Koch Arena: Raise the Roof

[C0|dB|00ded]

It's been almost 12 years since the Roundhouse Renovation and with increased costs as well as a coaching salary that is 3x what it was in 2000, we need to start planning again... I don't know exactly what Koch Arena brings in per game, but let's just say with concessions, advertising, SASO, and ticket sales its 250k per game. If we could increase our seating by 33% we could be getting close to another 100k in revenue. That's close to 2M more revenue a year. That would position Wichita State to keep pace with the highest paid coaching jobs in the country.

Any architects in here? I would like to see some rough sketches of Koch Arena with increased seating options.


I know RDR, you said raising the roof isn't feasible. Please remind me again because I forgot why.


T


...:cool:

[Ricardo del Rio]

It's been almost 12 years since the Roundhouse Renovation and with increased costs as well as a coaching salary that is 3x what it was in 2000, we need to start planning again... I don't know exactly what Koch Arena brings in per game, but let's just say with concessions, advertising, SASO, and ticket sales its 250k per game. If we could increase our seating by 33% we could be getting close to another 100k in revenue. That's close to 2M more revenue a year. That would position Wichita State to keep pace with the highest paid coaching jobs in the country.

Any architects in here? I would like to see some rough sketches of Koch Arena with increased seating options.


I know RDR, you said raising the roof isn't feasible. Please remind me again because I forgot why.


T


...:cool:

The primary reason that it is not feasible to raise the roof is because the current facility is not being sold out.

I know. I know. You want a better answer.

[Shockthemonkey]

I would have to agree about the fact that we can't seem to sell out CKA any longer. Why would we make it larger if we can't fill the seats we've got? Its sad because we've got the best product we've had in years and still always just short of a sellout pretty much every night. Look at the IBA game and you start to wonder if the current state of the economy is cutting off discretionary spending for things such as basketball games. I've been a season ticket holder for quite a few years. Every year they raise the prices and I keep sending my money in but when does it stop. I get that a quality D 1 program needs to continue to put more money in to keep raising the bar but it seems to me the higher the ticket prices go the less likely we are to get sell outs. Last night is a prime example, Saturday night and a ranked WSU team for the first time all year and still just short. I know the opponent wasn't great but I also remember the times right after the renovation under Turgeon that it didn't matter who we played. I think everyone agrees we have a better team now than we did then and an overall better program. Are we getting lazy as fans or is it money? Have we had even one sell out this year?

[rrshock]

More seats could actually equal out to cheaper tickets but more revenue. I do think they probably hit their ceiling for ticket prices.

[pogo]

Rather than raise the roof on cka build a new facility and let cka become the volleyball and womens basketball facility. This would address the additional seating CB wants and the volleyball only facility others now want.

[shox1989]

More seats could actually equal out to cheaper tickets but more revenue. I do think they probably hit their ceiling for ticket prices.

I agree. I think that is a good reason for expansion. They have pretty much maximized their revenue with the current seating structure. Since it will be extremely difficult to keep getting more money by raising prices they need to get more money by expanding the number of seats for sale.

[ABC]

Being a 100 seats short of a sell-out is close enough. It is worth the discussion. Ahearn was hardly selling out before KSU moved up to 13,500 Bramlage. Creighton was certainly not selling out Omaha Municipal Arena (Capacity around 10K) befre they move to their rented facilty.

I think an arena around 12,500 would be about right. And remove thos concrete things in the upper regions where oxygen is light.

[WSU Shocker]

Rather than raise the roof on cka build a new facility and let cka become the volleyball and womens basketball facility. This would address the additional seating CB wants and the volleyball only facility others now want.

This is a good idea. A new arena could provide luxury suites, new video board, new sound, etc. Let's do it!

[Kung Wu]

Rather than raise the roof on cka build a new facility and let cka become the volleyball and womens basketball facility. This would address the additional seating CB wants and the volleyball only facility others now want.

Well they should make it a 40,000 seater that can also serve as a football stadium -- just in case.

[C0|dB|00ded]

The primary reason that it is not feasible to raise the roof is because the current facility is not being sold out.

I know. I know. You want a better answer.

Yes, that is a weak answer from you Mr. RDR. You gave me a general contractor-type explanation once alluding to the cost of raising the roof being commensurate with building a whole new facility. I know that backwards-thinking Wichitans would NEVER be able to grasp the concept of a new basketball arena for the Shockers, so we would have to go the "raise the roof" route.

I would have to agree about the fact that we can't seem to sell out CKA any longer. Why would we make it larger if we can't fill the seats we've got? Its sad because we've got the best product we've had in years and still always just short of a sellout pretty much every night. Look at the IBA game and you start to wonder if the current state of the economy is cutting off discretionary spending for things such as basketball games. I've been a season ticket holder for quite a few years. Every year they raise the prices and I keep sending my money in but when does it stop. I get that a quality D 1 program needs to continue to put more money in to keep raising the bar but it seems to me the higher the ticket prices go the less likely we are to get sell outs. Last night is a prime example, Saturday night and a ranked WSU team for the first time all year and still just short. I know the opponent wasn't great but I also remember the times right after the renovation under Turgeon that it didn't matter who we played. I think everyone agrees we have a better team now than we did then and an overall better program. Are we getting lazy as fans or is it money? Have we had even one sell out this year?

Koch Arena's official sell-out capacity is 10,506. Our last game against Directional Colorado was played in front of 10,307 fans. That team was so horrible, they do not deserve to be seen by more than about 1,800, but our fans still came out and bit the bullet. It doesn't matter if we are ranked #1 in the nation, knowledgeable college basketball fans - like Shocker fans - want to see a good game, a challenge if you will, not a cupcake crushing.

The majority of the tickets left at last nights game were either behind a pillar on the top row, or singles scattered throughout the arena. In other words, not very desirable seats. And when your arena is getting close to being sold out, many people don't even try to get a ticket because they know they will either be turned away or offered what the little boy shot at. It's clear we need more capacity.

More seats could actually equal out to cheaper tickets but more revenue. I do think they probably hit their ceiling for ticket prices.

You are correct. A pair of tickets on the front row are going for 24k. We are definitely near our limit. An expanded facility would bolster our bottom line instantly.

Rather than raise the roof on cka build a new facility and let cka become the volleyball and womens basketball facility. This would address the additional seating CB wants and the volleyball only facility others now want.

That would be impossible to sell. Also, I like the idea of Wichita State staying in The Roundhouse.

I agree. I think that is a good reason for expansion. They have pretty much maximized their revenue with the current seating structure. Since it will be extremely difficult to keep getting more money by raising prices they need to get more money by expanding the number of seats for sale.

Yep.

Being a 100 seats short of a sell-out is close enough. It is worth the discussion. Ahearn was hardly selling out before KSU moved up to 13,500 Bramlage. Creighton was certainly not selling out Omaha Municipal Arena (Capacity around 10K) befre they move to their rented facilty.

I think an arena around 12,500 would be about right. And remove thos concrete things in the upper regions where oxygen is light.

I don't think the cost involved with raising the roof would be feasible without a larger capacity increase.. say somewhere in the neighborhood of 13.5k. I'm envisioning a VERY steep upper deck in roundhouse fashion with the roof extending out beyond the current base. I think our arena would basically end up looking like a big mushroom, but who cares.

I also wouldn't be against installing benches for the upper deck. If the pricks up in Lawrence can sit on benches, so can our upper-deck Shocker fans. It would make the overall expansion smaller because you can really pack people into benches. Then we could start renting chair-backs for the benches again (like the old days) adding another revenue source.

A smaller expansion (thanks to the benches) relative to a fairly large capacity increase (around 3k), equals an even more deafening arena. We could be popping ear drums if we built it right.

I guarantee you that if we had 13.5k seats this year, we would average over 13k per game.

P.S.

Where are my drawings artists?


T


...:cool:

[Kung Wu]

Isn't the object in optimizing pricing to find the right prices to just barely NOT sell out? If you sell out every game your ticket prices are too low and it's very difficult to know HOW low. If you just barely miss the sellout you have learned what the market will bring and feel very confident in your price startegy. If you badly miss the sellout you have way overpriced them. Isn't it that simple?

[shocks02]

Isn't the object in optimizing pricing to find the right prices to just barely NOT sell out? If you sell out every game your ticket prices are too low and it's very difficult to know HOW low. If you just barely miss the sellout you have learned what the market will bring and feel very confident in your price startegy. If you badly miss the sellout you have way overpriced them. Isn't it that simple?

Yeah, elasticity of demand. I'm sure as Shocker fans though we have different objectives, like number of consecutive sell-outs and butts in every seat.

[pinstripers]

"I'm envisioning a VERY steep upper deck in roundhouse fashion with the roof extending out beyond the current base. I think our arena would basically end up looking like a big mushroom, but who cares."


I'm not a marine biologist, but I don't think this deal works.

[Kung Wu]

"I'm envisioning a VERY steep upper deck in roundhouse fashion with the roof extending out beyond the current base. I think our arena would basically end up looking like a big mushroom, but who cares."


I'm not a marine biologist, but I don't think this deal works.

There is NO WAY I'm giving our K-State buddies a chance to call our house The Circle of Shroom.

[C0|dB|00ded]

"I'm envisioning a VERY steep upper deck in roundhouse fashion with the roof extending out beyond the current base. I think our arena would basically end up looking like a big mushroom, but who cares."


I'm not a marine biologist, but I don't think this deal works.

I don't know anything about construction other than arches and duct tape are very, very strong.


T


...:cool: