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**tropicalshox** · May 23, 2011, 01:35 PM

Steve Prohm gets the Murray State job.

**wushock** · May 23, 2011, 02:42 PM

Turg will have to be at No. 4 best coach. Gene Smithson, Ralph Miller and Greg Marshall rate ahead of him

**ABC** · May 23, 2011, 02:56 PM

Turgeon won two NCAA games and a MVC championship. Marshall has done neither.

Marshall might jump over MT, but he's not there yet.

**Kung Wu** · May 23, 2011, 03:23 PM

This is not hard to understand: WITHOUT MARK TURGEON THERE WOULD BE NO GREGG MARSHALL.

We wouldn't have the caliber club we have today without Mark pulling us out of a seriously bad situation and putting us in the national spotlight with a very unlikely Sweet 16 run.

We simply would not have been in a position to lure a very good coach here without him doing for us what he did.

It's really no more difficult to understand than that.

Please stop disrespecting Turgeon and be grateful and appreciative of his time here.

Are people really trying to negate what he did for us based on a single, off-the-cuff, and probably out-of-context quote and losing a single flipping recruit that never even suited up for WSU?

I think I just got a case of the red ass.

**McShocker** · May 23, 2011, 03:26 PM

Originally posted by ABC

Turgeon won two NCAA games and a MVC championship. Marshall has done neither.

Marshall might jump over MT, but he's not there yet.

I agree, except I will say that I EXPECT that Marshall will jump over him.

As much as I loved watching Smithson's teams, and have no doubt they were more talented than any of Turgeon's teams, the probation knocks him down a couple notches in my mind.

**SubGod22** · May 23, 2011, 03:36 PM

There were plenty of things about Turgeon that people had issues with while he was here. They didn't pop up just because he left and they're just as valid now as they were then. Yes, he had success while here and that allowed us to hire a better coach to take over. But he has flaws that irritated many while here and still irritate them now. Why is that so hard for some to understand? There will ALWAYS be negative things said towards Turgeon. But they're the SAME negative things that were said while he was here. What's wrong with that?

I'm glad Turgeon came in and had success. I feel he could have had more success if he believed more in himself or the product. I also believe we are MUCH better off without him here and with 3G in charge.

**vancedave56** · May 23, 2011, 03:45 PM

Originally posted by SubGod22

There were plenty of things about Turgeon that people had issues with while he was here. They didn't pop up just because he left and they're just as valid now as they were then. Yes, he had success while here and that allowed us to hire a better coach to take over. But he has flaws that irritated many while here and still irritate them now. Why is that so hard for some to understand? There will ALWAYS be negative things said towards Turgeon. But they're the SAME negative things that were said while he was here. What's wrong with that?

I'm glad Turgeon came in and had success. I feel he could have had more success if he believed more in himself or the product. I also believe we are MUCH better off without him here and with 3G in charge.

:yes:

**McShocker** · May 23, 2011, 03:56 PM

Originally posted by SubGod22

There were plenty of things about Turgeon that people had issues with while he was here. They didn't pop up just because he left and they're just as valid now as they were then. Yes, he had success while here and that allowed us to hire a better coach to take over. But he has flaws that irritated many while here and still irritate them now. Why is that so hard for some to understand? There will ALWAYS be negative things said towards Turgeon. But they're the SAME negative things that were said while he was here. What's wrong with that?

I'm glad Turgeon came in and had success. I feel he could have had more success if he believed more in himself or the product. I also believe we are MUCH better off without him here and with 3G in charge.

Trust me, I get that. Those same things bothered me and I am a WAY bigger fan of GM than I ever was of MT.

How about an analogy?

You date a really great girl for a while and have a really good time, but eventually you both go separate ways. You both end up dating somebody new that you like even better. Is it better to dwell on all the good parts of the relationship or continue to complain about all the annoying habits that she had?

We aren't in couples therapy with MT, the relationship is nothing more than memories at this point. We can choose to be bitter and angry or we can appreciate the time we had together. Personally, I'd rather remember all the good things about MT and let the rest die because it is better for me as a fan and because I think he did enough for us to deserve a positive legacy.

And I don't post often, but I probably posted more following the Bowles fiasco than any other time because because I was flat angry about it. I was firmly in your camp then Sub, but I think it is time to forgive and move on. The man did a heck of a lot more good than bad for this program and at some point we need to start allowing the memories of the negative stuff start to fade away.

**SubGod22** · May 23, 2011, 04:01 PM

I'd rather not talk about him at all, but if people are going to continually bring him up, both sides are going to be heard. That's the way it works and I don't see it changing. It may have something to do with some people acting like Turgeon could do no wrong with I believe irritates many who remember more of his flaws than anything.

It's a shame there's not much going on and this is what we're stuck talking about. There are more important and better things to discuss than Turgeon. But conisdering the time of year...

**Kung Wu** · May 23, 2011, 08:13 PM

Originally posted by SubGod22

There were plenty of things about Turgeon that people had issues with while he was here. They didn't pop up just because he left and they're just as valid now as they were then. Yes, he had success while here and that allowed us to hire a better coach to take over. But he has flaws that irritated many while here and still irritate them now. Why is that so hard for some to understand? There will ALWAYS be negative things said towards Turgeon. But they're the SAME negative things that were said while he was here. What's wrong with that?

Right, he wasn't perfect and pointing out errors in judgement is okay (e.g. Bowles-gate). But posters calling him derogatory names ("tool") is completely disrespectful and uncalled for. I think that's what had me fired up. Also people acting like he is disrespecting WSU are just tossing crap into the bonfire.

Originally posted by SubGod22

I'm glad Turgeon came in and had success. I feel he could have had more success if he believed more in himself or the product. I also believe we are MUCH better off without him here and with 3G in charge.

Sure, he was young and we didn't get the best that we will see of him. Or maybe we did. But some posters were taking on a disrespectful attitude and it bothered me. But I'm not the forum police, just a loud mouth with a keyboard. :)

**Dan** · May 23, 2011, 10:19 PM

Do you think the fans at Jacksonville State are still complaining about Turgeon? Look, he was a coach here and he moved on to bigger and better things. He brought us out of the abyss and for that we should be thankful. He was never going to retire here. We now have a coach that seems to like WSU more than Turgeon ever did. I hope he stays for a long time and I hope Turgeon found a job where he can stay at for a long time and not be like his mentor, Larry Brown.

**shock** · May 23, 2011, 10:57 PM

Turg will never be happy until he is coaching KU. That's why he went to the school he did, to set up a smooth transition after Self.

**Snapshot9** · May 23, 2011, 11:07 PM

Originally posted by Dan

Do you think the fans at Jacksonville State are still complaining about Turgeon? Look, he was a coach here and he moved on to bigger and better things. He brought us out of the abyss and for that we should be thankful. He was never going to retire here. We now have a coach that seems to like WSU more than Turgeon ever did. I hope he stays for a long time and I hope Turgeon found a job where he can stay at for a long time and not be like his mentor, Larry Brown.

Turgeon stayed 7 years, and I don't expect Marshall to stay past that. To expect him to might be wishing for a little more than reality. I am sure Turgeon learned a lot while he was here, and he did his best. He has a good record, and he did a lot for WSU basketball. There are always issues with almost any coach, some more than others. I noticed that Turgeon seemed to change some more when he was ATM.

**ShockerEngr** · May 23, 2011, 11:57 PM

Originally posted by Dan

He was never going to retire here.

Actually...if you go back to the interviews at the time...he was really considering it. It was after he called his mentor Larry Brown that he decided to move on.

That said, I'm not entirely sure I'd be happy with a coach that had decided where he would retire that early in his career....happy they stayed? most likely...but I want someone with a fire in them to be great...

**GoShockers89** · May 24, 2011, 01:12 AM

MT accomplished some pretty impressive things during his tenure here. He inherited a program that was on the verge of mutiny, had decrepit facilities, and had not even COME CLOSE to sniffing the postseason for over a decade. We were arguably 5+ more years of mediocrity away from suffering a permanent erosion in the quality of the program at that time.

For these reasons, I will cut him a break on the Bowles thing.

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