So does WSU end up in the Top 25

[kcshocker11]

Not sure where the CNN/SI early poll was posted.

RTC has the Shocks as an early 23 for next season.

http://rushthecourt.net/2011/04/05/2...25/#more-36828

I looked Creighton. cant believe they werent there. After all they did almost win the CBI :D 8) :posterwsu:

[Shox21]

An "early" 23. This from a team losing 5 seniors (4 of which at some point in time started multiple games) and were the backbone of this team. Replacing them we have a very talented juco (with some possible health issues) and three freshmen (granted they look very, very solid). Whew! The last I heard we were not even going to be picked to win the Valley. That was going to CU and CU isn't even rated. Wonder if that prediction has changed since the NIT run. Oh well, just goes to show different strokes for different folks.

Marshall said on his last show that there was one and possibly more coming in. That they would know after the player's meetings. It's gonna be interesting to see who returns next year and how many more are coming in.

[Jamar Howard 4 President]

After seeing the Shox roll through the NIT, and after watching pretty much every NCAA tourney game, I can honesty say I would slot them aorund 12-14.

Which teams on this list would you put the Shox ahead of?

Ohio State
Duke
Kansas
Pittsburgh
Kentucky
Wisconsin
San Diego State
Purdue
UConn
Syracuse
North Carolina
BYU
Notre Dame
Florida
Arizona
George Mason
Kansas State
Temple
Texas


That's 19 teams that I would easily put ahead of WSU. It's really hard to say the Shox should be top 20.

[shock-it-to-me]

After seeing the Shox roll through the NIT, and after watching pretty much every NCAA tourney game, I can honesty say I would slot them aorund 12-14.

Which teams on this list would you put the Shox ahead of?

Ohio State
Duke
Kansas
Pittsburgh
Kentucky
Wisconsin
San Diego State
Purdue
UConn
Syracuse
North Carolina
BYU
Notre Dame
Florida
Arizona
George Mason
Kansas State
Temple
Texas


That's 19 teams that I would easily put ahead of WSU. It's really hard to say the Shox should be top 20.

If you're talking body of work for the season, I would agree. But this isn't tournament selection we're talking about. Otherwise, why would UConn be ranked 1st and Butler 2nd? If we're talking about how we were performing the last couple weeks of the season, I would certainly like are chances against:
KSU, BYU -teams with one star and roll players not that concerning
Temple - sneaks by Penn St and got whacked by SDSU
Notre Dame - I know they had a good season, but the one game I saw them play (FSU), they looked very average.
Wisonsin - made a run to sweet 16, but was anybody that impressed with that team? They play good D and run a deliberate offense. Draw

[Downtown Shocker Brown]

After seeing the Shox roll through the NIT, and after watching pretty much every NCAA tourney game, I can honesty say I would slot them aorund 12-14.

Which teams on this list would you put the Shox ahead of?

Ohio State
Duke
Kansas
Pittsburgh
Kentucky
Wisconsin
San Diego State
Purdue
UConn
Syracuse
North Carolina
BYU
Notre Dame
Florida
Arizona
George Mason
Kansas State
Temple
Texas


That's 19 teams that I would easily put ahead of WSU. It's really hard to say the Shox should be top 20.

Ill give you the top 7, if judging by the eye test. If you watched the WSU/UCONN game then you saw Wichita State outplay them, but lose late questionably. So from Purdue down, the Shox were right there with them. Every team has bad games (Butler, who I noticed isn't on your list despite being in National Championship game) but Wichita State's were made to be 10 times worse than they should have been.

The loss to SIU didn't change what kind of basketball team we were. It didn't change who the players were. It changed the eye test and some numbers chart that means so little to anyone except the Selection Committee as a bias to keep certain teams out while letting certain teams in.

[ShockerInKC]

Well, we ended up being number 34 with 20 votes in Coaches Poll.

http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/rankings

Its not too shabby!

I don't mind the pub, but I think I am _never_ basing anything on this poll again! KU 2 spots above the team that beat them soundly, VCU even beat the team after that! Ohio State getting a #1 vote!?!?!! are you crazy! THEY DIDN'T WIN WHEN IT COUNTED ! THEY ARE NOT THE BEST!

back to my inside voice now...

[RoyalShock]

Look to see who Ohio St beat this year - especially in the tournament - and see if that coach has a vote.

[Rosewood]

Sports are meaningless. They really are when you compare it to real world S--- like the disasters in japan and things like Family.

A post season poll is like the most meaningless of the meaningless. It is actually more meaningless than a preseason poll because a preseason poll shapes the polls for the rest of the season.

[Jamar Howard 4 President]

shock-it-to-me, let's look at the last 10 games for some of these teams...

WSU and Kansas State both finished 7-3. Kansas State's 2 best wins in that time period (KU and Texas) were better than anyone WSU beat all year. Kansas State's worst loss during that time period (Colorado) was better than either of WSU's losses to Indiana St or Missouri State.
Kansas State > WSU


WSU and BYU both finished 7-3. BYU's win @ San Diego State dominates anything WSU did all year in the win column. BYU's 3 losses during that time period (New Mexico, San Diego State, Florida) were better than WSU's 3 losses (VCU, MSU, ISU).
BYU > WSU


Notre Dame finished with a bad game. True. However, they were leapyears ahead of WSU during the regular season, they finished with the same 7-3 record as WSU (against better competition), and they were the last team to beat the eventual champions UConn. (Won @ UConn on UConn's Senior Night)
Notre Dame > WSU

Wisconsin doesn't play pretty, but this isn't a Miss America Pageant. This is about ranking the top 25 best teams. Wisconsin only finished 6-4, but 8 of those 10 teams were in the NCAA tourney. Their final 6 wins were much stronger than WSU's final 7, and their 4 losses were against better teams than WSU's 3. Even if you think WSU finished slightly stronger (Honestly, it's a pretty close call), considering that Wisconsin deserved to be ranked well ahead of WSU prior to the last 10 games, WSU didn't do nearly enough IMO down the stretch to catch this Sweet 16 team.
Wisconsin > WSU


Temple didn't get whacked by SDSU. They lost in overtime. Considering that during the last 2 months of the season, all 3 of their losses were to Sweet 16 Teams, a strong argument could be made that they should be ranked ahead of WSU.
Temple > WSU (I'll admit that this one is debateable)

[wusphlash]

Did someone change the name of the "2011 Bracketology" thread to "So does WSU end up in the top 25"?????? :roll:

[1979Shocker]

Just going by some common opponents, I'd put us even or just above Texas. Two common opponents were UConn and Nebraska.

We lost to UConn on a neutral court by 4. Texas lost at home to UConn by 1.

We beat Nebraska at home by 27. Texas lost at Nebraska by 3.

[RoyalShock]

Those teams didn't lose to SIU, UNI or InSU either.

[shock-it-to-me]

shock-it-to-me, let's look at the last 10 games for some of these teams...

WSU and Kansas State both finished 7-3. Kansas State's 2 best wins in that time period (KU and Texas) were better than anyone WSU beat all year. Kansas State's worst loss during that time period (Colorado) was better than either of WSU's losses to Indiana St or Missouri State.
Kansas State > WSU


WSU and BYU both finished 7-3. BYU's win @ San Diego State dominates anything WSU did all year in the win column. BYU's 3 losses during that time period (New Mexico, San Diego State, Florida) were better than WSU's 3 losses (VCU, MSU, ISU).
BYU > WSU


Notre Dame finished with a bad game. True. However, they were leapyears ahead of WSU during the regular season, they finished with the same 7-3 record as WSU (against better competition), and they were the last team to beat the eventual champions UConn. (Won @ UConn on UConn's Senior Night)
Notre Dame > WSU

Wisconsin doesn't play pretty, but this isn't a Miss America Pageant. This is about ranking the top 25 best teams. Wisconsin only finished 6-4, but 8 of those 10 teams were in the NCAA tourney. Their final 6 wins were much stronger than WSU's final 7, and their 4 losses were against better teams than WSU's 3. Even if you think WSU finished slightly stronger (Honestly, it's a pretty close call), considering that Wisconsin deserved to be ranked well ahead of WSU prior to the last 10 games, WSU didn't do nearly enough IMO down the stretch to catch this Sweet 16 team.
Wisconsin > WSU


Temple didn't get whacked by SDSU. They lost in overtime. Considering that during the last 2 months of the season, all 3 of their losses were to Sweet 16 Teams, a strong argument could be made that they should be ranked ahead of WSU.
Temple > WSU (I'll admit that this one is debateable)

If team A beats team B, and team C beats team D, and we know that team B is better than team D, does that automatically mean team A is better than team C? I suppose it does as far as RPI and that sort of thing, but I watched these games, and all I'm saying is that the way in which WSU was actually playing the games, they looked to me to be a better team then some of those discussed above.

JH4P - let me ask you this a different way. If you were forced to wager $500 on a neutral site game between WSU and BYU (sans Davies), KSU and Temple, who would you wager your hard earned money on?

[Jamar Howard 4 President]

I'd take BYU or KSU in a heartbeat.

Like I said, Temple is a tough call, but I'd probably still put my money on them and then root to lose my $500.

[shock-it-to-me]

I'd take BYU or KSU in a heartbeat.

Like I said, Temple is a tough call, but I'd probably still put my money on them and then root to lose my $500.

fair enough.

without Davies, I think WSU hangs tough with BYU. KSU, you just never know which team shows up. If the team that struggled mid season and lost to Colorado shows up, WSU beats that team. The KSU team that throttled KU, that would be a different story.