The OFFICIAL Shocks vs. Runnin' Utes Game Thread

[1972Shocker]

Fvv is my favorite player on the team and he is one hell of a player. That being said, last night was definitely an off night for him and I wish he would of found a way to get others the ball a little bit more. Baker is our superstar and if anyone's going to shoot it 19 times it should be him.

I don't necessarily disagree with that but I would point out that Utah was thinking the same way and they made it a point of emphasis to limit Ron's touches and looks as much as possible.

Our recent success has been the result of playing great team oriented basketball and not on riding on the back of a superstar and I don't see that changing.

I believe this team will learn from its failures and Fred will lead the way in that respect.

One thing I believe the Shocks have established though is that even on an off-night quietly into the night they will not go.

[Jamar Howard 4 President]

One think I remember Phil Jackson saying about one of the differences between Kobe and MJ was that MJ knew when it wasn't his night shooting and he'd find a way to get others involved while trying to impact the game in other ways not involving him shooting. Kobe will just keep shooting till he makes it.

Fvv is my favorite player on the team and he is one hell of a player. That being said, last night was definitely an off night for him and I wish he would of found a way to get others the ball a little bit more. Baker is our superstar and if anyone's going to shoot it 19 times it should be him.

Fred had so many shots that "just missed", as in, spun out or layups that just barely rolled off instead of rolling in, that I don't think he was "off" in the traditional sense. I think he had every reason to think they would start falling soon. They did at the end of the game. One more make and he is the hero that found the mental fortitude to ignore the past and continue making the correct decision each and every play moving forward.

Now if a player is just plain missing and can feel that things aren't right, I agree, it can be smart to play differently the rest of the night and concede that the shot just doesn't feel right that given night. I just don't think that was the case with Fred last night.

[forevershockerfan]

Utah will lose very few games at home this Season. Very few. Just when it occurred they had us at the 4 minute mark, we put ourselves in a great

position to win in both regulation and the overtime. Our execution that will normally be consistent, fell just a point away. We will regroup, full knowing

that we should be peaking with 8 new players in March and April when it matters the most. Coach Marshall is a master at leading us to success.

[_kai_]

Hey Shocker Fans,

Great Game last night. You have a terrific team. In a perfect world I would love to watch good basketball like that every night. Your team reminds me more of our old Rick Majerus teams....tough nosed defense, disciplined O, no turnovers, good looks at the hoop each time down the court, more physical, on and on.

I think you actually have a much better basketball team skill wise and discipline wise. I think our boys benefited from length and size and the home court atmosphere.

I was at the game last night with my 9 year old son and made him watch Ron Baker all night long. In person Ron Baker is so much more quick and athletic than what I was expecting, he's strong, skilled and smart. His left hand dribble looks stronger than his right hand. Again, I wasn't expecting him to be as quick as he looked in person, his jab step is quick and moves the defender and he has counter after counter move. Very quick and smooth on the quick draw as well.

Overall it looked like the refs leaned our way, but there were several calls that made me scratch my head. I believe the worst ref of the three was the one that went out after being dinged with an elbow....hope he's doing ok.

Like many on here I too wondered why you guys didn't get the ball in the post more often. Perhaps the Ute defense was taking that away. Carter (hope I got that right) seemed to have the ability to do whatever he wanted in the post, even scoring right over the top of our 7' Poeltl and Bachynski. When Poeltl forced him baseline, he casually dropped stepped and scored like it was nothing.

Anyway, like I said, you have a terrific team. Reminds me of Rick Majerus basketball. I attended his camps every year so I really do identify with the style of play that is currently Shocker basketball. Makes me wish I was a shocker fan. Good luck to you guys the rest of the way. Go Shockers and Go Utes!

Cool thing about non conference games is that you can be a fan of that school just as long as they aren't playing each other. Similarly, when we played Colorado a few years ago, I liked them so much I've adopted them as my 2nd team. Thanks for stopping by, thanks for posting, stick around.

[HockeyShock]

Okay, now that I've calmed down:

- We couldn't hit water falling out of a freakin' boat. We got open looks all night and just couldn't get any of them to drop.
- We made some very uncharacteristic mistakes on defense.
- 12 fouls to 3 in the first half. Against a team with a freshman pituitary problem at center? Really? Was it because Shaq clubbed the ref on the tip? That kid is going to be a load for sure, but he got a LOT of hometown calls last night.
- They had absolutely unforgiveable garbage that went in.

And still, we took it to overtime and damn near won it. I don't feel that bad about the loss. Utah is an up-and-coming program and I like them a hell of a lot more than pretty much any other team in the Pac-12. What I feel bad about is the media dismissals that are already happening, namely Sean Keeler's backhanded compliment of a write-up. I swear, he has a Shockernet Trolling checklist that he follows in that article: "mid-major", mention Creighton, mention KU, bring up our record against "name" opponents ...

Then again, we do well with the chip on our shoulder. So there's that.

The good things:
- Kelly and Nurger continue to grow and solidify their roles.
- Fred turning it on under pressure
- Darius feeling comfortable scoring over the trees that they had (pity Higgins had other plans for him)
- Not giving up when literally EVERYTHING was breaking the wrong way.

[bunck]

Nurger played 11:24 and I believe Poeltl was on the floor that entire time as well. Poeltl had 4 points,1-3 FG, 2-2 FT, 3 REB, a block and a PF.
In the remaining time (approximately 24 to 25 minutes), Poeltl had 8 points, 3-3 FG, 2-8 FT, 8 reb, 2 blocks and 2 fouls.

So doubling the stats to adjust from 11:24 to 23:00 minutes, Poeltl would have 8 points, 2-6 FG, 4-4 FT, 6 REB, 2 blocks and two fouls.

The difference in FG% and rebound totals support the "feeling" that Nurger did well.

Nurger also didn't have a single foul last night, but he did only get one rebound.

[Heinro]

The trouble this team has playing 40 minutes makes me want to pull my hair out sometimes. Even though they went 35-1 last year, I sang the same tune all last season as well. Last night the Shox led 33-25 and really felt like they had a chance to open things up a little going to the locker room. Instead, they gave up a 4-0 spurt to cut it to 33-29 at the break. They also had that 5 or 6 minute stretch in the second where they got caught going under screens and got killed with the 3 ball. It felt like they gave up baskets in 3 or 4 minute bunches last night. You can't expect to win games when you're just completely losing it between media timeouts...ESPECIALLY on the defensive end. They have to stop dropping under the high ball screen, it killed them over and over last night. It's not going to be any different in the guard- and shooter- heavy MVC if they don't get this fixed. Despite the 38% shooting, that game was lost on the defensive end. 47% opponent shooting is not Shocker defense. 10 offensive rebounds allowed is not Shocker defense. That's not playing angry. All that said, this is why we love Gregg. We all know he'll right the ship. And it's a lot easier to learn from a loss than from a win. GO SHOCKS!!!

I really want to address your post, which besides the fact of you recognizing runs, you are entirely wrong. In the first half, we tried to hedge but our inexperienced posts couldn't stop the pick and roll. When they showed they were going to go to Poeltl pick and rolls we had no choice to start working under screens. And especially with Loveridge out, I think it was the proper decision. They stepped up and hit shots.

I don't have a problem with Fred shooting that many times. I can only think of 1 shot, in the first half out of a time out, that I thought was way to quick. Toward the end of the game however, they were daring Fred to shoot, having Poeltl stay with the screener. Those are shots he just needs to make, and I'm sure he will. I think this was also a major reason we had a hard time getting it into Carter because they began packing it in and daring our shoooters to shoot.

One thing I would have liked after we go up 1 with 19 seconds left in OT. I'd like to switch Cotton on Wright, but that is just my preference.

Overall I am encouraged by the performance. We lost by 1 in OT to a top 25 program, in a game in which a few of our top players didn't really play all that well, either because of poor shooting or foul trouble. Our young guys have a lot of room to grow and fortunately we'll have about 25 games where they can without it putting the game in doubt. I am expecting 30-3 or 29-4 with a 3-5 seed.

[forevershockerfan]

Utah knew it was their night when one of their players shot a three that bounced higher up than the top of the backboard and fell in the net. They got

Baker in foul trouble with some flops that were lackluster but got the whistles. They also limited Baker's touches which was wise. If Utah could cash in

on the extra 10 throws they were given, they would not have needed the overtime period to barely win by 1 point. Those 2 seven footers were a thorn

in our behinds most of the night on both sides of the floor. It was nice we sold the place out for them. That is what we do.

[im4wsu]

Nurger also didn't have a single foul last night, but he did only get one rebound.

Nurger had 0-1 shooting, 1 rebound, 1 block and 1 turnover.

[jdshock]

That was an impressive shot, and he stepped up when he needed to even on a rough night -- except...

Oh, except, except, except... FVV doesn't need me to tell him, and Marshall may not be worried, but Fred really, really needs to become straight cash at the foul line down the stretch, and at this point he just isn't. Last year's MoState overtime scare could have been a win in regulation (and more comfortable in OT) had Fred taken care of his FT business late. Last night, no need to say anything more.

I know stuff happens, and even the best foul shooters have untimely misses. Wooden's UCLA team stole a championship from Louisville one year when a Cardinal who hadn't missed a free throw ALL YEAR (28 for 28, or something like that) failed to clinch the game with his first miss; I remember the Shocks getting unexpected life against Creighton when one of their FT machines missed in the closing seconds; and my NBA favorite Spurs might well be chasing a threepeat right now if Manu Ginobili (a career .833 FT shooter in the NBA, vs. Fred's career .789 at WSU so far -- which to be sure is pretty good by college standards, but wouldn't it be nice to have those 8-9 extra makes sprinkled in?) hadn't missed one during the fateful last 30 seconds of regulation in game 6 of the 2013 finals against Miami.

So Fred's in good company, and I feel good about seeing him with the ball late in games -- but I'd feel even better if he were more automatic with his late game foul shooting. I have a hunch it's going to happen, because no one is more conscientious and committed to winning (plus, it's something he'll want to do if he has NBA aspirations). And I hope it doesn't come up much during the season because the games aren't that close down the stretch. But when it does come up, I'm eager to see a different outcome next time around.

You're right, obviously. And I don't think we disagree here.

I just wanted to lighten the mood surrounding FVV a bit. He missed a couple of very important free throws. He wouldn't have had the opportunity to do so if he hadn't drained that killer three in regulation. And if I remember right in regards to MoState, he had like 10 of our last 13 points in regulation or something absurd? And against Gonzaga everyone knows the three he drilled.

He missed two important free throws. FVV is still worthy of all of the discussion for national awards.

Like I said before: http://gfycat.com/FluidFrigidBluet

[Jhook89]

I don't necessarily disagree with that but I would point out that Utah was thinking the same way and they made it a point of emphasis to limit Ron's touches and looks as much as possible.

Our recent success has been the result of playing great team oriented basketball and not on riding on the back of a superstar and I don't see that changing.

I believe this team will learn from its failures and Fred will lead the way in that respect.

One thing I believe the Shocks have established though is that even on an off-night quietly into the night they will not go.

I agree. I don't think that anyone should be shooting 19 times for WSU. I wasn't saying that I wanted Baker to shoot 19 times, just saying if someone is to shoot that much, he should be the guy. FVV is running the show and it is his responsibility to get the offense flowing. It seems like he his a little quick to shoot this year. I think FVV is most effective when he is the 3rd or 4th scoring option, so he can focus on managing the game. He seems to be pressing a little bit this year. I'm not sure if that's because he feels pressure to live up to all the preseason hype or what. FVV will probably go down as the best pg in shocker history, but that doesn't mean he doesn't make mistakes from time to time.

[Bob Sacamano]

Someone showed me that "Rock Chalk Blog" tweeted "Wichita State is about to lose their first regular season game in 642 days. Funny things like that happen when you play good teams for once."

Things like that seem to happen to the Chickenhawks even when they're not playing good teams.

[im4wsu]

I confess to not having read the entire thread, but Utah deserves a ton of credit for their defensive scheme and execution. Our offense never did flow, really. We scored, but the assisted basket percentage shows our struggles. That means tougher shots which usually translates into lower percentages.

Opponent	FGM	FGA	3-PTM	3-PTA	Assist	Turnover	% 3-pt att	Asst %
New Mex St	31	63	0	11	11	12	17.5%	17.5%
Memphis	25	62	4	16	13	13	25.8%	21.0%
Newman	35	67	10	23	22	11	34.3%	32.8%
Tulsa	24	54	12	26	18	6	48.1%	33.3%
Utah	24	63	11	30	8	6	47.6%	12.7%

[GoShox]

Apparently there may have been some gamesmanship by the Utes. Read the last bullet in Sully's article today. I'm sure the favor can and will be returned next year.

The Huntsman Center is an excellent basketball venue and the 14,319 fans made plenty of noise. I would rank it behind Utah State and San Diego State, places WSU lost games in recent seasons, for an intimidating atmosphere. When I travel to power-five conference schools, there is always an expectation of luxury awaiting. Instead, the Shockers dressed in a tiny room with no lockers and few showers. Several had to scamper across a hallway in a towel to another locker room to shower. One member of the traveling party asked, “Do you make UCLA dress in here?”

Read more here: http://www.kansas.com/sports/college...#storylink=cpy

[kstarheel]

DC has got to be on the floor and Shaq and Kelly have got to contribute. I still like this team, a lot. Just some holes in the paint.
New streak starts Sat