Charlottesville riots

[Awesome Sauce Malone]

This is all bad. But there are some people that want to rewrite history. .

Removal of statues does not equate to rewriting history. Not only is that argument poorly thought out its literally demeaning to peoples intelligence.

[Aargh]

I spent part of my military training at Ft. Lee in Virginia. Robert E. Lee was considered a hero there. Tributes to him were everywhere. That was Nam era, and then it was still just considered one of the things that was done in Virginia.

I can see how tributes to Lee cause some problems by reminding people of things that don't need to be dwelled upon.

It was interesting to observe the various attitudes regarding race back then, which was less than a decade removed from the Civil Rights movements. Guys from the South swore that black people were better off in the South than the North. In the South they knew their place, which kept them out of trouble. They also said that in the North blacks weren't thought of any better - they were just led to believe they were equal to whites and that got them into all kinds of trouble.

[wufan]

I spent part of my military training at Ft. Lee in Virginia. Robert E. Lee was considered a hero there. Tributes to him were everywhere. That was Nam era, and then it was still just considered one of the things that was done in Virginia.

I can see how tributes to Lee cause some problems by reminding people of things that don't need to be dwelled upon.

It was interesting to observe the various attitudes regarding race back then, which was less than a decade removed from the Civil Rights movements. Guys from the South swore that black people were better off in the South than the North. In the South they knew their place, which kept them out of trouble. They also said that in the North blacks weren't thought of any better - they were just led to believe they were equal to whites and that got them into all kinds of trouble.

I don't have a lot of knowledge about 1970s era racial tension, but the northern cities of then and today are very segregated by neighborhood...Baltimore, D.C., Detroit, Chicago, and Milwaukee are still places where you can guess race by zip code.

[ShockingButTrue]

Eh, sensitivities dictated that commemoration was a necessity when the wounds of lost love ones were still fresh for decades after the Civil War. We are now 150+ years removed - I don't see the need for tears for removal of statues dedicated to the memory of the losing side in a treasonous revolution, fought with the defense of slavery as a primary cause, which resulted in a little under 1 million American deaths. No living soul knew anyone who perished in the conflict.

The federal government is not forcing the removal of these items - it is being decided at the local and state levels. I have little empathy for angst and distress over these removals - the South did not receive a blue participation ribbons for its efforts, it lost in devastating fashion, and the treatment it received following the conflict was beyond magnanimous by nearly all historical comparisons.

I don't think anyone wants to erase this page from history books. However, if towns, cities and states wish to halt the hero worship for the leaders of a lost cause, they should be able to do so without threat of violence.

Pardon me, and please don't read more into it than you normally would, but didn't these woefully misguided (see?) sentimentalist's have a permit to gather at a public location? Is this group of -stonewalled- dullards (again) not allowed 1st amendment privileges? What kind of an idiot would think these people represent an ideology capable of victory at a ballot box? BUT, it's the people who would try to suppress freedom of speech, through moral superiority -because two wrongs don't make it right (savvy?)- that might end up with this guy in 2020 instead of Harris:



Scary huh?

[Play Angry]

Pretty sure that's called jumping the shark.

[pinstripers]

OK, been reading articles and still haven't found out what actually happened.

[Aargh]

Pardon me, and please don't read more into it than you normally would, but didn't these woefully misguided (see?) sentimentalist's have a permit to gather at a public location? Is this group of -stonewalled- dullards (again) not allowed 1st amendment privileges? What kind of an idiot would think these people represent an ideology capable of victory at a ballot box? BUT, it's the people who would try to suppress freedom of speech, through moral superiority -because two wrongs don't make it right (savvy?)- that might end up with this guy in 2020 instead of Harris:



Scary huh?

Can't tell if sober.

[wufan]

OK, been reading articles and still haven't found out what actually happened.

A group of protesters, made up to some degree of alt-right, white nationalists, and perhaps neo-nazis, were protesting the removal of a statue of Robert E Lee feom a park. There was an altercation with counter protesters, made up to some degree with AntiFa. The protest was moved after the altercation to a new, larger park. The counter protesters were in the street nearby when a vehicle was driven into the crowd.

1 was killed and several more were injured. A police helicopter that was monitoring the situation crashed killing both pilots.

Trump condemned the hate and violence in both sides.

[Play Angry]

This was the 3rd protest in the span of 2 months in Charlottesvile organized by KKK affiliated groups, this one under the banner of "Unite the Right". David Duke and Richard Spencer were its most well known and visible leaders. The weekend began with a torch bearing march of a little more than a hundred white supremacists which reportedly culminated in a group of onlookers and counterprotesters being beaten in a square on UVA's campus. The white supremacists were reportedly the aggressors in that incident.

The next day, between 2,000 and 6,000 white supremacists were anticipated to gather in protest at the park the statue was to be removed from. BLM and other counterprotest groups, including university students and professors and Antifa, showed up in big numbers as well. Video footage reflects that many of the White supremacists arrived in makeshift riot gear, which would have been inadequate against police but was otherwise somewhat advantageous. Fights broke out before the event's scheduled kickoff, the park was dispersed, and violence quickly spilled into the streets in several directions. This continued for several hours. Ultimately, a 20 year old white supremacist from Ohio drove a Dodge Challenger into a crowd of counterprotesters - 1 was killed, several were seriously injured, and more than a dozen suffered minor injuries. The 20 year old was apprehended while attempting to flee the scene several blocks away.

Two police were killed when a helicopter crashed which was reportedly monitoring the protesters.

[jdshock]

Two police were killed when a helicopter crashed which was reportedly monitoring the protesters.

Nothing I've seen says the helicopter was brought down by anybody. Is that right? No one shot the pilot or anything?

[Play Angry]

Nothing I've seen says the helicopter was brought down by anybody. Is that right? No one shot the pilot or anything?

I haven't seen anything to indicate the crash was caused by something other than malfunction or accident.

[pinstripers]

They are so full of hate. I hate them.

[pinstripers]

https://www.allenbwest.com/2017/08/13/ok-folks-heres-really-happened-charlottesville-everyone-missing/

[jdshock]

https://www.allenbwest.com/2017/08/1...ryone-missing/

Probably not going to read past this sentence:

This all began because someone decided, as other elected officials have across the country, to cave in to partisan political pressures and seek to erase American history.

As a side question, I always wonder how Americans would feel if they visited Germany and just saw a ton of Hitler statues but Germans felt like they couldn't remove them because we're supposed to learn from history.

[pinstripers]

Angry, I suppose.