Penn State

[pinstripers]

Nov. 14, 2011 7:26 p.m. - by Jim Rodenbush - McQueary says he did 'the right thing'
WRs coach Mike McQueary sent an email Monday to his former teammates, according to NBC News correspondent Peter Alexander. The text of the email was released on Alexander’s Twitter account: “I did the right thing,” McQueary wrote. “You guys know me. The truth is not out there fully. I didn't just turn and run. I made sure it stopped. I had to make quick tough decisions.” Lions RapidReports

Tags: Sandusky case

[The Mad Hatter]

Very well written commentary on the reaction to the situation:

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/11/15/opinion/brooks-lets-all-feel-superior.html

[Awesome Sauce Malone]

Very well written commentary on the reaction to the situation:

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/11/15/op...-superior.html

While I concur that most people wont and cant know what they would do in a given situation, none of the given situations the author listed comes close to seeing a child anally violated by grown adult in the shower.

Seeing a spouse hit is wife? Completely is equal to seeing a child anally violated by grown adult in the shower. Going for a job interview and the interviewer said I had nice tits? Completely equal to seeing a child anally violated by grown adult in the shower.Did I mention that it is alleged that a graduate assistant reportedly witnessed seeing a child anally violated by grown adult in the shower.. Not just touching a leg or rubbing a head but seeing a child anally violated by grown adult in the shower.

The fact that the act was witnessed and nothing was done (and was allowed to continue) is disgusting. And granted people DONT know how they would act in a given situation. But to watch a child who has NO CHANCE of defending itself from a predator and do nothing about it is just as bad as doing the act themself.

So Mr. David Brooks all I really have to say is "whatever helps you sleep at night ******"

[The Mad Hatter]

That is missing the entire point of the piece. The point wasn't that the multitude of reasons that people fail to act makes failure to act justified, but rather that human history demonstrates that people are far more likely to say that they will act than to actually act when the situation arises. As such, each of us should have to seriously confront the very real question of whether we would act the way we think we would act in these kinds of situations, rather than smugly asserting that we would do better. The evidence suggests that there is a disconnect between those who would say they would do better than those that actually do.

As to severity of activity, I would certainly claim that his examples of observer behavior during the Holocaust or in Rawanda live up to the level of what happened at Penn State.

[Awesome Sauce Malone]

The examples of the Holocaust and the Rwandan genocide are very good. However, In the case of both, these actions (although wrong) were widely accepted on a national level (other than the groups being persecuted) It was cool to hate jews and the tutsi's. They were physically/morally/mentally inferior to their detractors (or so they would have you believe)

There are many examples in each of people stepping up to the plate and doing whats right, many whom ended up being persecuted themselves.

I understand/applaud and agree with what the author is trying to say. But in this case I dont think it holds any water.

[Kung Wu]

Apparently there is some hint that it did NOT continue to happen when he was caught. The quarterback has hinted toward that and it sorta makes sense. In the grand jury testimony it says when Sandusky was caught laying on a (clothed) wrestler in a weight room by a gym teacher he quickly jumped up and made a quick comment that he was just "practicing wrestling moves".

It is very conceivable that when busted in the shower he quickly jumped away and left, or the child did, and therefore there was no need to intervene. We don't know the details of what Sandusky and the child did when Sandusky was caught -- yet.

Now I am just throwing that scenario out there, however it's much more plausible than both of them saw the quarterback and Sandusky continued raping the child. I bet Sandusky was scared to death and fled. I bet the kid was relieved that Sandusky left and quickly went a different direction. And I bet the quarterback at that point knew a) that the kid was no longer being raped, and b) had to take a moment to come to terms with what he just witnessed (but was no longer happening and the child and Sandusky were going separate ways or leaving). At that point he now wants to "get Sandusky" and calls his dad who advises that winning over JoPa would be golden when going to the police -- which also seems reasonable.

I don't want to defend McQueary, but I think he should be heard, before holding too much judgement.

[Kung Wu]

I would also like to add, that even if the scenario above occurred, it doesn't excuse not going to the police 30 days later when you realize that no action has been taken by anybody.

So withholding judgement isn't about saying McQueary is innocent of a failed moral obligation, but just to what degree.

[_kai_]

If I saw a coworker molesting a child, I wouldn't take it to my boss. I'd call the cops. How the heck does being employed by a university athletic program make that any different.

Just blows my mind.

[Kung Wu]

If I saw a coworker molesting a child, I wouldn't take it to my boss. I'd call the cops. How the heck does being employed by a university athletic program make that any different.

Just blows my mind.

Wouldn't you do both?

[SubGod22]

He was a grad assistant, trying to get a job, and working in a legendary program for a legendary coach. It's easy to say the right thing now, but in that scenario, I can see where there would be fear and confussion and wondering what to do. He took it to Joe Pa who said he'd take it higher. After some time, maybe he should have done more. That's EASY to say now. The higher ups obviously didn't care as they never talked to him. That's definitely a tough spot for someone in that situation to be in. Yes, he should have done more. But it's easier said than done.

[_kai_]

He was a grad assistant, trying to get a job, and working in a legendary program for a legendary coach. It's easy to say the right thing now, but in that scenario, I can see where there would be fear and confussion and wondering what to do. He took it to Joe Pa who said he'd take it higher. After some time, maybe he should have done more. That's EASY to say now. The higher ups obviously didn't care as they never talked to him. That's definitely a tough spot for someone in that situation to be in. Yes, he should have done more. But it's easier said than done.

I don't care what job I have, if I see some old man having sex with a 10 year old boy in a shower, I'm calling the cops. I really don't see how anyone can say that is a tough call.... or maybe society is way more screwed up than I had originally imagined.

And sure Kung Wu, I would tell both, but no matter what happens I'm calling the cops. If I get fired, I suit them for wrongful termination. No one in the world would ever "blackball" a grad assistant for turning in a pedophile. No one in the entire world would do that. Horrible decisions were made, and people need to live with those consequences. The innocence of 20+ children was stripped away to never be given back. The trauma that Sandusky caused to those boys, will carry forward with them through their entire life. They might never have a healthy sexual relationship for the rest of their life because of it, and maybe never have a healthy relationship with anyone.

It's absolutely sickening.

[Kung Wu]

There is another dynamic that I have never seen commented on.

McQueary was not "just" a "grad student". He was a former star freaking quarterback. Not just a quarterback, but a freaking stud quarterback. Not just a stud quarterback, but a record breaking quarterback whose coach was: Joe Paterno. Doesn't that mean they are probably EXTREMELY good friends, WAY beyond an employee/boss relationship?

So isn't a very likely scenario that he didn't just go to "his boss", but really went to his very powerful but extremely good friend and confidante, knowing full well his word is golden to the entire communty, with the expectation that he will sit right there and call the cops with him? Isn't it also likely that at that meeting the very next day JoPa said "don't worry McQueary, we'll make this right", let me think about how best to address the authorities?

At that point your former coach, very good and powerful friend, a guy you have taken instruction through in stressful situations tells you that he will take care of it -- don't you believe him?

But then ... when there is no arrest 30 days later ... phone call to the cops.

That's another thought process that runs through my mind.

[Kung Wu]

I don't care what job I have, if I see some old man having sex with a 10 year old boy in a shower, I'm calling the cops. I really don't see how anyone can say that is a tough call.... or maybe society is way more screwed up than I had originally imagined.

And sure Kung Wu, I would tell both, but no matter what happens I'm calling the cops. If I get fired, I suit them for wrongful termination. No one in the world would ever "blackball" a grad assistant for turning in a pedophile. No one in the entire world would do that. Horrible decisions were made, and people need to live with those consequences. The innocence of 20+ children was stripped away to never be given back. The trauma that Sandusky caused to those boys, will carry forward with them through their entire life. They might never have a healthy sexual relationship for the rest of their life because of it, and maybe never have a healthy relationship with anyone.

It's absolutely sickening.

Completely agree. You call the cops. Simple call.

But I can see how he might also have been thinking that calling the cops with JoPa backing him might be a bigger statement -- not that I agree with making that decision, but I can see that that's likely what happened.

Given all that, he should have called them within days after seeing nothing was being done.

But ultimately he should have called them immediately upon witnessing it.

[RoyalShock]

My observations, albeit from some distance, is that football programs have a culture of their own. A "son, let's keep this in the family. We'll take care of it" type of culture. One where everyone knows their place and what will happen if they dare go outside the family. It's difficult to know how that pressure will cause someone to act when in a traumatic situation.

From high school on up, it has looked to me as if football players and coaches have a different moral compass than many of us. They are arrogant. They see others as lesser people on the social ladder and treat them accordingly. They seem to think the rules don't apply to them. Social norms are for everyone else. I observed this in high school and college. My oldest son observed this in high school. All the stuff we hear about relatively high numbers of football players (college and pro) getting into trouble. Rampant rules violations within college programs. High school recruits getting sexual favors that were practically arranged by assistant coaches.

I want to emphasize that not all football players are like this. But many, if not most, seem to be. And granted, this stuff happens in others sports, but from my vantage point, more so in football.

For all the problems that have become public, how many are still being hidden, covered-up and ignored? For every issue exposed are there two that aren't? Five? Ten?

Is this the logical result of the emphasis our society has put on sports? That we put up statues, name stadiums, and pay millions upon millions of dollars to players and coaches of a game - A GAME! All for the sake of our amusement.

I am guilty of putting emphasis on sports. I love my Shockers and my Royals. I facilitate my son's participation in sports (but I don't push him like some parents do). So perhaps I am part of the problem.

And while this may be at best selective and at worst hypocritical, count me as one who does not want to see football return to WSU. I have been squarely on the fence for some time, but this Penn State ordeal has given me enough perspective that I don't want that element to be prevalent on our campus. I don't want Wichita State to be the next Miami or Penn State.

[AndShock]

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/11/15/mike-mcqueary-emails-penn-state-scandal_n_1095990.html

McQueary says he stopped it and went to the police.