Durley 1st Team, Toure' 2nd, Ben 6th Man

[AndShock]

http://www.mvc-sports.com/mbasketball/news/2010-11/5114/weems-is-larry-bird-player-of-the-year/

Wichita State is also Defensive Team of the Year, but we didn't have one person on the defensive all-conference team.

[SubGod22]

Re: Durley 1st Team, Toure' 2nd, Ben 6th Man

http://www.mvc-sports.com/mbasketball/news/2010-11/5114/weems-is-larry-bird-player-of-the-year/

Wichita State is also Defensive Team of the Year

I don't know how that happens considering our team defense was what many of us considered a weakness. How many times did we see dribble penatration with NOBODY stepping up to help? Was the Valley that bad defensively this year?

[Shocktoberfest]

Seriously? Wow! I do not see Murry on any of those teams. I suppose I/we see him through foggles of high expectations. Dang! Those votes seem awfully charitable.

[wsushox1]

Sweet.

[XManCometh]

Re: Durley 1st Team, Toure' 2nd, Ben 6th Man

http://www.mvc-sports.com/mbasketball/news/2010-11/5114/weems-is-larry-bird-player-of-the-year/

Wichita State is also Defensive Team of the Year

I don't know how that happens considering our team defense was what many of us considered a weakness. How many times did we see dribble penatration with NOBODY stepping up to help? Was the Valley that bad defensively this year?

The coaches, sports information directors and a media who vote on these awards rarely watch as many games per team as we do. They go on reputation, stats and what they saw in the handful of games they did watch. For example, Toure is 2nd team. Many of us on here would probably say that's quite the stretch considering how much he struggled on the offensive side of the ball during Valley play. But, he has name value from the past few years so coaches and SIDs just assume he had a good season.

[tropicalshox]

Well deserved honor for Smith. Congratulations Ben!

[Kung Wu]

Re: Durley 1st Team, Toure' 2nd, Ben 6th Man

http://www.mvc-sports.com/mbasketball/news/2010-11/5114/weems-is-larry-bird-player-of-the-year/

Wichita State is also Defensive Team of the Year

I don't know how that happens considering our team defense was what many of us considered a weakness. How many times did we see dribble penatration with NOBODY stepping up to help? Was the Valley that bad defensively this year?

The coaches, sports information directors and a media who vote on these awards rarely watch as many games per team as we do. They go on reputation, stats and what they saw in the handful of games they did watch. For example, Toure is 2nd team. Many of us on here would probably say that's quite the stretch considering how much he struggled on the offensive side of the ball during Valley play. But, he has name value from the past few years so coaches and SIDs just assume he had a good season.

He has struggled from time to time, no doubt about it.

That said he was also asked to take on a completely new roll as a junior. I think if you put that into perspective he has performed very well statistics-wise considering what he was asked to do.

It doesn't make the silly turnovers any less painful for us Shocker fans, but the end result is he still has outperformed the lion's share of the Valley players.

I am not saying that the voters had that context at all -- but if they did it wouldn't be unreasonable.

[Kung Wu]

Well deserved honor for Smith. Congratulations Ben!

:good:

[The Mad Hatter]

Re: Durley 1st Team, Toure' 2nd, Ben 6th Man

http://www.mvc-sports.com/mbasketball/news/2010-11/5114/weems-is-larry-bird-player-of-the-year/

Wichita State is also Defensive Team of the Year

I don't know how that happens considering our team defense was what many of us considered a weakness. How many times did we see dribble penatration with NOBODY stepping up to help? Was the Valley that bad defensively this year?

Considering that we were 1st in scoring defense, 2nd in FG% defense, 1st in rebounding, 2nd in steals, and 3rd in blocked shots, it shouldn't be that surprising. (All of those are the in-conference only ranks).

We only allowed 70 points in regulation in 2 conference games. For all our complaining, when we lost, it usually had more to do with lethargic offense and turnovers than our defense.

[SubGod22]

Re: Durley 1st Team, Toure' 2nd, Ben 6th Man

http://www.mvc-sports.com/mbasketball/news/2010-11/5114/weems-is-larry-bird-player-of-the-year/

Wichita State is also Defensive Team of the Year

I don't know how that happens considering our team defense was what many of us considered a weakness. How many times did we see dribble penatration with NOBODY stepping up to help? Was the Valley that bad defensively this year?

Considering that we were 1st in scoring defense, 2nd in FG% defense, 1st in rebounding, 2nd in steals, and 3rd in blocked shots, it shouldn't be that surprising. (All of those are the in-conference only ranks).

We only allowed 70 points in regulation in 2 conference games. For all our complaining, when we lost, it usually had more to do with lethargic offense and turnovers than our defense.

How much of scoring D was also because teams refused to run with us. Teams that would play us in low scoring games would turn around and have a higher scoring affair with others. We have a decent defensive team and turnovers have killed us this year. But this is far from the best defensive team we've seen and quite frankly, I've been disappointed with our D as a whole. Maybe that's just me.

[another shocker]

If all that you saw from WSU this season was the Shockers at your place (on the road), of course they would be defensive team of the year. WSU sut down everybody on the road in fine fashion (to the tune of double digit wins), except for MSU.

[The Mad Hatter]

Re: Durley 1st Team, Toure' 2nd, Ben 6th Man

http://www.mvc-sports.com/mbasketball/news/2010-11/5114/weems-is-larry-bird-player-of-the-year/

Wichita State is also Defensive Team of the Year

I don't know how that happens considering our team defense was what many of us considered a weakness. How many times did we see dribble penatration with NOBODY stepping up to help? Was the Valley that bad defensively this year?

Considering that we were 1st in scoring defense, 2nd in FG% defense, 1st in rebounding, 2nd in steals, and 3rd in blocked shots, it shouldn't be that surprising. (All of those are the in-conference only ranks).

We only allowed 70 points in regulation in 2 conference games. For all our complaining, when we lost, it usually had more to do with lethargic offense and turnovers than our defense.

How much of scoring D was also because teams refused to run with us. Teams that would play us in low scoring games would turn around and have a higher scoring affair with others. We have a decent defensive team and turnovers have killed us this year. But this is far from the best defensive team we've seen and quite frankly, I've been disappointed with our D as a whole. Maybe that's just me.

The problem with that argument is 1) we also have the highest scoring offense in the league, so it doesn't appear that our scoring defense is a result of playing in low scoring games, 2) that still leaves us 2nd in FG% defense, and 3) we still lead the league in defensive rebounding, which should be hurt if we are playing in games with fewer shots.

At the end of the day, we had two home losses in conference where we gave up less than 60 points (MSU and SIU). If you lose games where your opponent scores in the 50s, it is your offense that you blame for not winning. We win those two games, and we are 16-2 in the Valley and conference champions. The UNI game was the only game where our defense cost us the game in conference.

[SubGod22]

Re: Durley 1st Team, Toure' 2nd, Ben 6th Man

http://www.mvc-sports.com/mbasketball/news/2010-11/5114/weems-is-larry-bird-player-of-the-year/

Wichita State is also Defensive Team of the Year

I don't know how that happens considering our team defense was what many of us considered a weakness. How many times did we see dribble penatration with NOBODY stepping up to help? Was the Valley that bad defensively this year?

Considering that we were 1st in scoring defense, 2nd in FG% defense, 1st in rebounding, 2nd in steals, and 3rd in blocked shots, it shouldn't be that surprising. (All of those are the in-conference only ranks).

We only allowed 70 points in regulation in 2 conference games. For all our complaining, when we lost, it usually had more to do with lethargic offense and turnovers than our defense.

How much of scoring D was also because teams refused to run with us. Teams that would play us in low scoring games would turn around and have a higher scoring affair with others. We have a decent defensive team and turnovers have killed us this year. But this is far from the best defensive team we've seen and quite frankly, I've been disappointed with our D as a whole. Maybe that's just me.

The problem with that argument is 1) we also have the highest scoring offense in the league, so it doesn't appear that our scoring defense is a result of playing in low scoring games, 2) that still leaves us 2nd in FG% defense, and 3) we still lead the league in defensive rebounding, which should be hurt if we are playing in games with fewer shots.

At the end of the day, we had two home losses in conference where we gave up less than 60 points (MSU and SIU). If you lose games where your opponent scores in the 50s, it is your offense that you blame for not winning. We win those two games, and we are 16-2 in the Valley and conference champions. The UNI game was the only game where our defense cost us the game in conference.

Fair enough. But even in some of our wins, our D wasn't overly impressive. I still say the Valley just sucks that much this year. And maybe that has more to do with offense that defense. I'm still not overly impressed with this teams D. Maybe I'm alone on that one.

[ShockTalk]

Re: Durley 1st Team, Toure' 2nd, Ben 6th Man

http://www.mvc-sports.com/mbasketball/news/2010-11/5114/weems-is-larry-bird-player-of-the-year/

Wichita State is also Defensive Team of the Year

I don't know how that happens considering our team defense was what many of us considered a weakness. How many times did we see dribble penatration with NOBODY stepping up to help? Was the Valley that bad defensively this year?

The coaches, sports information directors and a media who vote on these awards rarely watch as many games per team as we do. They go on reputation, stats and what they saw in the handful of games they did watch. For example, Toure is 2nd team. Many of us on here would probably say that's quite the stretch considering how much he struggled on the offensive side of the ball during Valley play. But, he has name value from the past few years so coaches and SIDs just assume he had a good season.

The only surprising thing here is that he was 2nd team and maybe not HM team. Nevertheless, the Shocks pretty much had to have at least 2 reps on these three teams. Blair, Smith, and Ragland all played well during the conference, but lack of minutes and big stats hurt them.

Not disagreeing with TM's offensive struggles, but it's also interesting that Murry still has the highest Prouty for the Shocks. Here's the gain/loss in Prouty Rating since the start of conference play.

Blair +57
Smith +36
Ragland +26
Williams +13
Durley -2
Ellis -11
Stutz -16
Murry -30
Hatch -59
Kyles -86

What's disturbing about this is that our OOC SOS was much higher than our conference SOS and how all 5 of our "starters" did during conference play. Returning player Blair's play went up big in conference play, yet our other 4/5s where flat to down against lesser competition. It's not surprising that Juco players would improve as the year went along, but both Smith and Ragland played better in the conference, by Prouty stats, than Murry, Kyles, and Hatch.

[WuDrWu]

Let me first say CONGRATULATIONS to J.T. Durley for being selected 1st team All Conference. That's a hell of an accomplishment young man.





I've been consistent in my comments that I don't think this team has lived up to their own expectations, to say nothing of mine or fans in general.

But big picture, 2 Weems prayers and 2 Leonard prayers, regardless of our other faults, are the difference between a 1 game MSU championship and a 3-5 game waltz for us.

Part of the "disappointment" in certain players have to do with the scale of expectation and upside, which was not tilted in our favor this season.

I would like to add that there is 1 thread on Shockernet about the All Conference selection, and unless I glossed over it, not one person congratulated 5th year Senior J.T. Durley on being a 1st Team Selection.

I kind of think that's a little sad.