2017-18 National Rankings

[WuShock Reaper]

Justin Ferguson, AP Voter

https://www.seccountry.com/auburn/justin-ferguson-voted-auburn-basketball-ap-top-25-ballot

9. Cincinnati
13. Oklahoma
24. Wichita State

[wsushockerdude]

FWIW, Gary Parrish has us at 20 in his ballot. He only had us at 11 pre-SMU, which I also thought was accurate based on our resume.

[FadedCrown]

http://cbbpoll.com/

18th in latest user poll.

One thing to note is that Wichita State fans have Wichita State lower than 18th on their ballots.

[WuShock Reaper]

BY JON WILNER, AP Voter

https://www.mercurynews.com/2018/01/22/my-ap-top-25-ballot-duke-slides-into-the-no-2-spot-kansas-and-north-carolina-climb-oklahoma-tumbles/

8. Cincinnati

10. Oklahoma

13. Wichita State

[WuShock Reaper]

Chris Murray, AP Voter

http://www.rgj.com/story/sports/college/nevada/2018/01/22/ap-top-25-mid-major-bonanza-murrays-ballot/1053607001/

Team on the fall
* Wichita State: It wasn’t all good for the mid-majors as Wichita State took a pair of losses last week and is learning life in the American Athletic Conference is more difficult than it was in the Missouri Valley Conference. The Shockers dropped games to SMU and Houston last week, giving Wichita State a pair of league losses in a four-day span after it went 68-4 in conference in its previous four seasons in MVC play (Wichita State moved to the AAC this season). The Shockers are still on my ballot, but fell from No. 8 to No. 23.

10. Cincinnati (10)
12. Oklahoma (3)
23. Wichita State (8)

[CBB_Fan]

2) There will be no more than 3 of the 65 pollsters leave WSU off the ballot today, and I'll be surprised if we see even 1.
3) That is just a really completely dead wrong thing to say and shows a total lack of historical understanding of the ebbs and flows of a season.
4) That is true, but really doesn't fit in with your other points.
5) No. No. No. Also, no.

According to RPIforecast:
WSU projects to finish 23-7 with an RPI of 18.
29-4 and the Shox are a 2 seed (at worst).
92% chance the Shox *enter* the AAC tourney with 22+ wins. That means about a 90% chance they enter selection sunday with at least 23 wins. They are more likely to be a 4 seed and wear white twice than they are to go to the NIT.

Your projections that "the current level of play", AKA, "the last 3 games" will continue for the next two months straight and is "the most likely outcome" is laughable and simply ignorant of historical patterns.

My opinion is that the performances vs California, Notre Dame, SDSU, Arkansas State, FGCU, OU, UConn, Tulsa, SMU, and @Houston are virtually identical. The final outcome depended on the quality of team we played and how good of a game they put up, but they were ALL terrible performances. Do that again @ Temple and Temple plays their A/B game? Loss. Do that against Cincinnati? Two double-digit blowouts. My point is that if that is the "real" Wichita State team, that team is closer to the NIT than an 8 seed (IE, a 10/11 seed). Note, IF.

I don't see it as a "last three performances" issue. I see it as "didn't improve after California took an 18 point lead, didn't improve after letting ND come back, didn't improve after SDSU took a 2nd half lead, didn't improve after Arkansas State won a half, didn't improve after FGCU won a halg, didn't improve after OU trashed us, didn't improve through a rocky UConn game, didn't improve after Tulsa almost came back, didn't improve after SMU punched us in the face at Koch Arena."

Maybe the Houston loss will be the wakeup call that makes us improve. But after thinking after 10 of our 15 games "this is it, they'll wakeup after that" I struggle to say that this will be "the one" that stops sub-100 teams from taking halves off us and top50 teams from dominating us. For the record, from the period of Dec 18 to our KenPom net rating was about 12.5, dropping us from 25.96 to 19.23 overall. It isn't just "3" games; over the last month plus we've played at the level of Murray State. THAT is the team I was evaluating. If we are the +25.96 Shockers or even the +19.23 Shockers we'll do better than that.

And for the record, 24-8 isn't anything close to a 4 seed. Yes, the RPI/SOS at that level (14/28) but the wins won't be. Butler was a 4 seed last year with an RPI of 14, SOS 13, 4-0 vs Top 25, 10-4 vs Top 50 (albeit, some bad losses). WVU had a worse RPI and SOS (24/72) but were 5-3 vs the top 25, 6-4 vs the top 50, 13-5 vs top 100. Assuming losses to Cincinnati and wins versus mostly everyone else we'll be 0-3 or 0-4 to the top 25 (not saying we won't be at least 1-3), with a roughly 4-5 record vs the top 50 and 11-7 vs top100.

[ShockerFever]

lol, the WORST.

[bleednblackngold]

My opinion is that the performances vs California, Notre Dame, SDSU, Arkansas State, FGCU, OU, UConn, Tulsa, SMU, and @Houston are virtually identical. The final outcome depended on the quality of team we played and how good of a game they put up, but they were ALL terrible performances. Do that again @ Temple and Temple plays their A/B game? Loss. Do that against Cincinnati? Two double-digit blowouts. My point is that if that is the "real" Wichita State team, that team is closer to the NIT than an 8 seed (IE, a 10/11 seed). Note, IF.

I don't see it as a "last three performances" issue. I see it as "didn't improve after California took an 18 point lead, didn't improve after letting ND come back, didn't improve after SDSU took a 2nd half lead, didn't improve after Arkansas State won a half, didn't improve after FGCU won a halg, didn't improve after OU trashed us, didn't improve through a rocky UConn game, didn't improve after Tulsa almost came back, didn't improve after SMU punched us in the face at Koch Arena."

Maybe the Houston loss will be the wakeup call that makes us improve. But after thinking after 10 of our 15 games "this is it, they'll wakeup after that" I struggle to say that this will be "the one" that stops sub-100 teams from taking halves off us and top50 teams from dominating us. For the record, from the period of Dec 18 to our KenPom net rating was about 12.5, dropping us from 25.96 to 19.23 overall. It isn't just "3" games; over the last month plus we've played at the level of Murray State. THAT is the team I was evaluating. If we are the +25.96 Shockers or even the +19.23 Shockers we'll do better than that.

And for the record, 24-8 isn't anything close to a 4 seed. Yes, the RPI/SOS at that level (14/28) but the wins won't be. Butler was a 4 seed last year with an RPI of 14, SOS 13, 4-0 vs Top 25, 10-4 vs Top 50 (albeit, some bad losses). WVU had a worse RPI and SOS (24/72) but were 5-3 vs the top 25, 6-4 vs the top 50, 13-5 vs top 100. Assuming losses to Cincinnati and wins versus mostly everyone else we'll be 0-3 or 0-4 to the top 25 (not saying we won't be at least 1-3), with a roughly 4-5 record vs the top 50 and 11-7 vs top100.

Well I guess we should just disband the team. What a joke

[CBB_Fan]

shoxlax actually did me a solid and provided me the link. I don’t wanna steal his credit.

Theres a difference in calling a team out for the play during the game and then going off the deep end and saying they’re going to the NIT.

You can get mad all you want but history shows you’re unstable every time WSU loses a game. Not my problem.

How did that 2015 NIT go?

I never claimed we'd go to the NIT in 2015, and I haven't claimed we are going to the NIT this year. If you used your reading comprehension skills, you'd know that. I said that at this level of play we are between an 8 seed and the NIT, IE a 9-11 seed.

[CBB_Fan]

Well I guess we should just disband the team. What a joke

Well, apparently you think so:

I'm speaking over a couple of games...the defense was atrocious on Thursday night..and has been suspect through stretches of this season...not Shockers basketball. Turnovers, today, were atrocious! They kill you in so many ways...ruin momentum...and get into the heads. Bad basketball.

Completely agree. That did not look like a HCGM team in many ways this week. - bleednblackngold

I'm tired of hypocrisy. I'm not the only one saying we are playing bad basketball. I'm not the only one saying we need to improve. I'm not the only one complaining of turnovers. I'm not the only one attacking our defense. I'm not the only one saying we will drop to the bottom of the polls. I'm not the only one saying we've hurt our seed.

Let he who is without sin cast the first stone. And as far I've seen, forevershockerfan doesn't stoop to throwing stones at fellow Shocker fans.

[ShockerFever]

Well, apparently you think so:



I'm tired of hypocrisy. I'm not the only one saying we are playing bad basketball. I'm not the only one saying we need to improve. I'm not the only one complaining of turnovers. I'm not the only one attacking our defense. I'm not the only one saying we will drop to the bottom of the polls. I'm not the only one saying we've hurt our seed.

Let he who is without sin cast the first stone. And as far I've seen, forevershockerfan doesn't stoop to throwing stones at fellow Shocker fans.

And now let the back-pedaling begin.

Dont make me embarrass you further and do some quote finding because it won’t be pretty.

In a couple weeks, you’ll disappear again as the cycle repeats itself. Can’t wait.

[Jamar Howard 4 President]

It seems CBB_Fan 's thought process is as follows:

If the #21 KenPom team keeps playing like the #21 KenPom team, they will get seeded like the #40 team.

The rest of us must be fools to not see this simple, straightforward logic. lol

[ShockingButTrue]

The NCAA selection committee agrees with you in all sincerity. Empirically as a matter of fact.

They'll remind us of 2017 (last year) when we finished #8 in kenpom and got seeded overall at #38. Or review 2016 *wink wink* if you wish.

The vote has to be unanimous on the committee, prior to seeding.

[Jamar Howard 4 President]

Someone forgot that the Shox don't play in the MVC anymore.

[Play Angry]

#17 in the AP Poll.

[WuShock Reaper]

Just about where I thought we would end up.

[Stickboy46]

Land at 17 ..

[Stickboy46]

St. Mary's jumping from NR to 16 seems a little bit of an overreaction to beating Gonzaga at Home.

[Jamar Howard 4 President]

They are 16 in KenPom. Probably deserved to be ranked sooner, and this is more catching up to reality by the voters.