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The Arms Race Continues as WSU Strives to Keep Pace

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  • The Arms Race Continues as WSU Strives to Keep Pace

    Wasn't really sure where to put this as it impacts much more than men's basketball but since men's basketball is the bell cow of the program and this channel is where most of the eyeballs reside I thought I would put it here.

    Sully with one of his The Roundhouse series of articles takes a look at major faciliy additions and improvements as Wichita State strives to keep pace in the facility arms race that is no doubt very critical to the success of your overall athletice program.

    Personally, I think these improvements are very necessary and while I am sure they are looking for the deep pocketed supporters to provide most of the financial backing I am sure they would appreciate anything the little guy could do as well to help this along.

    I guess if you desire to run with the big dogs you have to be able to compete on the basis of your facilities as well as on the field of play.

    A tour of Charles Koch Arena's offices by necessity includes a tour of closets and storage rooms.

  • #2
    Boatright said Wichita State has $2.7 for the Eck Stadium project and $10.7 million committed for the Student-Athlete Success Center. If I understand the article correctly they need commitments of $3 million for the Eck Stadium improvements and $13 million for the new Student-Athlete Success Center to start work on those projects. So they are getting close.

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    • #3
      Heard rumors that there was talk about tearing down Cessna and building a world-class track facility...

      Comment


      • WuDrWu
        WuDrWu commented
        Editing a comment
        That's probably just from a recent discussion between Bolt and myself that your friend overheard.. It wasn't much more than wishful thinking so I wouldn't put any stock into it. We also discussed finding some sponsorship to develop (eventually) an international indoor event at Intrust. Personally, I think that has some potential. Time will tell.

    • #4
      If they are razing Cessna, they need to build a bigger roundhouse in the pit. Make it seat 20,000. That would be a raucous party.
      When you believe in something, the only person that's gotta believe it is you. Everything else is for the birds.- LeVelle Moton
      Wichita is going to the rich side of town with a pack of matches and a five gallon tank of gasoline and try to burn everything to the ground

      Comment


      • #5
        Originally posted by WichitaStateGuy View Post
        Heard rumors that there was talk about tearing down Cessna and building a world-class track facility...
        I can see Cessna stadium coming down in the future but I don't see the need for a world-class track facility. A nice track facility yes. Perhaps a combination track and soccer facility like Houston (who hosted last year's) AAC Outdoor Championship or like Cincy's Gettler Stadium (which seats 1,400 the sight of this year's AAC Outdoor Championship. Not sure if any of the AAC schools have outdoor track & field facilities that qualify as world class. Maybe @UConn Husky can fill us in on that. Cessna stadium is adequate now to host the AAC Outdoor Championship. Athough a new smaller facility would be nice someday.

        As far as Indoor Track & Field goes WSU has meets at the Heskett Center but they don't attract too many top D-1 schools and they won't be hosting any AAC Indoor Championships for sure. This year's AAC Indoor Championship, as it has been the last two years, will be held in a world-class facility but it won't be at an AAC school. In fact, it won't even be in the home city of an AAC school. It will be at the Birmingham Crossplex (that seats 4,000 for Indoor Track) and this is a world-class facility owned by the City of Birmingham. This facility will be hosting 13 NCAA Chanmpionships between 2019 and 2022 among many other events. The other two AAC Indoor championships were held at the New Balance Track & Field Center at the Armary in New York City.

        The new Student-Athlete Success Center will be a great benefit to the Shocker track & field program. Track & Field is very different from most other sports. The most important thing is to have good coaching, good training and ancillary facilities, a high quality track and good field event venues so that your ahtletes can be trained and develped to do well in the Conference Championship and in the NCAA Regionals (East and West) and the NCAA Championships so that they can perhaps compete in a world-class facility

        You are not going to spend very much money on an outdoor facility that may host 3 collegiate track & field events plus the state high school championships each year and maybe a handful of high school football games. And those collegiate events do not draw much fan support outside of family and friends of the athletes.


        Last edited by 1972Shocker; 1 week ago.

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        • #6
          The only razing of Cessna was a proposal to take down the east side steel section leaving the old concrete portion that was Veterans field and putting in a parking garage. i see no reason not to take down the steel section on the west side as well. It would open up sight lines to the university from 21st street

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          • #7
            Originally posted by pogo View Post
            The only razing of Cessna was a proposal to take down the east side steel section leaving the old concrete portion that was Veterans field and putting in a parking garage. i see no reason not to take down the steel section on the west side as well. It would open up sight lines to the university from 21st street
            And they don't really even need to leave the old concrete portion on the East side if they don't want to or if it would work better to totally remove it.

            The seating on the West side just from the old Veterans Field concrete portion of the stadium is more than adequate for a track facility or a track/soccer combo facility that seems to be pretty common.

            I surveryed the AAC schools Track & Field Facilities and found the following (the number in parenthesis is the permanent seating capacity):

            Track & Field/Soccer Combo Facilities:
            UCF (1,475)
            Cincy (1,400)
            Houston (Unknown - Looks like the have 10 to 12 rows of grandstand seating on the finish line side of the track)
            Memphis (Unknown - Looks similar to Houston)
            SMU (3,500)
            Temple (Unknown - Looks like 5 or 6 rows of grandstand seating on the finish line side of the track)
            Tulsa (2,000)

            Track & Field/Field Hockey Comb Facility
            UConn (2,000)

            Track & Field Solo Facilities:
            ECU (Unkown - Looks like little to no seating from a satellite view -Could be a BYOLC)
            USF (4,000)

            City Owned Facilitlites:
            Tulane uses Tad Gormley Stadium in City Park that is a muti-use stadium that seats 26,500. Located on the South shore of Lake Ponchartrain just north of the Tulane Campus. Doesn't appear to be a lot of parkking for that size of a facility but the fairgrounds are just East of the park. Tulane will host 1 track meet their this year. There is also a practice track which I assume is used by Tulane for tranining and practice.

            Based on what I could see I would probably rank 1. USF, 2. SMU and 3. Tulsa as the top track & field facilities in the AAC although this doesn't take into account strenght trraining facilities and locker rooms. This is just the filed of play and available seating.

            I think just about any of these facilities, with the possible exception of ECU because of a lack of seating (if I'm accurate on that) could host the AAC outdoor Track & Field Championships. While the Cessna Stadium track surface and field event venues are fine the stadium itself is no doubt the oldest facility (my guess is by far) in the AAC but it could host the AAC Outdoor T&F Championships. I would hope we don't do this until the new Student-Athlete Success Center is finished and in service. I little sprucing up of Cessna Stadium would not hurt although that didn't prevent the Shocks from hosting last years MVC Outdoor Championships.

            So far AAC Outdoor T&F Championships have been held at USF, UConn, UCF, Houston and this year Cincy.

            Comment


            • pogo
              pogo commented
              Editing a comment
              I would leave both sides of seating...one side West for spectators the East for athletes. I'm a symmetry oriented kind of guy you know a little ying and a little yang

            • 1972Shocker
              1972Shocker commented
              Editing a comment
              At the meets I have attended I have enjoyed sitting amongst the athletes and their families. I'll ask folks if they have a son or daughter competing and so far everyone I have asked that did. They enjoy talking about their kids. Then they ask me the same and usually seem surpirsed when I say, "No, I'm just a fan". The thing is most of the atheltes want to to on the finish line side of the field as well which at Cessan is the West side so that they can cheer on their teammates at the finish of races. About the only event I can think of that you would rather be on the East side for is the pole vault.

          • #8
            Originally posted by 1972Shocker View Post
            I guess if you desire to run with the big dogs you have to be able to compete on the basis of your facilities as well as on the field of play.
            I just hope with all this financial backing and planned upgrades they’ve considered how other facilities are constructed.

            Personally, I’ve been to a few Planet Fitnesses and one time went into a Genesis Health Club to watch a tennis match. Those places are masterpieces! Our teams need to be gifted with the right machines necessary to win a league championship. These days, if you can’t do that in a planet fitness, it’s not a facility issue, you got donkeys in the stable instead of thoroughbreds.

            Comment


            • 1972Shocker
              1972Shocker commented
              Editing a comment
              You don't think the quality of your facilities have anything to do with convincing the thoroughbreds to sign up? That goes for both coaches and athletes.

            • ShoxMTXE
              ShoxMTXE commented
              Editing a comment
              I totally agree! “If we build it, they will come”

              Ultimately, that’s what I’m concerned about. If we build new facilities that can’t compare to genesis or planet fitness, why would our athletes train there? They would be better off training at the places that have the machines needed to win a championship. I’ve seen some pretty robust black gentlemen in planet fitness - if our guys can match the physiques I see in planet fitness, we have a legitimate shot at a title.

              Same goes with the academic wing. I’ve seen more students studying at Starbucks more and more. I’m trying to get a damn coffee and have to fight through the swarm of college students studying. These facilities NEED to be on this level or the thoroughbreds will go elsewhere.

            • 1972Shocker
              1972Shocker commented
              Editing a comment
              I think I may have misundersood what you were trying to say in your iniitial post. Of course, the elephant in the room is always the dollars needed.

              I am not sure if you have visited our strength and conditioning facilities but I'm pretty sure they are quite good. You don't keep a world-class strength coach like Kerry Rosenboom around if they aren't.

          • #9
            Originally posted by ShoxMTXE View Post

            I just hope with all this financial backing and planned upgrades they’ve considered how other facilities are constructed.

            Personally, I’ve been to a few Planet Fitnesses and one time went into a Genesis Health Club to watch a tennis match. Those places are masterpieces! Our teams need to be gifted with the right machines necessary to win a league championship. These days, if you can’t do that in a planet fitness, it’s not a facility issue, you got donkeys in the stable instead of thoroughbreds.
            Go piss on Maggie's ashes.
            Deuces Valley.
            ... No really, deuces.
            ________________
            "Enjoy the ride."

            - a smart man

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          • #10
            Originally posted by WichitaStateGuy View Post
            Heard rumors that there was talk about tearing down Cessna and building a world-class track facility...
            Way to crush a guy's dreams!

            There certainly has to be talk about doing SOMETHING, right?! Cessna is the second biggest eye-sore on campus, next to the education building. A track facility that could second and third as a soccer and football field would be perfect, imo. It would also put all these, "WICHITA STATE FOOTBALL," dreams to rest.

            Honest to God, MOST high school's have better football fields // track set-ups than Wichita State. Less seating, but far more aesthetically pleasing. Oregon's Heyward filed seems like it would be easily obtainable.

            Comment


            • Aargh
              Aargh commented
              Editing a comment
              There is an annual cost to maintain Cessna. Compared to that cost, the cost to raze it would be staggering.

              The athletic department borrowed the $2.5 million it cost to join the AAC, forfeited all it's MVC tourney credits, doesn't get to share any AAC TV revenues until the new contract is signed (2019?), and doesn't get a share of any existing AAC tourney credits.

              I wouldn't be looking for the athletic department to commit to anything involving Cessna for at least 10 year - maybe at least 20.

              You will hear people talking about doing something, but if that's anyone who knows anything that's actually happening, they're probably talking about long-range planning. VERY long-range planning

            • pogo
              pogo commented
              Editing a comment
              The Education building is a Frank Loyd Wright design. It is the most internationally recognized building on campus. It was one of the last projects designed by Americas best known architect. It was also the last building constructed by the Municipal school Wichita University before it came into the Regent system. Also according to the info available there was to be a second building built to house a laboratory school for K-6. It was not built due to lack of funds. However the exterior of the lab lives on since the exterior of it was incorporated by a student of Mr Wright, John Hickman, who designed Century II. I know it seems out of place but if you walk around it and into the center it is a neat design with his kind of prairie style. The colors were picked by his wife which still remain today. And by the way the building is a protected historical landmark.

            • 1972Shocker
              1972Shocker commented
              Editing a comment
              Aargh may very well be right on his time table. One other transition cost into the AAC was that IIRC ADDB said WSU had sweetened the pot with subsidies to the other AAC schools for travel costs and the hassle of rescheduling in order to make this happen in 2017 and not 2018. Not sure how much that was but clearly joining the AAC was a big financial commitment for Wichita State.

          • #11
            My guess is they will start focusing on the track stadium situation and what to do with Cessna after they complete the projects they are fund raising for now.. They definitely have never been in a huge hurry to raze the abandoned football stadium though. Their general conclusion is probably until Cessna becomes a saftey concern there's no real reason to think too much about it.

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            • #12
              I think a huge Soccer stadium with capacity of 25K would be in order, "Shocker Soccer" Goalllllllllllllllllllllllllllll, I can hear Mike Kennedy calling it now.
              I don't need sex, the government f u c k s me everyday.

              "Remember Nookie Green"

              Stop the talk about bringing back Shocker football and concentrate on bringing back Shocker baseball!

              Comment


              • Kung Wu
                Kung Wu commented
                Editing a comment
                35k!!

            • #13
              I can't imagine razing Cessna would cost that much. Heck, I bet you could find a fair number of explosives aficionados willing to do it pro bono.

              Comment


              • pogo
                pogo commented
                Editing a comment
                It shouldn't cost much. The sale of the scrap metal would be fairly substantial.

            • #14
              Originally posted by Cdizzle View Post
              I can't imagine razing Cessna would cost that much. Heck, I bet you could find a fair number of explosives aficionados willing to do it pro bono.
              Hell, just stop the maintenance and let a strong, April wind knock it down in a few years.

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