
        #65.2
        ShockTalk commented
        May 28, 2018, 04:48 PM
        Editing a comment
        But it was one of several other issues. Again, I just wish others would quit bringing up something that has no relevance with our problem at hand. It solves nothing. It would appear that Gene and WSU have buried the hatchet and we should do the same.
        • Likes 1
    • #66
      Originally posted by Downtown Shocker Brown View Post

      That group was already intact for 2007/2008. Dirks, Gillespie, Schafer and company. If we had new blood at the time, then we might have been able to continue. But starting after that group left (draft/graduation) We have not been at large worthy a single time. The two times since then we made the tournament was due to winning MVC Tourney. Thats it. And one of those doesn’t count.
      Right. Everybody is terrible if you eliminate all of their accomplishments. Regardless, we really don't need to rehash this narrative for the umpteenth time because it is irrelevant to the current situation.
      • Likes 2

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      • #67
        Originally posted by Cdizzle View Post

        Right. Everybody is terrible if you eliminate all of their accomplishments. Regardless, we really don't need to rehash this narrative for the umpteenth time because it is irrelevant to the current situation.
        What is relevant is whether a 7th place finish in a 9-team league is acceptable. To throw in some context, that seventh-place finish was accomplished with some first-round draft talent, a lot of seniors, and the best team in the Butler era.

        So, is the best team Butler has ever put on a field (and what is thought to be a significantly better team than he will field next year) finishing 7th (through the benefits of a tie and a cancelled game) acceptable? If Butler is retained and next year's team is not as good as this year's team, then does finishing 8th or 9th become acceptable?

        Or should we give him another chance. Who knows whether the underclassmen who couldn't win games this year might become first-round picks next year. Maybe hoping that the younger players become super studs over the summer is now acceptable as the best we can do.
        The future's so bright - I gotta wear shades.
        We like to cut down nets and get sized for championship rings.
        • Likes 1

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        • #68
          Originally posted by Cdizzle View Post

          Right. Everybody is terrible if you eliminate all of their accomplishments. Regardless, we really don't need to rehash this narrative for the umpteenth time because it is irrelevant to the current situation.
          Agreed. Obviously financial considerations for the athletic department may be a consideration but I don't think any of us have enough details to make an informed opinion on that. Otherwise, it's a decision that comes down to who do you think is the best person to lead Shocker baseball going forward. My personal belief is that Todd Butler is not the best option for that. His track record certainly doesn't provide much evidence that he is the best person for the job.

          We will just have to see what ADDBs' belief is with the understanding that such belief could be significantly influenced by the financial details he is privy to.
          • Likes 1

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          • shockfan89_
            #68.1
            shockfan89_ commented
            May 28, 2018, 04:28 PM
            Editing a comment
            The financial issues would be non-existent if Hooper or Standiford were the next coach. To me that is just an excuse. It sucks that fADES put us in the situation, but there is an easy solution to the problem.
            • Likes 1
        • #69
          With the WSU AD's silence, I guess 7th place finishes and never making the ncaa's is the new acceptable.
          • Likes 1

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          • #70
            Originally posted by shocker3 View Post
            With the WSU AD's silence, I guess 7th place finishes and never making the ncaa's is the new acceptable.
            Do you really think the AD was going to make an announcement about his on Memorial Day? I certainly would be surprised if he had.

            Comment

            • C0|dB|00ded
              #70.1
              C0|dB|00ded commented
              May 28, 2018, 05:14 PM
              Editing a comment
              The NCAA selection committee didn't take a day off for the holidays. Should the athletic department? I guess they could have considering Wichita State's baseball season ended last week.

              There comes a point in time where our focus will shift from Todd Butler to Darron Boatright in regards to who needs firing...


              T


              ...:cool:
              • Likes 1
          • #71
            Originally posted by 1972Shocker View Post

            Do you really think the AD was going to make an announcement about his on Memorial Day? I certainly would be surprised if he had.
            The sooner he makes the change the better.
            • Likes 1

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            • 1972Shocker
              #71.1
              1972Shocker commented
              May 28, 2018, 05:01 PM
              Editing a comment
              That's fine but still it is Memorial Day and the probablity of hearing anything about this from the WSU AD were and are quite low IMO.
              • Likes 1
          • #72
            Originally posted by ABC View Post
            The list of programs that have just made the NCAA tournament in the last five years would make us all weep like children.
            Dallas Baptist has made it five straight years. They are division 2 in all sports except baseball. We are 0/5, they are 5/5 in last five years.
            Last edited by shocker3; May 28, 2018, 06:13 PM.
            • Likes 2

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            • C0|dB|00ded
              #72.1
              C0|dB|00ded commented
              May 28, 2018, 05:19 PM
              Editing a comment
              Stop trolling S3... FML


              T


              ...:cool:
            • AndShock
              #72.2
              AndShock commented
              May 28, 2018, 06:49 PM
              Editing a comment
              Too bad we couldn’t grab their coach.
            • SB Shock
              #72.3
              SB Shock commented
              May 28, 2018, 07:05 PM
              Editing a comment
              Dbu coach was the #1 target. But he turned WSU down.
          • #73
            Can someone list the murderer's row of at-large teams to this year's NCAA tourney?

            Comment

            • #74
              Originally posted by Downtown Shocker Brown View Post

              That group was already intact for 2007/2008. Dirks, Gillespie, Schafer and company. If we had new blood at the time, then we might have been able to continue. But starting after that group left (draft/graduation) We have not been at large worthy a single time. The two times since then we made the tournament was due to winning MVC Tourney. Thats it. And one of those doesn’t count.
              I'm not sure what Gene has to do with the present, but Gene's worst teams at the end of his reign were still better than Butler's *best* teams.. EVER. Let that sink in.

              And then pinning that on Jim Schaus? Really?


              You're a strange one. You defended Butler for everything he did until about 12 hours ago. You appear to not be a Jim Schaus fan. I'm not sure what you have said on record in regards to Eric Sexton but I'm sure he's on some kind of pedestal. And you also believe that WSU should accept the fact that since they aren't in the SEC, they'll never be relevant in baseball again.

              Did I get all of that correctly?
              Deuces Valley.
              ... No really, deuces.
              ________________
              "Enjoy the ride."

              - a smart man

              Comment

              • ShockTalk
                #74.1
                ShockTalk commented
                May 28, 2018, 09:09 PM
                Editing a comment
                DSB only commented on Gene because of someone else's post and I agree totally with his statement up to the last sentence and that is really not important one way or the other. Nevertheless, Gene has nothing to do with Butler's problems.

                Regarding JS, Gene was rehired during his watch. However, I, too, like WuShock16, heard that he was out of town at the time and that Beggs did the rehiring. Again, this has nothing to with Butler now, but I thought that was a mistake at the time and won't get back into that discussion.

                IMO, DSB's comments have been not so much been defending Butler, but supporting the players. I think he also preferred to wait until the end of the season before coming to his decision regarding his position on Butler.
            • #75
              Originally posted by ABC View Post
              Can someone list the murderer's row of at-large teams to this year's NCAA tourney?
              Northeastern, Tennessee Tech, and Dallas Baptist for starters.
              Deuces Valley.
              ... No really, deuces.
              ________________
              "Enjoy the ride."

              - a smart man

              Comment

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