Ty Taylor is transferring

[ShockingButTrue]

You probably shouldn't include blocks in this because a block doesn't necessarily guarantee an extra possession. Also Evan only had 2 blocks the whole season. All the other players that saw significant playing time had more blocks. Even Fred had 3 blocks for the season.


Coach Marshall started Evan every game because he knew what he was going to get. Also, toward the end of the season and in the NCAA tournament, you'll notice that Coach Marshall wasn't playing Evan as much even though he was still starting. It wasn't necessarily who started the game, but who was finishing the game.

I mispoke. I meant deflections & floorburns.

[WuDrWu]

Taylor committed in September of 2014, shortly after Shamet. At that point he knew he would be a 2nd or 3rd string PG in '15-'16. This was the competition he was looking at for backcourt minutes in '16-'17 and beyond at that time - Brown, Henderson, Holland, and Shamet. None of which had ever played a collegiate game at that point. If you're a talented, confident PG with numerous high-major schools interested in you, that sounds like a pretty good situation to step into. If you're a coach who probably already has doubts about at least one of those backcourt guys already on the roster, a player like Taylor is an important commit.

Flash forward a year and a half and the competition for backcourt minutes in '16-'17 is Shamet, Brown, Frankamp, Allen, Smith, Keyser, Reaves, and Taylor. I think its safe to assume Smith and Allen are going to take Baker and Van Vleet's spots ahead of Taylor on the Guard depth chart, so even if he stays ahead of the two incoming Freshmen, he's not looking at anything more than mop up minutes for the next two years. Redshirting is an option, but Marshall is going to keep recruiting, so there's no guarantee Taylor is ever going to be an important piece of the puzzle. If I'm Taylor, I transfer, and if I'm Marshall, I want him to transfer, both for Ty's sake, and for the program going forward.

The bottom-line is, based on the information they had in September of 2014, Marshall made a good decision to offer Taylor a scholarship and Taylor made a good decision to take it. Just because the information available in April of 2016 leads both of them to decide its best for him to go elsewhere, that doesn't make the first decision bad. A good shot is a good shot, regardless of whether it goes in or not.

Marshall gets paid a lot of money to put together a roster capable of winning conference titles and NCAA tournament games year in and year out. That's the level WSU is at now. You don't get there or stay there by setting aside 2 or 3 of your 13 precious scholarships each year for guys you've put out to pasture.

Good luck to Taylor, by all accounts he is a good kid and he should make a good D-1 player somewhere. I know some Valley schools recruited him. I wouldn't mind him going to one of those and continuing to help WSU by raising an opponent's RPI.

That's one impressive first post.:good:

[Onegreatracer]

17 PPG at K-State next year?

[roundhouse]

Ty and Corey, as much as I enjoyed watching them play, reminded me of tasting Jalapeño peanut brittle for the first time.

Y'know I wanted to like it and Y'know it did taste ok, but Y'know i wasn't really sure how much more I could take.

Yeah, that's what it's like.

Both of the were different players. I think CH's style could have fit well with GM. He just wasn't gonna get the minutes. TT on the other hand, plays more like Matt Braeuer who was successful under a different coach. He doesn't fit GM's style. It really does suck for TT, but he got what he signed up for -- playing under two 38 min. players.

[rjl]

Taylor committed in September of 2014, shortly after Shamet. At that point he knew he would be a 2nd or 3rd string PG in '15-'16. This was the competition he was looking at for backcourt minutes in '16-'17 and beyond at that time - Brown, Henderson, Holland, and Shamet. None of which had ever played a collegiate game at that point. If you're a talented, confident PG with numerous high-major schools interested in you, that sounds like a pretty good situation to step into. If you're a coach who probably already has doubts about at least one of those backcourt guys already on the roster, a player like Taylor is an important commit.

Flash forward a year and a half and the competition for backcourt minutes in '16-'17 is Shamet, Brown, Frankamp, Allen, Smith, Keyser, Reaves, and Taylor. I think its safe to assume Smith and Allen are going to take Baker and Van Vleet's spots ahead of Taylor on the Guard depth chart, so even if he stays ahead of the two incoming Freshmen, he's not looking at anything more than mop up minutes for the next two years. Redshirting is an option, but Marshall is going to keep recruiting, so there's no guarantee Taylor is ever going to be an important piece of the puzzle. If I'm Taylor, I transfer, and if I'm Marshall, I want him to transfer, both for Ty's sake, and for the program going forward.

The bottom-line is, based on the information they had in September of 2014, Marshall made a good decision to offer Taylor a scholarship and Taylor made a good decision to take it. Just because the information available in April of 2016 leads both of them to decide its best for him to go elsewhere, that doesn't make the first decision bad. A good shot is a good shot, regardless of whether it goes in or not.

Marshall gets paid a lot of money to put together a roster capable of winning conference titles and NCAA tournament games year in and year out. That's the level WSU is at now. You don't get there or stay there by setting aside 2 or 3 of your 13 precious scholarships each year for guys you've put out to pasture.

Good luck to Taylor, by all accounts he is a good kid and he should make a good D-1 player somewhere. I know some Valley schools recruited him. I wouldn't mind him going to one of those and continuing to help WSU by raising an opponent's RPI.

Very good points.

Bottom line is that recruiting to Wichita State has historically been a shot in the dark. High risk, high reward.

Sometimes the longshot works out well for us (Baker). But, more often than not, it's probably going to yield average or below-average results. That's the risk we have to take at the cost of a scholarship.

Our recent success has led us to recruiting players that are less of a risk; but don't kid yourself, the risk is still there.

Even when we land a top-100 guy, sometimes they work out and sometimes they don't. The higher ranking would reasonably lead to a higher chance of working out, though. Sometimes, even then, we can get lucky. Fred worked out much better than even his top-100 ranking would have predicted.

But heck, even the top-10 guys that other teams get sometimes wind up being busts or just victims to circumstances beyond their control. It just happens less often as most top-25 guys probably have enough talent to at least maintain their starting jobs for a few years (unless they play for Kentucky).

And none of this even considers the malleability of a player--how well he can improve with coaching. How does one evaluate that when recruiting? Any kid with half a brain can talk the talk and tell a coach how well they take instruction, and any high school coach who wants to see his kids go D1 can talk about how well the kid has paid attention. But none of this is certain, and probably less certain than evaluating the talent itself.

But here, with Taylor, it appears that THam is correct and the guy--and the team, frankly--are victims of circumstances they couldn't have predicted when Taylor signed. I challenge anyone to look at our lineup next year and tell me where Taylor's minutes would have come from. Taylor, being much more intimate with this knowledge than any of us, is no fool and could have done the same calculus. If he wants to play, as players often do, he knew he would have to do it elsewhere.

[choida]

Every year we lose players, next year will be no different...

[Aargh]

Marshall didn't actually have much worse results with Taylor than Self had with Diallo.

[WSUwatcher]

Excellent post, THam, and kudos especially for your recognition that good decisions AT THE TIME they're made don't always work out. In the hindsight-laden world of sports (including, but certainly not limited to, SN), you have a leg up based on that alone.

[Blackmag]

Good luck to Ty wherever he ends up. Kid has talent but with the addition of our recruits at guard plus Landry and Conner we will be pretty deep at the guard position. Still think he will have a solid career at the right school.

[Mr. Obvious]

Good luck to Ty wherever he ends up. Kid has talent but with the addition of our recruits at guard plus Landry and Conner we will be pretty deep at the guard position. Still think he will have a solid career at the right school.

I think it is a woefull lack of experience. When no one can answer who the PG is going to be (and backup)next season, replacing 2 30+ minute positions doesn't have me sitting warm and fuzzy. CF is not a D1 PG. Someone mentioned his Stanford game and neglected to add his man took him to the toolshed twice underneath.

[rjl]

I think it is a woefull lack of experience. When no one can answer who the PG is going to be (and backup)next season, replacing 2 30+ minute positions doesn't have me sitting warm and fuzzy. CF is not a D1 PG. Someone mentioned his Stanford game and neglected to add his man took him to the toolshed twice underneath.

We wouldn't have had much experience at our guard positions this upcoming season even if we had two 5-star sophomores lined up to take the reigns. You think a Freshman--any Freshman--would have gotten much playing time this year? Enough to be considered "experienced?"

We will be replacing Ron and Fred with a 4 to 6 player committee, at least until one or two stand out from the rest. From what we the fans saw this year, Taylor was going to have to improve more than the other guys to have a shot. I have no idea what the new players are going to look like, but I'm guessing Marshall does. I'm guessing Taylor does too, and that's why he got gone.

[wufan]

I think it is a woefull lack of experience. When no one can answer who the PG is going to be (and backup)next season, replacing 2 30+ minute positions doesn't have me sitting warm and fuzzy. CF is not a D1 PG. Someone mentioned his Stanford game and neglected to add his man took him to the toolshed twice underneath.

Frankamp's defense is much improved in the last two years. One might look at the Miami game and say that Fred can't play because Angel Rodriguez was 7-7 in the first half. Not buying your analysis.

I expect some issues with PG next year since Fred is gone; in fact, I expect we will have a couple of meltdown threads over the PG play. As evidence, see Ron Baker at point when Fred was out; Armstead mid-season; Ragland/Murry at the end of the non-con. As it turned out, all of those players that were criticized ended up as All-Conference in the same year that some called for their PT to be all but gone.

Our PG in 2016-17 will make mistakes. He will succeed, fail, and succeed again. Despite the unnecessary criticism, he will be All-MVC.

[shock]

Marshall never asks a player to transfer unless they are not putting forth the effort academically, defensively, or have SERIOUS off the court issues. Even then, he has shown extreme leniency. Look at Shaq and Frankamp. If there were ever two candidates for "forced" transfer, that would be them. Coach was high on Ty and thought he had a good future ahead of him. Unfortunately, there aren't too many players like David Kyles who ride the pine for 2 years before getting any significant playing time.

[Ashockalypse]

[QUOTE=shock;651427]Marshall never asks a player to transfer unless they are not putting forth the effort academically, defensively, or have SERIOUS off the court issues. Even then, he has shown extreme leniency. Look at Shaq and Frankamp. If there were ever two candidates for "forced" transfer, that would be them. Coach was high on Ty and thought he had a good future ahead of him. Unfortunately, there aren't too many players like David Kyles who ride the pine for 2 years before getting any significant playing time.[/QUOTEFactually incorrect post. Connor never a candidate to transfer and Kyles did not ride pine for two years.

[Topshock]

Marshall never asks a player to transfer unless they are not putting forth the effort academically, defensively, or have SERIOUS off the court issues. Even then, he has shown extreme leniency. Look at Shaq and Frankamp. If there were ever two candidates for "forced" transfer, that would be them. Coach was high on Ty and thought he had a good future ahead of him. Unfortunately, there aren't too many players like David Kyles who ride the pine for 2 years before getting any significant playing time.

OK, right.(sarcasm)