Just when you think you've seen it all

[7hottamales]

I don't agree with the city providing banking services to wealthy private citizens but from what I've read this is a fully collateralized loan. So there should be no risk to the local taxpayers.

But if he defaults on the loan, the city will acquire property that will be on the tax rolls (they'll pay county tax on it). Then someone has to handle everything that goes with trying to manage and sell the property.

If the council goes through with this, they might as well open the "Citizen's Bank of Wichita", because they will have established a precedent. If there is one thing I've learned after being on a city council, it is that you better be EXTREMELY careful when you begin exploring uncharted waters (setting precedent).

Municipal government is a taxing entity, not a financial institution. So while tax breaks might mean lower revenue, that is within their authority. Loaning out tax money is not, or at least, shouldn't be. It's not about the money, per se, but about what functions government should be restricted to performing.

Rationalizing that it's OK for reasons that fall outside its purpose is exactly what has gotten all levels of government too deeply involved (ie. controlling) in the lives of citizens.

I think it was the nature of this project that makes it the exception, however, in that I believe Bill et. al. built the Old Town Warren at the behest of the city as it tried to expand the entertainment options and geographic area of Old Town.

Now, you (and I, for that matter) can make a sound argument that Warren is responsible for how that investment performed, but I'm pretty sure it's an investment he never would of made had the city not asked him to.

That exception is why Warren gets the loan and XYZ machine shop on south Waco might not.

I'm just guessing here, but there may have been some promises made to the other tenants in Old Town Square, as well as other projects like the Courtyard Marriott that the theatre will exist for a certain amount of time.

Maybe I'm operating on way too much blind faith, but I'm guessing someone put the numbers together and decided it would be in the city's best interest financially to keep the Old Town Warren afloat from projected tax earnings, increased Old Town development, and other associated revenue.

It's essentially the flagship of Old Town, and the city would hate to lose it.

Now, I'm not saying I 100% agree with the loan... mainly because I'm not involved and don't know many of the details, but I DO know that many other cities have been doing much the same and have really shot ahead of what Wichita has to offer in the way of entertainment and industry. You can make a sound argument that a city should never be involved in such things, but you'll be making that argument in a city that's increasingly falling behind its peers.

This is an excellent post.

Philosophically government intervention in business drives me nuts, but if the competition is doing it, city government pretty much is forced to follow suit.

[RoyalShock]

Forgive me while I step back up on my philosophical soapbox. :rant:

Some may say it's naive to be philosophical about this stuff. Well, someone needs to or else it leads to situations exactly lke this.

I'm not trying to sound flippant, but I don't give a rat's backside about whether or not someone ran the numbers or what those numbers say. Unless a promise was made via an official action by the council, they have no legal responsibility to bail out Warren. If they made some sort of "unofficial" or backroom promise, then that was unethical and it would only compound the ethical misdeed to extend the loan.

I'm also displeased by the competition that occurs between the various state and local governments across the country to attract and keep business. But they still need to stay within certain confines and at some point a line needs to be drawn. This loan, IMO, goes well over the line. How long before the city of Wichita just takes over operation of a movie theater? A restaurant? All-Star Sports?

I understand there are some things our culture has said is valuable, yet will never be close to self-sustainable (transportation infrastructure, libraries, museums, event arenas). But IMO, commercial retail ventures are different. The council (and many citizens) appear to be bowing to the idol of entertainment. Entertainment! If you want entertainment then pay price yourself. Don't appeal to your neighbor via government action to subsidize your pursuit of happiness. This country needs to get a grip and get it fast. How long do you think we can sustain the current trend of rising taxes, rising healthcare and rising fuel costs? And we have local governments going to great lenghts and taking on risk to save an entertainment district. Something has gone very wrong.

I know a lot of people will disagree with me, and some quite vehemently, but the direction we're headed just makes me

Hopping back off the soapbox now . . .

[7hottamales]

Forgive me while I step back up on my philosophical soapbox. :rant:

Some may say it's naive to be philosophical about this stuff. Well, someone needs to or else it leads to situations exactly lke this.

I'm not trying to sound flippant, but I don't give a rat's backside about whether or not someone ran the numbers or what those numbers say. Unless a promise was made via an official action by the council, they have no legal responsibility to bail out Warren. If they made some sort of "unofficial" or backroom promise, then that was unethical and it would only compound the ethical misdeed to extend the loan.

I'm also displeased by the competition that occurs between the various state and local governments across the country to attract and keep business. But they still need to stay within certain confines and at some point a line needs to be drawn. This loan, IMO, goes well over the line. How long before the city of Wichita just takes over operation of a movie theater? A restaurant? All-Star Sports?

I understand there are some things our culture has said is valuable, yet will never be close to self-sustainable (transportation infrastructure, libraries, museums, event arenas). But IMO, commercial retail ventures are different. The council (and many citizens) appear to be bowing to the idol of entertainment. Entertainment! If you want entertainment then pay price yourself. Don't appeal to your neighbor via government action to subsidize your pursuit of happiness. This country needs to get a grip and get it fast. How long do you think we can sustain the current trend of rising taxes, rising healthcare and rising fuel costs? And we have local governments going to great lenghts and taking on risk to save an entertainment district. Something has gone very wrong.

I know a lot of people will disagree with me, and some quite vehemently, but the direction we're headed just makes me

Hopping back off the soapbox now . . .

This is actually a great post as well.