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  • The New Look Shox

    With the recruits we're seeing, there will be a change in the style of defense.

    The big bulky players are gone. Instead we have a lot of athletic, long, and lean players. When I've seen those players on other teams, they don't try to stop drives to the hoop. They let the driver past, outleap them from the side and block their shot instead of trying to be more physical. That reduces fouls on drives.

    A 6'5" skywalker can be a rim protector, so the perimeter guys will be able to gamble a bit more into the passing lanes.

    I only had one physics class, but that's all it took for me to learn that a 220 lb guy needs less energy to elevate his body than a 270 lb. guy.
    The future's so bright - I gotta wear shades.
    We like to cut down nets and get sized for championship rings.

  • #2
    Originally posted by Aargh View Post
    With the recruits we're seeing, there will be a change in the style of defense.

    The big bulky players are gone. Instead we have a lot of athletic, long, and lean players. When I've seen those players on other teams, they don't try to stop drives to the hoop. They let the driver past, outleap them from the side and block their shot instead of trying to be more physical. That reduces fouls on drives.

    A 6'5" skywalker can be a rim protector, so the perimeter guys will be able to gamble a bit more into the passing lanes.

    I only had one physics class, but that's all it took for me to learn that a 220 lb guy needs less energy to elevate his body than a 270 lb. guy.
    Appreciate your post... But we don't have to put down the "big, bulky players" just to make our new recruits that no one when knows how they good or bad they are. This post is so tunnel visioned. I get your intentions, but bringing down past shockers to pump up the future ones is not the way to do it. GoShox

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    • #3
      Originally posted by choida View Post

      Appreciate your post... But we don't have to put down the "big, bulky players" just to make our new recruits that no one when knows how they good or bad they are. This post is so tunnel visioned. I get your intentions, but bringing down past shockers to pump up the future ones is not the way to do it. GoShox
      I don’t see that as putting down former players at all.
      When you believe in something, the only person that's gotta believe it is you. Everything else is for the birds.- LeVelle Moton
      Wichita is going to the rich side of town with a pack of matches and a five gallon tank of gasoline and try to burn everything to the ground

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      • #4
        I really hope I don’t see anyone purposefully letting their man by them next year on a regular basis.

        Other than that I agree the additional length in the WSU defensive system could be really stifling.

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        • #5
          There are many elite shot blockers who block shots from behind or beside a shooter rather than in front of the shooter. If a rim protector is having an opponent driving strraight into his chest, that 's the formula for the driving player to get a block call.

          If that player has the instincts and athletic ability to step aside and block the shot instead of trying to take a charge that's likely to be called the other way, that would limit the points scored at the hoop and at the FT line by opponents.
          The future's so bright - I gotta wear shades.
          We like to cut down nets and get sized for championship rings.

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          • #6
            Will this new look Shox team be a new and improved team? Dunno, because the Shocks were rated in the top 20 for awhile. Right now, I am very impressed with our new recruits. The cherry on top we still need though is one more solid 5 man that can be consistent. It appears we might be still pursuing one, but I'm not sure of that. Either way, I think the Shocks win 20 plus again. With that special big though I'm dreaming of that I hope we sign, watch out!!! This is all speculation of course which is part of what we SN zealots thrive on in the off-season.
            Shocker basketball will forever be my favorite team in all of sports.

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            • #7
              Originally posted by forevershockerfan View Post
              Will this new look Shox team be a new and improved team? Dunno, because the Shocks were rated in the top 20 for awhile. Right now, I am very impressed with our new recruits. The cherry on top we still need though is one more solid 5 man that can be consistent. It appears we might be still pursuing one, but I'm not sure of that. Either way, I think the Shocks win 20 plus again. With that special big though I'm dreaming of that I hope we sign, watch out!!! This is all speculation of course which is part of what we SN zealots thrive on in the off-season.
              I actually love the fact we have two upper class men point guards coming in right out the gate. That alone should pump sunshine into the fans of Wichita.

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              • #8
                Aargh This is an instance where some Taylor Eldridge footage would help me understand your meaning.

                My understanding of defensive principles is that, as a general rule of thumb, a defender should strive to keep themselves between their man and the basket. Obviously there are going to be exceptions such as help defense, pick and roll, etc.

                When guarding man to man on the perimeter I’m not sure that letting your man by you to try and block their shot later is a sound defensive strategy or smart way to reduce fouls. In fact, it could potentially have the opposite effect on fouls.

                If a player drives past their man on the perimeter it means a teammate must (should) partially or completely leave their man to help which then requires another teammate to do the same to help the helper. Even if your rotations are good, which WSU’s typically are because they’re well coached, it still puts strain on the defense which makes breakdowns and easy looks more likely.

                Its my hope that these slightly longer and potentially more athletic guards/wings will be either quicker and thus able to stay in front of their man to prevent penetration or longer and thus able to give themselves the space necessary to stifle the drive but also close out on jumpers.

                I do expect to see more blocked shots this year from every position, including PG (the JUCO kid averaged almost 2/game.)

                Like FSF said, we had a top 10 KP defense last year. That seems to be the case almost every year and, looking at the roster, I don’t expect that to take a step back.

                My hope is that we have recruited some guys who are able to attack the hoop on the other end. That’s something we didn’t see enough of the last two years.

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by pie n eye View Post
                  Aargh This is an instance where some Taylor Eldridge footage would help me understand your meaning.

                  My understanding of defensive principles is that, as a general rule of thumb, a defender should strive to keep themselves between their man and the basket. Obviously there are going to be exceptions such as help defense, pick and roll, etc.

                  When guarding man to man on the perimeter I’m not sure that letting your man by you to try and block their shot later is a sound defensive strategy or smart way to reduce fouls. In fact, it could potentially have the opposite effect on fouls.

                  If a player drives past their man on the perimeter it means a teammate must (should) partially or completely leave their man to help which then requires another teammate to do the same to help the helper. Even if your rotations are good, which WSU’s typically are because they’re well coached, it still puts strain on the defense which makes breakdowns and easy looks more likely.

                  Its my hope that these slightly longer and potentially more athletic guards/wings will be either quicker and thus able to stay in front of their man to prevent penetration or longer and thus able to give themselves the space necessary to stifle the drive but also close out on jumpers.

                  I do expect to see more blocked shots this year from every position, including PG (the JUCO kid averaged almost 2/game.)

                  Like FSF said, we had a top 10 KP defense last year. That seems to be the case almost every year and, looking at the roster, I don’t expect that to take a step back.

                  My hope is that we have recruited some guys who are able to attack the hoop on the other end. That’s something we didn’t see enough of the last two years.
                  Warning, this is going to sound cliched and argumentative. It’s not meant to be.

                  Wooden had a championship team with a 6’5 post. I don’t know what year. In those times, keeping your man in front of you was the only way to play. How did the 4-5 man on that team play defense against the 6’9-7’0 players?

                  There is going to be one huge benefit I think we will see from this. The decent coaches will separate themselves from the bad coaches, the good will separate from the decent, and the great are going to cement themselves. There is a LOT of film being watched and dissected and I think we will see new concepts in all sports. Gregg could be retooling his whole playbook right now.
                  When you believe in something, the only person that's gotta believe it is you. Everything else is for the birds.- LeVelle Moton
                  Wichita is going to the rich side of town with a pack of matches and a five gallon tank of gasoline and try to burn everything to the ground

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by shock View Post

                    Warning, this is going to sound cliched and argumentative. It’s not meant to be.

                    Wooden had a championship team with a 6’5 post. I don’t know what year. In those times, keeping your man in front of you was the only way to play. How did the 4-5 man on that team play defense against the 6’9-7’0 players?

                    There is going to be one huge benefit I think we will see from this. The decent coaches will separate themselves from the bad coaches, the good will separate from the decent, and the great are going to cement themselves. There is a LOT of film being watched and dissected and I think we will see new concepts in all sports. Gregg could be retooling his whole playbook right now.
                    off the top of my head, I think 1964 or 65. There were no 7 footers then, and Erickson was an NBA kid

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by pinstripers View Post

                      off the top of my head, I think 1964 or 65. There were no 7 footers then, and Erickson was an NBA kid
                      There were few 7’ers then. That’s why I said 6’9 as well. If Erickson was the 6’5 center, he would routinely give up 4-5 inches and probably 8-10 inches of wingspan.

                      The other thing to keep in mind is that if WSU rolls out a mismatch, it’s a mismatch the other way too. The more you give, the more is going to be taken.
                      When you believe in something, the only person that's gotta believe it is you. Everything else is for the birds.- LeVelle Moton
                      Wichita is going to the rich side of town with a pack of matches and a five gallon tank of gasoline and try to burn everything to the ground

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                      • #12
                        I guess the big question I have is will Coach Marshall know what to do with this new look to maximize its strengths. He obviously knows a lot more than I do but not sure this group doesn't present some new challenges and opportunities for Coach Marshall. Looking forward to seeing what he does with this group.

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by pinstripers View Post

                          off the top of my head, I think 1964 or 65. There were no 7 footers then, and Erickson was an NBA kid
                          Fred Slaughter from Topeka Kansas - great athlete in Track

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                          • #14
                            I should have been more clear. My comments on blocking from the side or behind was meant to apply only to rim protectors. Perimeter players need to stay between their guy and the basket.
                            The future's so bright - I gotta wear shades.
                            We like to cut down nets and get sized for championship rings.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Remembering the "old look Shocks".

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