Shockers-Redbirds Gamethread

[wu_shizzle]

Let me get this straight:

Jackie Carmichael plays 8 minutes in the first half due to fouls. Plays soft the entire second half due to foul trouble. John Wilkins gets a first technical due to "retaliating" from Stutz's scissor hold. He later gets a second for speaking French.

If you really believe any of that mess, you are delusional my Redbird friend.

In the post game presser Garrett said "I mean how can you warn a guy 15-20 times without calling a foul?"

That's from the horse's mouth...

[Rlh04d]

Let me get this straight:

Jackie Carmichael plays 8 minutes in the first half due to fouls. Plays soft the entire second half due to foul trouble. John Wilkins gets a first technical due to "retaliating" from Stutz's scissor hold. He later gets a second for speaking French.

And we win because the refs gave us preferential treatment? GMAFB!

Listen, I really like Wichita State. I hope with all my heart you guys go far in the NCAAs. You guys have great players, devoted fans, and create amazing atmosphere around your program. But give credit where it's due. Illinois State wanted it more today. Drop the bitterness and root for them to beat Creighton. Let's get the Valley another team in the tournament.

Personally, my problem with the referees wasn't that the calls were one-sided. I think there were a lot of bad calls on both sides with no consistency. The same exact play would result in different calls at different times.

I think your picture of the "scissor hold" is a bit one-sided, though. The two of them were playing all over each other every step of the game, almost entirely driven by Wilkins, and that they were both on the ground was hardly anything new. They were always on the ground, because the refs didn't do anything to stop it. Wilkins elbowing him in the face drew a technical, whether it was on purpose or not.

My main problem with the officiating is that they didn't attempt to stop what was almost a fist-fight on the floor between Stutz and Wilkins. They finally had to over-do it by throwing Wilkins out, but any halfway decent officiating would have stopped the overly physical play between them five minutes into the first half, not when you had to call a double technical half way through the second.

If this is the way games are called in the Valley, and we're just a physical conference, then fine. But I've never seen a Valley game called like that. Ever.

And you can point to Carmichael's foul trouble, but Stutz had 4, EO had 3, and Hall had 4, and the three combined for 35 minutes. 11 fouls from one position? Carmichael still had almost more time played than all three of them ... 26 minutes and four fouls versus 35 minutes and 11 fouls. Even when Wilkins was thrown out, he only had 2 in 24 minutes. That's a huge foul discrepancy for what was essentially a brawl in the paint.

I'm absolutely pulling for ISU in the finals. And I'll be pulling for you in the NCAA tourney if you get there. And I whole-heartedly believe we lost that game because we shot poorly. But the officiating was still awful.

[Capitol Shock II]

That.

[1979Shocker]

If you really believe any of that mess, you are delusional my Redbird friend.

In the post game presser Garrett said "I mean how can you warn a guy 15-20 times without calling a foul?"

That's from the horse's mouth...

I heard Stutz say that in the postgame, but I never saw the refs actually warn a player 15-20 times, unless it was all off camera.

[newshock1234]

I'm in the belief that the ref shouldnt make that call at the end. Let the players determine the outcome

[Capitol Shock II]

Okay. So we have five losses now. One by a point, one in overtime, one in double overtime and we have never been blown out. Illinois State hit shots they normally don't, outshot us from the foul line and got most of the calls and we played poorly and had two good looks to win it in regulation. Its basketball, we are dancing and there's no telling how far this team can go.

[ShockerKhan]

I heard Stutz say that in the postgame, but I never saw the refs actually warn a player 15-20 times, unless it was all off camera.

If you ever sit close enough to hear the conversations between the refs and players while play is going on they are communicating with the players downlow continuously.
Especially when the play is as physical as it was today. That is what Garrett was refering to. It gets pretty frustrating when they call a foul on you and keep warning the other guy.

[shox1989]

We have tried to start an alternate MVC board at mvcbbs.com. However, many have been scared to join.

@SubGod22 has been trying to keep it going, however with my recent work schedule, I have been unable to up with it. The site has many boards of many conferences and teams. LOTS of great converstaion.

This is the first that I have heard of this alternate board. Why would people be SCARED to join? I just bet most people don't know it exists.

[shox1989]

Personally, my problem with the referees wasn't that the calls were one-sided. I think there were a lot of bad calls on both sides with no consistency. The same exact play would result in different calls at different times.

I think your picture of the "scissor hold" is a bit one-sided, though. The two of them were playing all over each other every step of the game, almost entirely driven by Wilkins, and that they were both on the ground was hardly anything new. They were always on the ground, because the refs didn't do anything to stop it. Wilkins elbowing him in the face drew a technical, whether it was on purpose or not.

My main problem with the officiating is that they didn't attempt to stop what was almost a fist-fight on the floor between Stutz and Wilkins. They finally had to over-do it by throwing Wilkins out, but any halfway decent officiating would have stopped the overly physical play between them five minutes into the first half, not when you had to call a double technical half way through the second.

If this is the way games are called in the Valley, and we're just a physical conference, then fine. But I've never seen a Valley game called like that. Ever.

And you can point to Carmichael's foul trouble, but Stutz had 4, EO had 3, and Hall had 4, and the three combined for 35 minutes. 11 fouls from one position? Carmichael still had almost more time played than all three of them ... 26 minutes and four fouls versus 35 minutes and 11 fouls. Even when Wilkins was thrown out, he only had 2 in 24 minutes. That's a huge foul discrepancy for what was essentially a brawl in the paint.

I'm absolutely pulling for ISU in the finals. And I'll be pulling for you in the NCAA tourney if you get there. And I whole-heartedly believe we lost that game because we shot poorly. But the officiating was still awful.

THIS! AND GO REDBIRDS! Tomorrow and in the post season!

[WSUwatcher]

Riminding myself we did great things after losing this game last year.

A nice historical reminder, as is Prez's rejoinder.

Tough game, off day shooting, dubious (to be generous) officiating, probably still recovering from illness -- could that have been a factor with Hall? -- and the Shocks still had two clean shots to win at the end. The sun will rise tomorrow, the guys will rest and recover, and I agree with observation I saw earlier about how this game will help them be ready for physical play in the tournament that matters most. Best of all, in the NCAA, when other guys push, the Shocks get to push back. That helped them in the NIT last year, and I expect it to do so in the main event this year.

[wu_shizzle]

The shots were there for the making and we decided to brick 41 of them. No matter how you slice it, or how horrible you think the officiating was, we missed FORTY ONE SHOTS. We're the 14th ranked team in the nation, we shouldn't go 7 minutes without a FG unless we're wearing mittens.

The number 3 team in the country went 7 minutes without a bucket tonight, it happens.

[TrueViewWSU]

You shocker fans are so funny. You get bumped around in the paint for one game and you think the whole conference is out to get you. Newsflash....Doug has been getting beaten up in the post all year long just like you guys did today (supposedly). Not once do you hear Doug or Greg b*tch about it....they just play through it. Doug continues to play amazing despite this contact.

Why don't you guys grow up and take your beating and stop whining.

GTFO MOTHAF****ER

[TrueViewWSU]

Couldn't care less...were still playing and youre not. Your coach is the big whiner.

I hope Illinois State DESTROYS you tomorrow.

Heavy favorite BJ's couldn't even win the league with their luscious All-American they stole from UNI. Lost it by 2 games and you were bitchslapped on your home floor.

[TrueViewWSU]

Shocker fans' arrogance and sense of entitlement is amusing. Must be something in the water in Kansas. KU fans are the same way. Annoying

Yet you've found yourself here posting on Shockernet after their 5th loss of the season. This is total sCUm 101 and why everyone in this f****** conference hates you. I can't wait to watch you lose and I will LOVE every minute of it.

[TrueViewWSU]

Are we still on admin approval registration?

How does that account even get approved?

A sCUm fan with a name like that gets approved. A dedicated Shocker fan gets banned from this site for defending this place from these parasites. (Yep, I couldn't let this go. This is the Fever..)