NORTH TEXAS (7-5, 0-0) at WICHITA STATE (8-5, 0-0) Game Thread

[pinstripers]

I couldn't listen to the postgame. Anybody listen?

[SubGod22]

Oh. After careful analysis I have finally figured out why we are struggling this season:

WE CAN'T SHOOT!

We also can't pass, which doesn't help with the shooting.

Our team defense is just bad.

If this continues, this team isn't winning back fans. They're not packing The Roundhouse. They're doing more harm than good.

At least when Marshall was losing early on, you could see what he was building. You could see the identity he was trying to instill. You never questioned the teams effort. They always fought hard and were appreciated. Can we say any of that about this team right now?

Who is this team? Is there any accountability? We got some guys making a lot of the same bonehead plays over and over. I still don't know why Joy has been exiled after showing so much promise when he was given the opportunity to get on the court. His effort was never in question when we saw him. And I can live with some mistakes from young guys more than veterans doing the same crap.

Mills better toughen this team up or he's going to lose the fans. And fans have already been hesitant.

[asiseeit]

Was glad to see someone besides myself (Aargh) with his #7 comment that the problem with KP is the SYSTEM. KP was a really big contributor the second half of last season. He can't and won't be productive in PM's "system". I've been saying this now for quite awhile. He was not the problem last night taking only four shots hitting two. We have too many below average players playing for their own stat lines, poor court vision, poor ball movement, too much dribbling, and only one shooter in CR. No post/paint threat with KP in the corner and QB has no good offensive post ability. The players have not adapted to Mills and Mills has not adapted to the players. I don't see us improving unless we start posting up KP to get defenses to sag off the perimeter a little more and we find another perimeter shooter opposite side of the court than CR. Then, move/pass the darn ball and make the defense work. We are way to easy to defend especially with KP in the corner.

[Singeril]

Is it just me or does it seem like we have had huge gaps in our home schedule? More so than usual? And I'm not saying that's a bad thing.

I made nearly the same comment before the KU game…not only has there been gaps at home, there have been gaps between all games. We had a period of 3 weeks with only 3 games. Not sure we’ve ever had that in the past. There just seems to not be any rhythm to anything and I think the gaps are a part of that.

[Singeril]

Was glad to see someone besides myself (Aargh) with his #7 comment that the problem with KP is the SYSTEM. KP was a really big contributor the second half of last season. He can't and won't be productive in PM's "system". I've been saying this now for quite awhile. He was not the problem last night taking only four shots hitting two. We have too many below average players playing for their own stat lines, poor court vision, poor ball movement, too much dribbling, and only one shooter in CR. No post/paint threat with KP in the corner and QB has no good offensive post ability. The players have not adapted to Mills and Mills has not adapted to the players. I don't see us improving unless we start posting up KP to get defenses to sag off the perimeter a little more and we find another perimeter shooter opposite side of the court than CR. Then, move/pass the darn ball and make the defense work. We are way too e,easy to defend especially with KP in the corner.

Disagree completely…two plays from last night sum up KP’s playing for much of this year. There was the time he started dribbling at the top of the key only to have it immediately stripped from him. What he’s doing with the ball and trying to act like a guard that far from the basket is ridiculous. Then, there was the time when he fouled about 40 feet from the basket…a bone head foul for no reason. His hands are like rocks at times. He spins predictably when going one on and and then doesn’t finish strong. So disappointing.

[Topshock]

I was there. It was very frustrating.

However, I found it interesting that during 3 timeouts CM was so furious with these players he couldn't even stand to talk to them. Literally ignored them. This along with his post game remarks leads me to believe he is disgusted with their play as we are. Somehow, I find that comforting.

I think CM knows where we need to be. To get there quite a few players on this team with eligibility left need to find another place to play. For the players not playing, I say if you can't play on this team then you will never play for us on a team that is actually good.

That was pretty much how GM ran things. If a player wasn't good enough to get on the floor, even as a freshman, then find someone that is.

[Stickboy46]

Was glad to see someone besides myself (Aargh) with his #7 comment that the problem with KP is the SYSTEM. KP was a really big contributor the second half of last season. He can't and won't be productive in PM's "system".

Most players will not be productive in PMs "system" at this level. His system relies on having more skilled players than his opponent. If you look at his gaudy 30-5 record last year. It was 30 wins against 4 non-D1 teams, 3 wins vs teams KenPom 150-200, and 22 wins vs KenPom 200+. Only 1 win versus a Top 150 team (Liberty at 48). The losses were all Top 70 and were losses by 8, 10, 13, 23, and 38. His system is just not going to consistently produce wins against higher talent teams.

We have too many below average players playing for their own stat lines, poor court vision, poor ball movement, too much dribbling, and only one shooter in CR. No post/paint threat with KP in the corner and QB has no good offensive post ability. The players have not adapted to Mills and Mills has not adapted to the players.

Same as above .. its the system. They aren't "playing for their own stat lines" .. its literally the "team" offense that Mills runs. Its goal it to move the ball to get a matchup they want then have one on one play to try to score. It works when you are consistently playing teams that are 250, or 300 in the rankings because you can normally find better talent to do that. When the other team has the same or better talent you get the junk we saw last night, or vs KU, or vs Liberty.

So this is what we should expect because its what 99% of Mill's history is. We will beat the majority of the low level teams and rarely beat anyone with a pulse. Mills is either going to have to recruit better than he ever has before or change his system.

[shocker43]

Disagree completely…two plays from last night sum up KP’s playing for much of this year. There was the time he started dribbling at the top of the key only to have it immediately stripped from him. What he’s doing with the ball and trying to act like a guard that far from the basket is ridiculous. Then, there was the time when he fouled about 40 feet from the basket…a bone head foul for no reason. His hands are like rocks at times. He spins predictably when going one on and and then doesn’t finish strong. So disappointing.

Early in the second half or the end of the first half, KP got an iso backdown opportunity and got walled-up by a guy at least 5" shorter than him.

[Stickboy46]

Early in the second half or the end of the first half, KP got an iso backdown opportunity and got walled-up by a guy at least 5" shorter than him.

KP gets Walled-Up by someone at least 80% of the time he tries to go in the post this year. It normally ends up with him throwing his body into the opponent, the ball going no where near the basket, Kenny flailing and a fast break the other way.

[Topshock]

Most players will not be productive in PMs "system" at this level. His system relies on having more skilled players than his opponent. If you look at his gaudy 30-5 record last year. It was 30 wins against 4 non-D1 teams, 3 wins vs teams KenPom 150-200, and 22 wins vs KenPom 200+. Only 1 win versus a Top 150 team (Liberty at 48). The losses were all Top 70 and were losses by 8, 10, 13, 23, and 38. His system is just not going to consistently produce wins against higher talent teams.



Same as above .. its the system. They aren't "playing for their own stat lines" .. its literally the "team" offense that Mills runs. Its goal it to move the ball to get a matchup they want then have one on one play to try to score. It works when you are consistently playing teams that are 250, or 300 in the rankings because you can normally find better talent to do that. When the other team has the same or better talent you get the junk we saw last night, or vs KU, or vs Liberty.

So this is what we should expect because its what 99% of Mill's history is. We will beat the majority of the low level teams and rarely beat anyone with a pulse. Mills is either going to have to recruit better than he ever has before or change his system.

While I don't necessarily disagree with your analysis. Really it just come down to this.

If we have better players we will beat good teams. Pretty much how it is in every system.

[Stickboy46]

While I don't necessarily disagree with your analysis. Really it just come down to this.

If we have better players we will beat good teams. Pretty much how it is in every system.

Eh, slightly disagree. I think there are plenty of examples of good systems elevating players .. we've seen that even here at WSU. You are much more likely to overcome a "talent" problem which a system that is designed to help the players.

[asiseeit]

Early in the second half or the end of the first half, KP got an iso backdown opportunity and got walled-up by a guy at least 5" shorter than him.

You can point to a few isolated plays I can refer you to about the last 15 full games last season when he was posting up pretty well.......he is not being played as a post up player now and as a result probably losing the confidence he had gained last season

[Walker]

At least when Marshall was losing early on, you could see what he was building. You could see the identity he was trying to instill. You never questioned the teams effort. They always fought hard and were appreciated. Can we say any of that about this team right now?

That is the contrast that has really stood out to me too. 3G's first couple of seasons were rough but the players seemed to take on that gritty, tough identity even early on when they may get their asses kicked but they were going to fight and give their all. Always had the feeling that better days were ahead.

The jump ball in the first half where KP went to the ground, it was like he was trying to comfortably lay down on the ground rather than dive and fight for the ball. Frustratingly soft for a dude that has shown potential at times. I know it's not fair to compare HCPM to 3G and he still needs more time before we make judgements but man, the low energy effort (with a few exceptions) is really standing out.

[Singeril]

You can point to a few isolated plays I can refer you to about the last 15 full games last season when he was posting up pretty well.......he is not being played as a post up player now and as a result probably losing the confidence he had gained last season

It’s not “a few isolated plays”…it’s happening every game multiple times.

[newshock1234]

Mils biggest mistake was begging Pohto to come back. That dude SOFT