Trump Cabinet Hearings

[Kung Wu]

Partially true?

If you can't be intellectually honest, there's no discussion to be had.

It's either true or false.

We both know the answer. If you don't want to admit or understand that that statement is fully true (because it is), then all other discussion is just deflection, ignorance, lying, banter, or gobbledygook that stands on no foundation.

Take the red pill, Neo. Medicare/aid is 25% of the annual budget ... we can have a very interesting discussion about it.
Two presidents alone -- FDR and LBJ ... literally created ... recurring debt burdens with exponential growth.

True or false?

[Shockm]

Attempts to compare debt like this are useless. It treats all debt created by each President as equal.

Two presidents alone -- FDR and LBJ -- have created more debt burdens than all other Presidents since 1913 COMBINED. They literally created the worst nightmare possible: A recurring debt burden with exponential growth.

Example ... in 2023 total spending was $6.2T ... but ...

Social Security was $1.4 trillion (22% of spending)
Medicare/Medicaid was $1.9 trillion (30% of spending)

... so over 50% of Biden's spending can be directly attributed to FDR and LBJ by themselves for 2023 alone.

There are some differences between FDR’s programs which were started during a depression, and LBJ’s programs which were doomed from the start. SS has gotten out of hand, but when it began, 65 years old was actually the average age of death. Today, that would place the age of beginning the SS pension at 75-77 years of age. SS Reforms such as was done 30 some odd years ago (raising the age to 67 or taking a lower amount), are necessary, or SS is doomed.

LBJ’s welfare programs sustainability lacked common sense in 1964, and still do today.

[C0|dB|00ded]

If you can't be intellectually honest, there's no discussion to be had.

It's either true or false.

We both know the answer. If you don't want to admit or understand that that statement is fully true (because it is), then all other discussion is just deflection, ignorance, lying, banter, or gobbledygook that stands on no foundation.

Take the red pill, Neo. Medicare/aid is 25% of the annual budget ... we can have a very interesting discussion about it.
Two presidents alone -- FDR and LBJ ... literally created ... recurring debt burdens with exponential growth.

True or false?

Hmmm. I think I'll stay with the answer I already gave you. It looks just as elegant now (maybe even more so) than it did originally.

You are moving the goalposts.

If you want to say that the following statement you made was wrong, then we can move on to a new argument: "Attempts to compare debt like this are useless." [WRONG]


Your strawman: "Two presidents alone -- FDR and LBJ ... literally created ... recurring debt burdens with exponential growth.

True or false?" -does not support your original rebuttal. If your intention WAS to move the goal posts and silently raise the white flag, then I apologize. I assumed you were trying to defend your original argument.. which you didn't do successfully.


Back to our regularly scheduled broadcast:

1) I offered a chart (built by Republicans) that shows a varying growth rate of debt across all presidents since 1913 (w/ Republicans not looking too good - particularly recently).

2) All presidential administrations in the recent era have existed with SS and Medicare (some altering it significantly)

3) Rate of debt accumulation has changed course several times in the very recent history w/ SS and Medicare budgetary loads at their highest levels

**BONUS INFO**

It appears the national debt growth rate accelerated from JFK to Ford, from Carter to Reagan, from Reagan to H.W. Bush, from Clinton to W. Bush, and from Bummer to Cheeto.

Conversely, it appears the national debt growth rate slowed from Ford to Carter, Bush to Clinton, and Cheeto to Biden.

Harry Truman (Missouri Dim) looks to be an absolutely debt reductionist superstar trimming $687.2 BILLION back in the 40's!!!

Please don't shoot the messenger!

I'm just here to help folks transition........... into the light of truth.

[Kung Wu]

Didn't bother reading.

[C0|dB|00ded]

Didn't bother reading.

Message received! Better luck next time.

[C0|dB|00ded]

Attempts to compare debt like this are useless. It treats all debt created by each President as equal.

Two presidents alone -- FDR and LBJ -- have created more debt burdens than all other Presidents since 1913 COMBINED. They literally created the worst nightmare possible: A recurring debt burden with exponential growth.

Example ... in 2023 total spending was $6.2T ... but ...

Social Security was $1.4 trillion (22% of spending)
Medicare/Medicaid was $1.9 trillion (30% of spending)

... so over 50% of Biden's spending can be directly attributed to FDR and LBJ by themselves for 2023 alone.

There's a warm, loving spirit of appreciation flowing through me right now. I'm going to attempt a very rare CB gesture of compassion, by extending to you an olive branch. It is after all, your efforts that keep this playground of discussion alive for all of us!


Okay... if we are going to apply the first cause/mover framework, and consider the authors of SS and Medicare to be responsible for every single cost associated with their programs, from the first day they put pen to paper until now... then yes, both presidents would be "responsible" for trillions and trillions of debt. And when you account for interest, even more.

But the foundation of this statement never had anything to do with my initial post. And SS/Medicare has changed tremendously over the years. And nobody on earth would ever consider ending them. And what responsibility do the authors actually hold if their programs were continued AND expanded long after they were dead?

My post was about the change in national debt accumulation rate between the two parties. The fact that all other things being equal, like SS/Medicare, was assumed.

I do believe the Republicans like to spend more than they earn. That is - at least - as big of a problem as Dems' penchant for wealth redistribution.

One thing that I failed to add is the interest rate cycle of doom that you are seeing play out. Once the debt gets too high, the interest alone rapidly expands the debt eventually bankrupting the country (in theory). This is being reflected in the last several presidential administration debt totals.

But there's still a striking pattern in rate of debt expansion/contraction between the two parties. I have already clearly identified said pattern.

How has Biden's rate of debt accumulation gone down from Trump's?

[C0|dB|00ded]

https://www.axios.com/2024/06/24/trump-biden-debt-deficits-election

Trump ran up national debt twice as much as Biden: new analysis

image.png

Former President Trump ran up the national debt by about twice as much as President Biden, according to a new analysis of their fiscal track records.

Why it matters: The winner of November's election faces a gloomy fiscal outlook, with rapidly rising debt levels at a time when interest rates are already high and demographic pressure on retirement programs is rising.

• Both candidates bear a share of the responsibility, as each added trillions to that tally while in office.
• But Trump's contribution was significantly higher, according to the fiscal watchdogs at the Committee for a Responsible Federal Budget, thanks to both tax cuts and spending deals struck in his four years in the White House.

By the numbers: Trump added $8.4 trillion in borrowing over a ten-year window, CRFB finds in a report out this morning.

• Biden's figure clocks in at $4.3 trillion with seven months remaining in his term.
• If you exclude COVID relief spending from the tally, the numbers are $4.8 trillion for Trump and $2.2 trillion for Biden.

I bet nobody discussed this in the "Conservative" talk radio world.....

Unplug!!!!