Baseball meltdown on this board

[shoxlax]

No I'm not talking about the snow.

When will the first one occur?

I say at ORU, the first road game following the Niagara series.

Maybe if we are lucky we make it to the Tulane series.

[KC Shox]

Re: Baseball meltdown on this board

No I'm not talking about the snow.

When will the first one occur?

I say at ORU, the first road game following the Niagara series.

Maybe if we are lucky we make it to the Tulane series.

Not ORU, they have owned us this decade so it would not be surprising to see them own us again this year.

[Ta town]

The first game WSU blows via errors and a couple of rallies killed via strikeouts with runners at 2nd and 3rd and no outs.

[SB Shock]

First time they face a ku pitcher with a 13.44 era who has been shellacked every time he pitches and throws a 1 hitter and strike out 18 and wsu loses 15-0

[ShockerFever]

Get teased early on and then get pounded into the ground on the West Coast like last year. So, I'm guessing at Oregon.

[Wuzee]

I think WSU will go undefeated this year, as they should every year to meet my expectations for them.

[Shocker85]

It won't take long.

1) Stephenson and Kemnitz are convinced that winning all the MVC games is their most important task. The mid-week games, many of which are against BCS teams, are secondary. They will trot out Kelley, Lowell, Flynn, etc. to try to blast the MVC teams and be left with largely inexperienced starters in the mid-week.

2) The Shox, for the 32nd consecutive season, will "play for the big inning" and refuse to bunt runners over, hit behind runners, etc. and will strand far too many runners. Games where a run or two would make the difference will be lost.

3) The hitters will fail to make adjustments to junk-ball left-handed pussey pitchers and look like fools waving at breaking balls.

4) The downward trend in BA will continue with the new bat rules.

5) The pitchers will continue to get beat on 0-2 and 1-2 counts because they're coached to go with their strength and refuse to make hitters hit a pitchers pitch.

Prove me wrong, fellas. I love going to Omaha, but I forgot how to even get there.

--'85.

[SB Shock]

1) Stephenson and Kemnitz are convinced that winning all the MVC games is their most important task. The mid-week games, many of which are against BCS teams, are secondary. They will trot out Kelley, Lowell, Flynn, etc. to try to blast the MVC teams and be left with largely inexperienced starters in the mid-week.

Does it matter? If you can't win the MVC it doesn't matter what you do out of conference. This is a testament to the overall fall of talent in the program. Mid-week starts were seasoning of underclassmen with a deep bullpen to bail them out if they had a bad start. WSU has neither.

2) The Shox, for the 32nd consecutive season, will "play for the big inning" and refuse to bunt runners over, hit behind runners, etc. and will strand far too many runners. Games where a run or two would make the difference will be lost.

I'm kind of mixed on this. Playing small ball doesn't increase your run production. It does increase the probability of scoring 1 run. Then again you need a team to be able to lay that bunt down when you need, and if you don't do it ever until you need it then you likely fail.

WSU fails at this IMO because the players are selfish. I remember Koyie Hill laying a bunt down in a game when everybody was playing him deep with two outs and nobody expected him to bunt (even GS didn't know) - why because he wanted to win.

3) The hitters will fail to make adjustments to junk-ball left-handed pussey pitchers and look like fools waving at breaking balls.

4) The downward trend in BA will continue with the new bat rules.

Good hitters will continue to hit, another testament to reduced talent in the program.

[Shocker85]

1) Stephenson and Kemnitz are convinced that winning all the MVC games is their most important task. The mid-week games, many of which are against BCS teams, are secondary. They will trot out Kelley, Lowell, Flynn, etc. to try to blast the MVC teams and be left with largely inexperienced starters in the mid-week.

Does it matter? If you can't win the MVC it doesn't matter what you do out of conference. This is a testament to the overall fall of talent in the program. Mid-week starts were seasoning of underclassmen with a deep bullpen to bail them out if they had a bad start. WSU has neither.

2) The Shox, for the 32nd consecutive season, will "play for the big inning" and refuse to bunt runners over, hit behind runners, etc. and will strand far too many runners. Games where a run or two would make the difference will be lost.

I'm kind of mixed on this. Playing small ball doesn't increase your run production. It does increase the probability of scoring 1 run. Then again you need a team to be able to lay that bunt down when you need, and if you don't do it ever until you need it then you likely fail.

WSU fails at this IMO because the players are selfish. I remember Koyie Hill laying a bunt down in a game when everybody was playing him deep with two outs and nobody expected him to bunt (even GS didn't know) - why because he wanted to win.

3) The hitters will fail to make adjustments to junk-ball left-handed pussey pitchers and look like fools waving at breaking balls.

4) The downward trend in BA will continue with the new bat rules.

Good hitters will continue to hit, another testament to reduced talent in the program.

Point 1) Yes it does matter. There is no bonus for slaughtering Bradley 9-2 vs. winning 9-6 and using your better pitchers against better teams to give yourself a reasonable chance of being competitive. Put the quality starters in the hot seat to beat the tough teams, not frosh/soph pitchers. It might cost you 2-3 MVC games, but SO WHAT. There are no style points in baseball. Beyond that, the front-line starters need the work vs. the best hitters available, because those are the pitchers they'll face in NCAA play.

Point 2) Do you watch Shocker baseball (rhetorical question, I know you do.) The players look selfish because of the way they are taught to bunt. They do not bunt for a sacrifice, they consistently attempt to bunt for a hit. Gene WON'T trade runs for outs and that is stupid baseball given the lack of consistemt power in the WSU lineup over the last 10 or more years. The Shox used to be able to just bludgeon people. Those days are gone.

Another point on bunting ... the Texas people used to ***** and moan LIKE CRAZY when Augie Garrido got to Texas and whipped-out his patent brand of small ball (remember the rec.sport.baseball.college days?). OMG, they whined, hit the ball over the fence and be done with it. Well, they don't seem too upset about it nowadays. Texas has been to the CWS 6 times since Augie got there and since the last time WSU went.

If you don't think todays players want to win, your're nuts. That part hasn't changed. The problem is that they have to be put into situations where they are allowed to succeed. Old Crusty won't play you if you don't do it his way. A player might be Roger frickin' Maris, but it he won't do it Gene's way he'll ride the pine.

---

Don't ever mis-interpret my criticism of Shocker baseball as hate or disrespect. I am the staunchest of Shocker baseball fans and have been to probably close to 1000 Shocker baseball games. If you go to games, you know who I am. I'm just plain tired of watching good young men come in here and not get the chance to enjoy the success and accolades the players from the '80's and '90's got regularly.

--'85.

[SB Shock]

Point 1) Yes it does matter. There is no bonus for slaughtering Bradley 9-2 vs. winning 9-6 and using your better pitchers against better teams to give yourself a reasonable chance of being competitive.

When is the last time WSU been slaughtering anybody in the MVC?

Put the quality starters in the hot seat to beat the tough teams, not frosh/soph pitchers. It might cost you 2-3 MVC games, but SO WHAT.

2-3 MVC wins means WSU finishes 2nd, 3rd or 4th. The Shox used to be able to just bludgeon people in the MVC. Those days are gone.

Point 2) Do you watch Shocker baseball (rhetorical question, I know you do.) The players look selfish because of the way they are taught to bunt. They do not bunt for a sacrifice, they consistently attempt to bunt for a hit. Gene WON'T trade runs for outs and that is stupid baseball given the lack of consistemt power in the WSU lineup over the last 10 or more years.

Your point really points to the fact that Gene favorite lament "Maybe the game has passed me bye" - is true. If you can't recruit the players to play your type of ball, then you have to adapt.

Another point on bunting ... the Texas people used to ***** and moan LIKE CRAZY when Augie Garrido got to Texas and whipped-out his patent brand of small ball (remember the rec.sport.baseball.college days?).

To bad that venue is dead, that was alot of fun.

If you don't think todays players want to win, your're nuts. That part hasn't changed.

There is a difference between wanting to win, and being disciplined in doing the things that your suppose to do so you can be a winner. Just ask Brian Flynn.

[KC Shox]

Oh, and can this team improve its .961 fielding percentage from last year? How many Will Baez o-lays did we all cringe at? It annoys the hell out of me that Gene wants pitching, speed, defense and station-to-station offense but last season for example, the defense sucked and the team had no clue how to bunt. 50 percent competency rate in your core objectives is not good.

These aren't meltdowns folks, these are TRENDS in the program of late that really need to be rectified and is what preventing this team from becoming a semblance of their former selfs.

Oh and the non-con midweek games are extremely important. The MVC stinks so we need all the mid-week high RPI wins as possible to make up for the lack of RPI help this conference won't give. Last season the perfect example.

[SB Shock]

I went back and looked at WSU mid-week games (didn't count the non-div I games) (ND, Central Ark, Arizona, ORU, KSU, OSU, Wash St, NU)

WSU went 8-8 in mid-week games

WSU Weekend Starters started 10 of those games going 4-6
Wins - 2xND, 2xCen. Ark, OSU
losses - 2 x Arizona, 3x ORU, KSU

WSU Non-Weekend starters pitched 6 of those games going 4-2
Wins - ORU, KU, Wash St, Cen. Ark)
Losses - KSU, NU

Bullpen blew up two games that should have been won (1 for each group of pitchers) by giving up 5 runs in the final two innings - both against KSU.

[shoxlax]

I think Coy and Springer will both hit well over .350 with some power. The question is will anyone else fill the offensive holes in our lineup? O'Brien and Grimes have the potential, but they are juniors now, so it is time to step up.

I have a positive feeling (just a gut) that Smith and McGreevy will be decent midweek starters for us.

I also have a positive feeling we will have at least three freshmen that are significant contributors. Also, Davidson and Bayliff seem to be ready to help us more this year.

Just not sure about Hall in the leadoff or our middle relief again.

[The Mad Hatter]

In answer to the question posed by this thread, apparently the first baseball meltdown on this board will be right now.

[shox1989]

In answer to the question posed by this thread, apparently the first baseball meltdown on this board will be right now.

Man, I think you are right. :roll: