2021-22 Coaches Shows with Isaac Brown

[RoyalShock]

I'll also add that last year's team was the worst WSU team per KenPom and Torvik since Marshall's second year in 08-09. This team is even worse in both.

08-09 is also the last time a WSU team had an assist-to-turnover ratio less than 1.0, just like we have now. Not an encouraging sign.

[WuDrWu]

89-09 is also the last time a WSU team had an assist-to-turnover ratio less than 1.0, just like we have now. Not an encouraging sign.

Just for clarification, what is the typo there?

Did you mean 89-90 or 08-09?

[CBB_Fan]

Like I said, I didn't expect my opinion to be popular. In every game aside from North Texas, I felt that our players played 40 minutes with good body language. I did not see that in Marshall's last years. People acting like the loss to North Texas is some type of horrible testament against the program's state as-is seem to have forcibly forgotten the lows before hand. A 10-point loss to North Texas (20 points lower in KenPom) is bad, but again, we win this game healthy and were winning healthy. It isn't anything close to the shame of the other team having an 8 in the tens digit and us having a 4.

Sure, we aren't playing good basketball. But we've played mostly competitive bad basketball to this point, and only minutes this season I haven't wanted to watch were those North Texas injury minutes. If this team was coached in the Gregg Marshall style, I think we'd have no better basketball and worse chemistry. I don't think Gregg Marshall wins the AAC last year with that squad, I don't think he is 8-3 with this one. Same bad basketball, more rotten apples and players already looking off-campus for their future. As far as poor depth goes, did we just block out the fact that we were forced to elevate Samajae, who didn't play at all starting Feb. his junior year, to a point where he broke the school's 38 year old minutes record as a senior?

Throwing in the towel at this point is silly and revisionist IMHO. This isn't a low point in the last five years, not even close.

[SubGod22]

I don't think you you have any clue of what you're talking about.

[asiseeit]

I'd have to agree with SubG

[Shocker_Power]

But we've played mostly competitive bad basketball to this point.

This needs to be on a sign as you leave the Shocker locker room. "Play mostly competitive bad basketball today!"

[Woodrow]

Like I said, I didn't expect my opinion to be popular. In every game aside from North Texas, I felt that our players played 40 minutes with good body language. I did not see that in Marshall's last years. People acting like the loss to North Texas is some type of horrible testament against the program's state as-is seem to have forcibly forgotten the lows before hand. A 10-point loss to North Texas (20 points lower in KenPom) is bad, but again, we win this game healthy and were winning healthy. It isn't anything close to the shame of the other team having an 8 in the tens digit and us having a 4.

Sure, we aren't playing good basketball. But we've played mostly competitive bad basketball to this point, and only minutes this season I haven't wanted to watch were those North Texas injury minutes. If this team was coached in the Gregg Marshall style, I think we'd have no better basketball and worse chemistry. I don't think Gregg Marshall wins the AAC last year with that squad, I don't think he is 8-3 with this one. Same bad basketball, more rotten apples and players already looking off-campus for their future. As far as poor depth goes, did we just block out the fact that we were forced to elevate Samajae, who didn't play at all starting Feb. his junior year, to a point where he broke the school's 38 year old minutes record as a senior?

Throwing in the towel at this point is silly and revisionist IMHO. This isn't a low point in the last five years, not even close.

In 2020 Marshall's team came back from 24 down in the 2nd half to beat SMU. Looked like they played 40 minutes in that game. Let's see how things look after the upcoming Memphis home game and Houston road game. We should have a pretty good idea what this team and coaching staff is capable of by then. Gregg Marshall's success over many years speaks for itself.

[Windiwu]

If they win the Memphis game then lose at Houston by 10 or 12 is anyone at ALL on this board going to be less than unhappy?

[WuTheOne]

In 2020 Marshall's team came back from 24 down in the 2nd half to beat SMU. Looked like they played 40 minutes in that game.

Played all 40 minutes and managed to get down by 24?

IB inherited a team with 4 contributors who had been in the program, plus Poor Bear and Bilau. That left him with 7 guys in their first year in the program, and 2 who had been here but had never been contributors.

PG has been an ongoing vacancy since FVV graduated. The one and only actual PG (who stuck around) on the roster after FVV was Gilbert for one year. IB has been working with first-year PG's. Porter is adequate, but he's not in the same league as Armstead or Hannah

When a D1 team has 4 returning players with any hope of contributing, it's a rebuild and likely to be a multi-year rebuild.

The coaches and writers saw what happened to WSU 2 years ago and picked the Shox to finish 7th in the league with Marshall coaching the team. IB far exceeded the expectations of those outside of the WSU fan base, but is now being criticized because he's not Gregg Marshall.

IB is taking more heat for losing to K-State and NT than Marshall took for losing to Evansville with a F4 team.

[BOBB]

People on here are acting like two things can't be true at the same time. The trajectory of the program under Marshall was down. Period. End of story. The current team struggling under Isaac Brown doesn't make that any less true.

By some combination of luck, covid, and a lights out year from Tyson we ended up winning the conference last year. That doesn't make Isaac Brown a great coach. The current team ain't great and I have some real questions as to whether coach Brown is the one to lead us forward. But, I don't see any scenario where we're in a better place if coach Marshall is still patrolling the sideline.

[ShockingButTrue]

Nice, but I wasn't comparing IB's teams to that team. I was comparing IB's teams to each Marshall team after that.

Yeah, but none of them won the AAC either.

And besides, what was your point? Oh, wait...

CHUCK.png

[ShockingButTrue]

By some combination of luck, covid, and a lights out year from Tyson we ended up winning the conference last year. That doesn't make Isaac Brown a great coach. The current team ain't great and I have some real questions as to whether coach Brown is the one to lead us forward. But, I don't see any scenario where we're in a better place if coach Marshall is still patrolling the sideline.

Say what? The team is currently 24-9 (8-3 this year) overall under IB, with an AAC banner, and Lady Luck is the real culprit? And a 6'7 post manning the pivot? Brown had nothing to do with it? What next, Valley teams only whipped the Chickens in the NCAA tournament because it wasn't a best-of-7?

Wow

[Woodrow]

Played all 40 minutes and managed to get down by 24?

IB inherited a team with 4 contributors who had been in the program, plus Poor Bear and Bilau. That left him with 7 guys in their first year in the program, and 2 who had been here but had never been contributors.

PG has been an ongoing vacancy since FVV graduated. The one and only actual PG (who stuck around) on the roster after FVV was Gilbert for one year. IB has been working with first-year PG's. Porter is adequate, but he's not in the same league as Armstead or Hannah

When a D1 team has 4 returning players with any hope of contributing, it's a rebuild and likely to be a multi-year rebuild.

The coaches and writers saw what happened to WSU 2 years ago and picked the Shox to finish 7th in the league with Marshall coaching the team. IB far exceeded the expectations of those outside of the WSU fan base, but is now being criticized because he's not Gregg Marshall.

IB is taking more heat for losing to K-State and NT than Marshall took for losing to Evansville with a F4 team.

Gregg Marshall took a team that lost to Evansville all the way to a final 4. I'm not anti IB and he might turn out to be a great coach. Its just too soon to tell, and there appears to be some troubling trends. However, Gregg Marshall was/is a great coach. You will not convince anyone IB is better than GM at this point. If IB wins an NIT championship, goes to a sweet 16, and a final 4 then we can have that debate.

[shock]

There is a lot of stupid in this thread.

[molly jabali]

People on here are acting like two things can't be true at the same time. The trajectory of the program under Marshall was down. Period. End of story. The current team struggling under Isaac Brown doesn't make that any less true.

By some combination of luck, covid, and a lights out year from Tyson we ended up winning the conference last year. That doesn't make Isaac Brown a great coach. The current team ain't great and I have some real questions as to whether coach Brown is the one to lead us forward. But, I don't see any scenario where we're in a better place if coach Marshall is still patrolling the sideline.

Trust me, I’m not a believer that Marshall was infallible,but to me the BIG question about him would have been how good his NEXT team would have been how the implosion not taken place … If all had stayed I could see sweet 16 EASY … but they didn’t so…..