MVC WBB Tournament

[WuDrWu]

I think you're missing @The Mad Hatter:'s point. Read his opening line.

[shocker_67]

Whatever you think of leaving the starters for questions internal to WSU, using that as an reason for the Drake coach to be angry is ridiculous for two reasons:

1. It's the freaking championship game with an NCAA berth on the line. Am I supposed to think of Drake as cannon fodder who need to be looked upon with pity or a team that earned their way through multiple elimination games and therefore as a contender. If anything, leaving the starters in is a sign of respect for Drake and and could only be criticized if you were trying to showboat and/or balloon the score, which leads us to . . .

2. The only thing the starters were doing for the last 5 minutes or so they were in was running the entirety of the shot clock every possession. We weren't even remotely trying to score, instead being content to safely run the clock out. Note that in spite of pulling starters sooner, Drake actually cut the lead after that point instead of having it run up on them.

There was no purpose to leaving the starters in. We have seen these blow out games all year with the reason given that it was needed to take the championship. Our coaches are known in the valley to have no class, I don’t think we have to continue that persona, it reflects on our school. Bench should of went in as soon as Drake emptied theirs or moments before Drake with a thirty point lead. The game was already won. A starter should not of been left in with the bench, all players should have been a part of the tournament game with such a blow out. This decision should of been with consideration and thought of our players for their year of hard work. As far as starters running clock out on possession, sounds like a good time for the bench to get experience. Six deep we don’t have a chance unless everyone is on and we have no foul trouble. Jody seems to be coaching with no intent on building a future program. Some of the freshman should have been redshirted. That’s a selfish coach with no regards for the school’s future basketball program or for the players.
We had good defense but still no attack for a zone. Our next game we are not going to get by with not having some plan of an offense against a zone. Looked like she was running a man offense against a zone many times, screens to somebody already standing there looked stupid.

[The Mad Hatter]

Why risk injury, we are not very deep to begin with. The opponent pulls the starters at the 3 min. mark and we can't let some players who have work their butts off all year have two or three minutes of playing time? One of those kids might be asked to step up in the next few weeks, be nice to have as much experience as possible. A sign of respect to Drake...really? They cut the lead but is there that much difference between a 26 and 22 point lead?

Looking at Drake perspective she threw in the towel and Jody decided no mercy. I don't know if there is something going on between them but in all my years when a coach clears the bench you show some respect by clearing your own.

I don't disagree about the injury issue, which is why I put the caveat about internals questions about leaving the starters in.

From the Drake perspective, none of that answers what I said in my post. The only qualm you could have as an opposing coach about the starters being out there is if WSU was running up the score. Otherwise, why do you care who WSU has on the court? Jody showed no mercy by having her players use up the entire shot clock, a strategy which caused the game to move to its conclusion quickly without expanding the WSU lead? We didn't score a single point in the last 5:48 of the game. What would showing mercy have looked like? Intentionally scoring on our own basket to tighten the margin?

[shocker_67]

Whatever you think of leaving the starters for questions internal to WSU, using that as an reason for the Drake coach to be angry is ridiculous for two reasons:

1. It's the freaking championship game with an NCAA berth on the line. Am I supposed to think of Drake as cannon fodder who need to be looked upon with pity or a team that earned their way through multiple elimination games and therefore as a contender. If anything, leaving the starters in is a sign of respect for Drake and and could only be criticized if you were trying to showboat and/or balloon the score, which leads us to . . .

2. The only thing the starters were doing for the last 5 minutes or so they were in was running the entirety of the shot clock every possession. We weren't even remotely trying to score, instead being content to safely run the clock out. Note that in spite of pulling starters sooner, Drake actually cut the lead after that point instead of having it run up on them.

There was no purpose to leaving the starters in. We have seen these blow out games all year with the reason given that it was needed to take the championship. Our coaches are known in the valley to have no class, I don’t think we have to continue that persona, it reflects on our school. Bench should of went in as soon as Drake emptied theirs or moments before Drake with a thirty point lead. The game was already won. A starter should not of been left in with the bench, all players should have been a part of the tournament game with such a blow out. This decision should of been with consideration and thought of our players for their year of hard work. As far as starters running clock out on possession, sounds like a good time for the bench to get experience. Six deep we don’t have a chance unless everyone is on and we have no foul trouble. Jody seems to be coaching with no intent on building a future program. Some of the freshman should have been redshirted. That’s a selfish coach with no regards for the school’s future basketball program or for the players.
We had good defense but still no attack for a zone. Our next game we are not going to get by with not having some plan of an offense against a zone. Looked like she was running a man offense against a zone many times, screens to somebody already standing there looked stupid.

[flyingMoose]

I am with @boyshocker: on this one.

If you are going to run the shot clock down and not really try to score, you can do that with bench players as easily as starters. (Well, maybe you could argue the bench players would get excited and actually try to score, but don't try to take us there.) It is a matter of professional etiquette - when the other team throws in the towel, you accept. And if you have reasons not to do that, don't expect the opposition coach to hang around and listen to them.

[WstateU]

[1972Shocker]

I agree that if the other teams throw in the towel then just as a show of courtesy put in your bench. However, as TMH points out we did not run up the score. I had not realized that Drake scored the only 2 points in the last 5:48 of the game.

BTW Drake pulled Kyndal Clark and Lizzy Wendell with 2:24 remaning and Caitlyn Ingle with 2:15 remaining. These are their top 3 players.

Jody pulled her starters off the floor with 1:32 to go. So we are talking about a 45 second difference in time. Jody probably wanted to pull her starters after Drake pulled their starters so that the Drake kids could get their recognition from their fans and the Shocker starters could get their recognition from their fans separately and I think Jody had to ask for a substitution timeout to get the subs in.

All that said I will say that Jody has been very reticent to play the end of her bench this year so this is really nothing new. I have questioned all-year why we aren't getting these kids a few more minutes here and there but I'm sure Jody has her reasons.

However, I don't see any reason for the Drake Coach to be upset about the Shocks running up or trying to run up the score as that clearly did not happen and we don't really know if she was upset, or if she was upset, we don't know about what.

[flyingMoose]

BTW Drake pulled Kyndal Clark and Lizzy Wendell with 2:24 remaining and Caitlyn Ingle with 2:15 remaining. These are their top 3 players.

Jody pulled her starters off the floor with 1:32 to go. So we are talking about a 45 second difference in time.

I was believing the previous posts about there being a 90 second differential. If not, ...

[boyshocker]

I was believing the previous posts about there being a 90 second differential. If not, ...

I really don't care if the Drake coach is mad or not. My point is that when an opponents coach throws in the towel you recognize that by putting in your bench. I also believe that our lack of bench is part of the reason for the losing streak at the end of the season, we had a bunch of kids who were plain tired.

[tgcshock]

I really don't care if the Drake coach is mad or not. My point is that when an opponents coach throws in the towel you recognize that by putting in your bench. I also believe that our lack of bench is part of the reason for the losing streak at the end of the season, we had a bunch of kids who were plain tired.

I don't have any problem with what Jody did vis-a-vis sportsmanship with Drake. TMH's points are well taken on that score. In regard to how she uses her bench and whether it hurts us or not, the problem with making that argument is that each of the last 2 years at the end of the season when the tournament came around we looked like the freshest and most dominant team in the Valley. It is difficult to argue that she overused her starters, wore them down, and yet simultaneously had the team best able to play three games in three days and look good doing it.

[1972Shocker]

Rather than focus on speculation about a lack of sportsmanship which doesn't seem to be supported by the known facts I would like to give some kudos the Shocker players and coaches for winning a second consecutive trip to the NCAA Tournament. Our only 2 tournament appearances in the history of our program.

Kudos Ladies. :applause:

Congratulations to Alex on her selection as the Tournaments Most Outstanding Player for the 2nd consecutive year.

Alex averaged 18.7 Pts, 7.3 Rbds, 4.0 Assists, 1.3 Blocked Shots and 3 Steals over the 3 Valley Tournament games and that includes one of her poorest halves of the year against Illinois State where she only scored 2 points.

Alex's all-around game including her stellar defense and terrific BBIQ is what makes her so much fun to watch and support. She can play better, but she was pretty damn good this weekend. She is a team player 1st and foremost and a quiet and humble leader for this team.

I also liked the way Kelsey, Alie and Michaela stepped up in the semi-final game and the championship game in support of the big 3 (Alex, Michelle and Jamillah).

Has anybody in the history of WSU women's basketball played harder than Michelle Price. I really doubt it. Love the effort that young lady gives.