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  • #1

    Recruiting

    This started in the Recruiting Forum, but it seems legitimate to move my response to the main Basketball Forum.

    I don't want to get into a comparison between Turg and Marshall - they are different guys with different approaches.

    I've got to use use Turg's recruiting as an example. There's no better way to get a grasp of what is going on at WSU. Marshall's first two recruiting classes seem to be at the level of the best two recruiting classes Turg had in 7 years.

    Marshall recruits longer and more athletic players than Turg recruited to WSU. Marshall is going to have a couple of weak recruiting years coming up. There's imbalance in classes and Marshall has a couple of years coming up with not many scholarships available. That will move him more into Turgeon's territory on overall recruiting.

    I think Marshall is recruiting overall better players than Turgeon recruitied. I think WSU will have fewer recruiting busts (Wall, Bangles, Butler, Brown, Green, Bradley) under Marshall than under Turg.

    Turg did put together a "lightning in a bottle" team. Miller, Wilson, Ogirri, and Cooz were one of the best combination of players in WSU history. Marshall has that S16 in his sights and he has to get there to pass Turg on the list of the best coaches in WSU history.

    I think Kyle Wilson will end up as one of the most underrated players ever at WSU.
    The future's so bright - I gotta wear shades.
    We like to cut down nets and get sized for championship rings.
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  • #2
    "I think Kyle Wilson will end up as one of the most underrated players ever at WSU"

    I will 2nd that Aargh
    I like basketball,cuz if i wasnt for Basketball,i wouldnt be playin Basketball today

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    • #3
      Pretty tough to say he was underrated, but you're right that he was a great Shocker. It was really unfair that he had to carry load down low his senior year. He never made a peep about it that I can remember.
      Wichita State, home of the All-Americans.

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      • #4
        I think the biggest difference is that Marshall recruits for height, length, and athleticism first. Turg recruited for a player that would fit into his system first.

        Comment

        • #5
          Height, length and athleticism fit into Marshall's system :D

          And the only thing I'd say about Aarghs post is that just because Marshall will have a class or two with only one or two 'ships available doesn't mean they'll be down recruiting years. Although, at the same time there are a lot of youngsters on the team that recruits will see. Hopefully Marshall continues to go after guys who see that as a challenge and not an obstacle.
          Infinity Art Glass - Fantastic local artist and Shocker fan
          RIP Guy Always A Shocker
          Carpenter Place - A blessing to many young girls/women
          ICT S.O.S - Great local cause fighting against human trafficking
          Wartick Insurance Agency - Saved me money with more coverage.
          Save Shocker Sports - A rallying cry

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          • #6
            I agree Sub, if you have one spot open and you fill it with EO, I don't think that you can do much better?

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            • #7
              MT (it appears to me) tried to recruit kids with a strong religeous background, and kids who were from 2-parent families. Very, very few kids from single parent families, or from divorced parents. Check it out. I'm not sure what that all means, though.

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              • #8
                Originally posted by pinstripers
                MT (it appears to me) tried to recruit kids with a strong religeous background, and kids who were from 2-parent families. Very, very few kids from single parent families, or from divorced parents. Check it out. I'm not sure what that all means, though.
                Why wouldn't that be a goal?

                All things being equal, wouldn't having high character kids be the preference?

                Kids with those backgrounds are more likely to survive the rigors of D1 basketball, be coachable and execute game plans, and uphold the expectations of the School, the Donors ($$$) and Community...

                as long as they win ball games!
                "Don't measure yourself by what you have accomplished, but by what you should accomplish with your ability."
                -John Wooden

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by RockChalkWUShock
                  I think the biggest difference is that Marshall recruits for height, length, and athleticism first. Turg recruited for a player that would fit into his system first.
                  Turg also recruited players who could shoot. Marshall recruits athletes and hopes he can make them basketball players. Turg recruited basketball players and hoped he could turn them into D1 atheltes (or, at least, D1 basketball players). I'm not pro or con anybody and I think Marshall will have more success but I expect our shooting woes to reappear occasionally over the years.
                  Some posts are not visible to me. :peaceful:
                  Don't worry too much about it. Just do all you can do and let the rough end drag.

                  Comment

                  • #10
                    Originally posted by pinstripers
                    MT (it appears to me) tried to recruit kids with a strong religeous background, and kids who were from 2-parent families. Very, very few kids from single parent families, or from divorced parents. Check it out. I'm not sure what that all means, though.
                    I'm not sure that making "a strong religeous background" a requirement is a good idea. Jane did this; look at her record at WSU. I don't want a bunch of thugs but being religeous does not equate to being a good citizen (e.g. Dennis Rader, Scott Roeder http://www.kansas.com/news/tiller/story/843213.html, John List http://www.jesus21.com/poppydixon/crime/list.html). I also don't remember a lot of Hindu, Muslim, Bahá'í, Buddhist, Sikh, etc. players and only one Jewish player. It appears that Turg recruited not just players with "a strong religeous background" but players with a strong Christian background. As a public institution, I wonder if his recruiting was appropriate.
                    Some posts are not visible to me. :peaceful:
                    Don't worry too much about it. Just do all you can do and let the rough end drag.

                    Comment

                    • #11
                      Originally posted by SpanglerFan316
                      Originally posted by RockChalkWUShock
                      I think the biggest difference is that Marshall recruits for height, length, and athleticism first. Turg recruited for a player that would fit into his system first.
                      Turg also recruited players who could shoot. Marshall recruits athletes and hopes he can make them basketball players. Turg recruited basketball players and hoped he could turn them into D1 atheltes (or, at least, D1 basketball players). I'm not pro or con anybody and I think Marshall will have more success but I expect our shooting woes to reappear occasionally over the years.
                      You're oversimplifying...

                      Adam Liberty, Wendell Preadom, Jamar Howard, Phil Thomasson, Ryan Martin, etc... were not "shooters".

                      We were just blessed to have Paul Miller and Kyle Wilson on the floor at the same time, 2 bigs who could put the ball in the hole. Karon and PJ got hot at the right time, and that put a Sweet 16 banner up at Koch.
                      "Don't measure yourself by what you have accomplished, but by what you should accomplish with your ability."
                      -John Wooden

                      Comment

                      • #12
                        Originally posted by SpanglerFan316
                        Originally posted by pinstripers
                        MT (it appears to me) tried to recruit kids with a strong religeous background, and kids who were from 2-parent families. Very, very few kids from single parent families, or from divorced parents. Check it out. I'm not sure what that all means, though.
                        I'm not sure that making "a strong religeous background" a requirement is a good idea. Jane did this; look at her record at WSU. I don't want a bunch of thugs but being religeous does not equate to being a good citizen (e.g. Dennis Rader, Scott Roeder http://www.kansas.com/news/tiller/story/843213.html, John List http://www.jesus21.com/poppydixon/crime/list.html). I also don't remember a lot of Hindu, Muslim, Bahá'í, Buddhist, Sikh, etc. players and only one Jewish player. It appears that Turg recruited not just players with "a strong religeous background" but players with a strong Christian background. As a public institution, I wonder if his recruiting was appropriate.


                        I hope that this is your weak attempt at trolling....
                        "Don't measure yourself by what you have accomplished, but by what you should accomplish with your ability."
                        -John Wooden

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by wu_shizzle
                          You're oversimplifying...

                          Adam Liberty, Wendell Preadom, Jamar Howard, Phil Thomasson, Ryan Martin, etc... were not "shooters".

                          We were just blessed to have Paul Miller and Kyle Wilson on the floor at the same time, 2 bigs who could put the ball in the hole. Karon and PJ got hot at the right time, and that put a Sweet 16 banner up at Koch.
                          You're correct; I was "oversimplifying..." Sean was a pretty good shooter and had something to do with our S16. I never understood why Turg recruited Preadom or a few others. Martin was a rebounder. I was never a fan of Thomasson but look at his stats; they were not that bad. Adam Liberty was a better point guard than most fans admit; Kenny Manigault may not be that much better as a shooter.
                          Some posts are not visible to me. :peaceful:
                          Don't worry too much about it. Just do all you can do and let the rough end drag.

                          Comment

                          • #14
                            wu_shizzle: Turg could recruit whomever he wanted; it was his job and he has to live with his record. Turg did not replace Ralph Miller in our hearts and minds but he was OK. I'll admit that my comment "As a public institution, I wonder if his recruiting was appropriate" may have been a bit over the top. :D
                            Some posts are not visible to me. :peaceful:
                            Don't worry too much about it. Just do all you can do and let the rough end drag.

                            Comment

                            • #15
                              I like Turg, but he didn't replace Gene Smithson either.

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