Quality Control

[Ricardo del Rio]

Other than standard stat records, do the coaches utilized other performance data to measure effectiveness and efficiency of play?

Just a couple of examples:

Setting picks
Defending ball screen
Personal foul categories - smart, dumb, acceptable, etc.
Rebound positioning
Shot selection - wide open, open, contested, closely contested

Do the coaches update the collected data and present it regularly to the players in a class room setting in the form of charts along with discussion?

Do the coaches have desireable targets for measures of effective play?

Do the coaches brief the players on referee specific tendancies? As an example, some refs are very strict on palming the ball.

The above comments are just a few ideas for discussion.

Just wondering.

[The Mad Hatter]

I know that the coaches break down game tape to identify what is being done correctly and incorrectly, especially stuff like screening that is not tracked in the box scores.

I am sure that tracking and communicating this information is a big part of what they do, but I don't have any specifics about how they go about that task.

[WuDrWu]

Coach Fogler was big on "points per possession". I don't remember the formula (I may try to find it later in my archives) but he was a junkie about this stat. Games and practice.

[Rosewood]

I think you are basically talking about a six-sigma type approach to the game and from a fan pov I don't see any coaching staffs that do that. That kind of statistical analysis is frowned upon in many sports (look at how long it has taken sabermetrics to catch on in the bigs). "They" would argue that there is a certain feel to the game that your numbers can't quantify.

Baloney I say to that. I think a full six-sigma type breakdown of a basketball team could go a long way into maximizing the odds in as many situations as possible.

[pinstripers]

just win, baby

[tropicalshox]

One time when I was listening to Coach Jans I realized I knew nothing about basketball. I'm just a fan, the staff are professionals.

[pogo]

One time when I was listening to Coach Jans I realized I knew nothing about basketball. I'm just a fan, the staff are professionals.

This one post should precede every negative post about the coaching staff. :good:

[ShockBand]

One thing that is hard to measure other than "anecdotally" by watching tape is how the movement in an offense influences the position of defenders in order to create space for a shot. For this I'm talking about movement OTHER than screens, such as when a defender sags back for some reason.

I echo tropicalshox's comment - when a coach really gets going, I realize how much I DON'T know!

[Ricardo del Rio]

I know that professional football teams have extensive quality control programs to improve performance.

I have never heard of such with college basketball.

I wonder, why not? Limited resources? Lack of interest?

Surely, at least one of the thousands of basketball coaches in the land has thought about it.

[TurFin]

Coaches grade EVERYTHING on each posession...giving a point value to pretty much each action or reaction on the floor. They then keep a running grade card per player that includes most if not all of the items you list, standard stats, and stuff you wouldn't ever think of.

Just when you think you know basketball or have some knowledge of what happened during a game. Sit with a coach grading film and you'll understand your views about the game are very elementary.

[Aargh]

I was listening to a coaches show - I'd imagine it was about a year ago and a caller asked a question obviously designed to say he disapproved of how WSU defender's played against screens.

Marshall told him what a great question that was and proceeded to go into the basics of about a dozen different types of screens that could be used and about a dozen different methods of defending and playing past the screen. He had names for all of them and after a quick introduction to the types of screens and how they are often disguised by the setter, he went on to explain how he coached defenders to respond to them.

He got into the defender's options against various screens, how other players in the area should react, how the players had to work together to react and properly defend the screens.

He was on about a 2-minute roll that could probably only be comprehended by coaches or D1 players. The caller using a question to disguise a criticism was told that it wasn't as simple as it looked.

[ShockBand]

All the intricacies, as opposed to what I seem to see on a lot of NBA, iso for one-on-one. Yawn. There has to be more to it in the NBA game, but I just don't usually see it.

[RoyalShock]

Coaches grade EVERYTHING on each posession...giving a point value to pretty much each action or reaction on the floor. They then keep a running grade card per player that includes most if not all of the items you list, standard stats, and stuff you wouldn't ever think of.

Just when you think you know basketball or have some knowledge of what happened during a game. Sit with a coach grading film and you'll understand your views about the game are very elementary.

Thanks for dropping by, TurFin!

I have heard that coaches do an extensive grading when watching film. Everything is micro-analyzed. Defensive breakdowns, good/bad screens, missed boxouts, poor offensive/defensive positioning, in addition to all the stuff on the stat sheet.

[LoneStar48]

There was a little blurb in the paper down here this morning about Texas Tech and how Pat Knight sat down with his staff and Singletary to look at game film. He had gone scoreless against Kansas, and through the film, they found that he wasn't moving at all without the ball. In the two games since, Singletary scored 47 points and had 21 rebounds. Point is, through their analysis, they found a problem and were able to fix it and reap the rewards. They used Steve Alford as an example of how Singletary should be moving.

I don't know if Marshall does that or not; I'm sure he can't do it with all the players, but it might pay off for some of them. Maybe show Stutz film of Aldrich up at KU.

[WSUwatcher]

Yep

LS, to follow others in re-echoing trop, let me just say that if what Stutz is doing (or not doing) can be diagnosed by sight, it's on film, and Marshall and Co. are probably way ahead of you.

I've had a similar experience with Gene Stephenson, whom I've known for 20+ years. In all that time, there's been exactly one question or idea I've mentioned to him that seemed to maybe -- not definitely, but maybe -- give him something new to think about. In every other case, it was obvious that whatever I'd come up with was something he and his staff had long since considered and acted upon to the extent they thought necessary. There's no doubt in my mind that Marshall and his gang are the same way. They really are, as the car commercials say, "professional grade."