2017-18 National Rankings

[ShockCrazy]

A few people talk as if us being top 10/top 5 is crazy, but have any of you actually looked at the other teams? I mean seriously looked at the other teams? The only two teams I can unequivocally say we are absolutely behind are Michigan State and Arizona, from there debate begins. Rankings aren't in a vacuum.

[Cdizzle]

Us being unequivocally behind Arizona 2 years ago didn't seem to make much difference when the teams hit the hardwood.

Don't sell this team or this program short.

[ShockCrazy]

Us being unequivocally behind Arizona 2 years ago didn't seem to make much difference when the teams hit the hardwood.

Don't sell this team or this program short.

I'm not saying we couldn't beat them, we have have the talent to beat anyone, but this Arizona team should and will be ranked higher than us and for good reason.

[WuShock16]

Utah certainly was, but UNLV was not even close, IIRC.

http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/rankings/_/year/2016/week/5/seasontype/2

While UNLV indeed was not ranked, they were close, having beat Oregon not much before our game. It seemed like they started tanking immediately after losing to us...imagine that.

[CBB_Fan]

I think a high ranking makes sense for a couple reasons.

1. The incoming recruiting class isn't ridiculous, and its best players have gone to a more diverse set of schools. Instead of 2012 UK with Anthony Davis and Michael Carter-Williams or 2014 KU with Andrew Wiggins and Joel Embiid, you have Missouri with Michael Porter Jr. and no one else.

2. Last year was the "year of the senior." Even OAD loving schools were led by upperclassmen. There aren't a ton of schools bringing back strong rosters, everyone is trying to reload.

3. We have had a 4-6 record, but how many games against top-competition have we had with a healthy, stable roster at home? That record is a reflection of circumstance as much as it is skill. Last year we played all our tough games before our guys had significant D1 experience, the year before we did it without Fred or Landry, and we've had the advantage of home court.

In other words, the field is weaker than average and we are starting stronger. There really aren't a whole lot of teams bringing back a better roster than us or bringing in game-changers. Missouri, Texas, and Alabama aren't going to jump us for landing a single top 10 recruit and teams like North Carolina are losing a ton.

There are only about 9 teams I could even consider starting above us. In no order: Duke, UNC, KU, Florida, Villanova, Gonzaga, Arizona, Michigan State, Louisville. And outside Arizona, none of those are inarguable.

[WSUwatcher]

What did this same very team do last year to warrant a Top 5 / 10 ranking?

A valid question, and clearly the answer is, early in the season, not much. But they got significantly better as the season went on, especially after Shamet became the primary PG, and that was despite having essentially no contribution from Reaves or Keyser, plus deterioration from Willis (not an uncommon phenomenon with juco bigs at WSU, who historically have tended to get much better in their second year under Marshall). That's why the KenPom rank just kept rising and rising.

No doubt this season will be tougher, and the absence of Jans as the master in-game adjuster may be felt too. But there are lots of guys back, and lots of reasons to hope for and expect improvement. Maybe most important, as ShockCrazy noted, there aren't necessarily a lot of teams who obviously should be better than WSU. Rankings are graded on the curve: it isn't only how good you are, it's also how good the others around you are, and that's a big reason the early prognosticators are so positive about the Shocks.

[Play Angry]

No need to hedge against your own disappointment this season.

We have an incredible team, one that will receive one of the very highest preseason rankings in program history and our team will whoop dat ass from start to finish. I want us as high as possible in all polls at all times now and forever, and I'll leave it to fans of other schools to tear us down or provide ammo for disagreement. If postseason or regular season results disappoint, then I'm sure I can find a way to cope but will look back fondly on the respect received and accomplishments achieved by this team.

We are gonna have an amazing season and I cannot wait for it to tip off.

[Shoxcity]

It is going to be an interesting year because let's face it, this squad's players were recruited to play in the Valley. I'm not saying we are playing to represent the Valley, but it will say a lot how good the WSU program is in the initial year of a better league holding their own.

Can only imagine how much recruiting will rise now.

[Cdizzle]

It is going to be an interesting year because let's face it, this squad's players were recruited to play in the Valley. I'm not saying we are playing to represent the Valley, but it will say a lot how good the WSU program is in the initial year of a better league holding their own.

Can only imagine how much recruiting will rise now.

This squad's players were recruited to compete in the NCAA tournament and reach F4s. They just happened to also play a bunch of games against Valley teams.

Your take is one shared by the n00bs in Omaha, and it has a lot to do with why they've never sniffed the 2nd weekend.

[AZ Shocker]

Yeah I don't think this years Sophomore to be Landry Shaments GAME HIGH 20 points against Kentucky will translate well to the AAC. Or the last couple years of 30 point beat downs on Valley teams with the same players will be able to compete in the AAC. Kidding of course...

[Shoxcity]

This squad's players were recruited to compete in the NCAA tournament and reach F4s. They just happened to also play a bunch of games against Valley teams.

Your take is one shared by the n00bs in Omaha, and it has a lot to do with why they've never sniffed the 2nd weekend.

You don't think 3G hasn't been able to recruit certain players because of the dreaded Valley?

[Cdizzle]

You don't think 3G hasn't been able to recruit certain players because of the dreaded Valley?

There is a difference.

Marshall was not recruiting players to compete in the Valley. He was recruiting players to compete nationally. And it was working. There may now be more recruits that will help WSU compete nationally willing to talk to Marshall, which may allow Marshall to more consistently land players at an elevated level the likes of which we have seen in players like FVV, Cle, Baker, McDuffie and Shamet.

But I whole-heartedly reject the notion that Marshall was recruiting and has a roster full of "Valley players" and is suddenly going to recruit and have a roster full of "AAC players." Those things don't exist except in the minds of those in Omaha wondering when they will finally rid their roster of MVC recruits or those in Lawrence wondering how their group of B12 players got blitzed by a bunch of lowly Valley scrubs.

[OregonShocker]

There is a difference.

Marshall was not recruiting players to compete in the Valley. He was recruiting players to compete nationally. And it was working.

Exactly. The OTHER Valley teams were recruiting to compete in the Valley, which is why they struggled with us.

[moshock]

IMO, Daishon Smith might have been the 4th best point guard in the MVC. Our non starters are better than most MVC teams starters.

To say we recruited MVC level players is laughable.....come live in Springfield for a few years....you will really appreciate what HC3G has done at WSU

[chitown_shocker]

"There are known knowns. These are things we know that we know. There are known unknowns. That is to say, there are things that we know we don't know. But there are also unknown unknowns. There are things we don't know we don't know."

I am pretty excited to see WSU play strong league competition. I think they will rise to the occasion, but they will also lose some that I wish they hadn't. Top-five, Top-ten, Top-20 are all pretty close/bunched up together and require health and other good fortune. I am confident this team will be in the mix for the league title and a final-four this year. Pre-season rankings are a crap-shoot but we "belong" as much as anyone.