Jake White

[Aargh]

As a junior, Wilson (with a weaker team, according to your comments) went to the Sweet 16. Do you see White (with a stronger team) doing the same?

PS: The X-man faced some tough competition when he got here. Did he let that stop him? (It sounds like you are making excuses for Jake White.)

You have missed the point badly. There was essentially NO competition for minutes at PF during the time Wilson was here. Kampman had a subpar Sr. season, Ryan Martin did pretty well considering how seriously undersized he was, and Thomasson was a recruiting mistake brought in to replace a recruiting mistake. Wilson was going to get every minute available when he was not in foul trouble.

This year, White is obviously behind Hall. Next year Watson is here. White is not going to get the minutes Wilson got, so comparing stats will never be appropriate. I'll take White's "per 40 minute" stats against Wilson's. Wilson was maybe a little quicker and maybe a little smoother, but White is going to get the edge when it comes to "lunch pail" and "garbage man". Those aren't endearing terms, but they describe things that win basketball games.

Wilson was uncanny at hitting clutch 3's and FT's. From the reports I've read, it seems that White is working hard at being effective in those areas.

[SpanglerFan316]

Aargh: I hope White is great this year. I did not miss the point about the depth at some (all?) positions. However I think people here are being inconsistent.

Hypothesis 1. White is (at least) as good as Wilson and, on the same team (2005-6 or 2012-13), they would get similar minutes and have similar (overall) stats.

Hypothesis 2. White is not as good as Wilson.

Under hypothesis 1, White is on a deeper (better?) team than Wilson. Wilson's team went to the Sweet 16. One should therefore expect WSU to go to the Sweet 16 in 2013 (or 2014 if you want junior seasons to be the standard). Are you predicting this?

[SpanglerFan316]

You have missed the point badly.

You seem to assume that Marshall's system would not allow White to score around 9 points per game. (Wilson scored 9.8 points per game as a sophomore.) In 2011-12, four players averaged 9.8 or more points per game and six averaged 8.4 or more points per game. https://admin.xosn.com/fls/7500/stat...DB_OEM_ID=7500 In 2004-5, four players averaged 9.8 or more points per game with the fifth player averaging 7.5 points per game. http://admin.xosn.com/fls/7500/stats...DB_OEM_ID=7500 The opportunity to average approximately 9 points per game seems to be about the same under Marshall in 2011-12 as under MT in 2004-5.

This year, White is obviously behind Hall. Next year Watson is here. White is not going to get the minutes Wilson got, so comparing stats will never be appropriate. I'll take White's "per 40 minute" stats against Wilson's. Wilson was maybe a little quicker and maybe a little smoother, but White is going to get the edge when it comes to "lunch pail" and "garbage man". Those aren't endearing terms, but they describe things that win basketball games.

[proshox]

I like Jake's potential as well. I was really hoping he would redshirt last year, but it just did not work out with last season's depth...

[im4wsu]

That would 16.2% of all missed shots while he was in the game. I believe EOs numbers were a text error...probably more like 19.9%.

It was a typo by may continually-gaining-weight FAT fingers. EO's percentage should be 15.9%

[im4wsu]

Not sure if @im4wsu does this or not, but if you use the reb/40 min of the player and divide that by the average total rebounds in a game (69.5 last season) you can get a pretty good idea.

I determine the numbers by going through the play-by-play stat line, determining the number of missed shots while the specific player is in the game. This is the denominator, the numerator is the number of rebounds. You can find similar stat on statsheet.com, but sometimes there source data contains errors as to the times various players were in the games, so the results are slightly different.

[SubGod22]

I could see where White could average 8+ points this year even if he's not starting. He should get 15-20 minutes per game or so and with the way he rebounds, he'll find ways to score. And if he's shooting better from outside, that'll help. This kid is a warrior and I'm glad we have him in the program. He's a definite keeper and I could see certain scenarios where he could start this year, although I'm not banking on it.

As far as the Wilson comparison, they are very similar types of players. But you can't compare stats straight up on different teams and with different coaches and against different competition. You can, but they don't tell the whole story. Regardless, I'm excited about Jake and what he brings to the table.

[ShockTalk]

I could see where White could average 8+ points this year even if he's not starting. He should get 15-20 minutes per game or so and with the way he rebounds, he'll find ways to score. And if he's shooting better from outside, that'll help. This kid is a warrior and I'm glad we have him in the program. He's a definite keeper and I could see certain scenarios where he could start this year, although I'm not banking on it.

As far as the Wilson comparison, they are very similar types of players. But you can't compare stats straight up on different teams and with different coaches and against different competition. You can, but they don't tell the whole story. Regardless, I'm excited about Jake and what he brings to the table.

Whether Jake starts or not is going to be up to EO and Lufile. I have no idea (yet) how valuable Lufile will be, particularly early in the season and, if EO is pretty much the same EO of old, I could certainly see Hall starting at the 5 with Jake at the 4 (and I'd have no problem with that). More than likely, this isn't going to happen as I think EO will be given every opportunity to show his worth, especially at the beginning of a game. That said, I wouldn't be surprised to see Jake finish games over EO and Lufile.

[SubGod22]

Whether Jake starts or not is going to be up to EO and Lufile. I have no idea (yet) how valuable Lufile will be, particularly early in the season and, if EO is pretty much the same EO of old, I could certainly see Hall starting at the 5 with Jake at the 4 (and I'd have no problem with that). More than likely, this isn't going to happen as I think EO will be given every opportunity to show his worth, especially at the beginning of a game. That said, I wouldn't be surprised to see Jake finish games over EO and Lufile.

That's pretty much what I was thinking when I said that. I do think Ehimen will be given every chance and I think he'll be mostly successful at it. But if not...

And Lufile is a wildcard right now. Haven't seen him play but he has the tools to be a valuable asset. How valuable is still to be determined

[wufan]

Jake's shooting touch alone, versus the three posts, will keep him in at the end of tight games.

[Kung Wu]

The big question is: Will EO's inexperience drive Marshall nuts 3 minutes into the game, causing him to yank him? Or will EO truly have evolved and learned how to spell X and O using a basketball font?

[BOBB]

I hope I'm wrong, but the big guy seeing more than ten minutes seems very wishful.

[another shocker]

I'm not concerned about Jake White this year. He will play more than he did last year, and he will contribute more.

EO concerns me a bit. He has to somehow develop a killer instinct. Demand the ball. The lane belongs to him. We'll see. The good thing is, Wichita State doesn't have to depend on him as much as some people may believe (it would be nice to keep him in the game, blocking shots left and right, though).

[forevershockerfan]

EO seems to have better hands than his arrival to 21st and Hillside. However, improvement is still needed. Even so, I look for him pass the rock to the open man unless he is open to score. Our over-all depth on our bigs really solidified when Chadrack signed. Hall will be our leader inside and he plays the D quite well.

Wiggin's will be a key player for us. He's got some serious game skills.

[another shocker]

EO seems to have better hands than his arrival to 21st and Hillside. However, improvement is still needed. Even so, I look for him pass the rock to the open man unless he is open to score. Our over-all depth on our bigs really solidified when Chadrack signed. Hall will be our leader inside and he plays the D quite well.

Wiggin's will be a key player for us. He's got some serious game skills.

Who is that African center at Louisville U? He's not any more talented or gifted than Orupke, physically- but he is more aggresive and hard nosed. EO needs to get pissed off- or something.

Jake White should alleviate EO's work on the boards. Weak side rebounding is ALL Jake White in the MVC. Get the f*%* in there, on your side, EO.