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  • The Constitution in DC...

    An interesting piece in the WSJ

    Congress Rediscovers the Constitution
    If the new Congress to be sworn in on Wednesday is the tea party's cardinal achievement so far, its most symbolic achievement will come on Thursday, when the first order of business in the House will be a reading, aloud, of the Constitution. That event alone will not bring us any closer to limited government. But it will help get a debate going that for too long has been dormant.

    Already, House Democrats are lining up to ridicule a closely related rule that the Republican majority has said it will adopt, requiring members to cite the specific constitutional authority for any bill they introduce. "It's an air kiss they're blowing to the tea party," says Barney Frank, outgoing chairman of the House Financial Services Committee. Henry Waxman, outgoing chairman of the House Energy and Commerce Committee, all but dismissed any role for Congress in assessing the constitutionality of its actions: "Whether it is constitutional or not is going to be whether the Supreme Court says it is."

    As a legal matter, Mr. Waxman is right; at least since Marbury v. Madison in 1803, the Supreme Court has had the last word on what the Constitution authorizes Congress to do. But well before that, and long after, members of Congress took it upon themselves to have the first word, often citing their oath of office.

    In 1794, for example, James Madison, the principal author of the Constitution, rose on the House floor to object to a bill appropriating $15,000 for the relief of French refugees who had fled to Baltimore and Philadelphia from an insurrection in San Domingo. He could not, he said, "undertake to lay [his] finger on that article of the Federal Constitution which granted a right to Congress of expending, on objects of benevolence, the money of their constituents." The bill failed.

    Throughout the 19th century, members of Congress and presidents alike rejected legislation because they believed there was no constitutional authority to enact it. The bedrock presumption of our polity, they understood, was individual liberty. The Constitution gave the federal government the authority to pursue certain limited ends, like national security and ensuring free interstate commerce, but otherwise left us free to pursue our ends either through the states or as private individuals. It did not authorize the federal government to provide us with the vast array of goods and services that today reduce so many of us to government dependents.
    Infinity Art Glass - Fantastic local artist and Shocker fan
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  • #2
    according to the NYtimes the constitution is RACIST.

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by SB Shock
      according to the NYtimes the constitution is RACIST.
      SB do you have link on the NY Times claim? I am not baiting, I am truly curious and interested in the matter.

      I suspect any claims originate from the original census which counted "other persons" (slaves) as three-fifths persons for the purposes of apportionment. This fractionalization was removed by the 14th Amendment. The 14th amendment overturned the infamous Dred Scott case.

      It is our Constitutional question of the ages is the document a literal/rigid document or flexible/living document. Smarter people than I have made quite a legal career discussing/debating and trying this question.
      “Losers Average Losers.” ― Paul Tudor Jones

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by DUShock
        Originally posted by SB Shock
        according to the NYtimes the constitution is RACIST.
        SB do you have link on the NY Times claim? I am not baiting, I am truly curious and interested in the matter.

        I suspect any claims originate from the original census which counted "other persons" (slaves) as three-fifths persons for the purposes of apportionment. This fractionalization was removed by the 14th Amendment. The 14th amendment overturned the infamous Dred Scott case.

        It is our Constitutional question of the ages is the document a literal/rigid document or flexible/living document. Smarter people than I have made quite a legal career discussing/debating and trying this question.



        Is this group of Republicans really trying to suggest that they care more deeply about the Constitution than anyone else and will follow it more closely?

        In any case, it is a presumptuous and self-righteous act, suggesting that they alone understand the true meaning of a text that the founders wisely left open to generations of reinterpretation. Certainly the Republican leadership is not trying to suggest that African-Americans still be counted as three-fifths of a person.

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by SB Shock
          Originally posted by DUShock
          Originally posted by SB Shock
          according to the NYtimes the constitution is RACIST.
          SB do you have link on the NY Times claim? I am not baiting, I am truly curious and interested in the matter.

          I suspect any claims originate from the original census which counted "other persons" (slaves) as three-fifths persons for the purposes of apportionment. This fractionalization was removed by the 14th Amendment. The 14th amendment overturned the infamous Dred Scott case.

          It is our Constitutional question of the ages is the document a literal/rigid document or flexible/living document. Smarter people than I have made quite a legal career discussing/debating and trying this question.



          Is this group of Republicans really trying to suggest that they care more deeply about the Constitution than anyone else and will follow it more closely?

          In any case, it is a presumptuous and self-righteous act, suggesting that they alone understand the true meaning of a text that the founders wisely left open to generations of reinterpretation. Certainly the Republican leadership is not trying to suggest that African-Americans still be counted as three-fifths of a person.
          Obviously the Times doesn't understand WHY they were counted as three-fifths.

          Congress has lept way beyond the boundaries of the Constitution and both sides have been guilty of that. At least one side appears to want to try and reign the gov't back in some. We'll see if they really mean it or not.
          Infinity Art Glass - Fantastic local artist and Shocker fan
          RIP Guy Always A Shocker
          Carpenter Place - A blessing to many young girls/women
          ICT S.O.S - Great local cause fighting against human trafficking
          Wartick Insurance Agency - Saved me money with more coverage.
          Save Shocker Sports - A rallying cry

          Comment


          • #6
            It seems to me that by giving an oath to uphold the Constitution (which I have done and taken seriously), you are pledging not to pass legislation that knowingly violates it. And to determine whether it knowingly violates it, one would need to see if the proposed legislations adheres to it.

            By admitting that Congress is not obligated to have it's legislation adhere to the Constitution sounds like a violation of the Oath of Office.

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by RoyalShock
              It seems to me that by giving an oath to uphold the Constitution (which I have done and taken seriously), you are pledging not to pass legislation that knowingly violates it. And to determine whether it knowingly violates it, one would need to see if the proposed legislations adheres to it.

              By admitting that Congress is not obligated to have it's legislation adhere to the Constitution sounds like a violation of the Oath of Office.
              :good:
              Infinity Art Glass - Fantastic local artist and Shocker fan
              RIP Guy Always A Shocker
              Carpenter Place - A blessing to many young girls/women
              ICT S.O.S - Great local cause fighting against human trafficking
              Wartick Insurance Agency - Saved me money with more coverage.
              Save Shocker Sports - A rallying cry

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by SB Shock
                Originally posted by DUShock
                Originally posted by SB Shock
                according to the NYtimes the constitution is RACIST.
                SB do you have link on the NY Times claim? I am not baiting, I am truly curious and interested in the matter.

                I suspect any claims originate from the original census which counted "other persons" (slaves) as three-fifths persons for the purposes of apportionment. This fractionalization was removed by the 14th Amendment. The 14th amendment overturned the infamous Dred Scott case.

                It is our Constitutional question of the ages is the document a literal/rigid document or flexible/living document. Smarter people than I have made quite a legal career discussing/debating and trying this question.



                Is this group of Republicans really trying to suggest that they care more deeply about the Constitution than anyone else and will follow it more closely?

                In any case, it is a presumptuous and self-righteous act, suggesting that they alone understand the true meaning of a text that the founders wisely left open to generations of reinterpretation. Certainly the Republican leadership is not trying to suggest that African-Americans still be counted as three-fifths of a person.
                Thanks SB! Here's a snippet of the op-ed’s rhetorical assertion.

                In any case, it is a presumptuous and self-righteous act, suggesting that they alone understand the true meaning of a text that the founders wisely left open to generations of reinterpretation. Certainly the Republican leadership is not trying to suggest that African-Americans still be counted as three-fifths of a person.

                There is a similar air of vacuous fundamentalism in requiring that every bill cite the Constitutional power given to Congress to enact it. The new House leadership says this is necessary because the health care law and other measures that Republicans do not like have veered from the Constitution. But it is the judiciary that ultimately decides when a law is unconstitutional, not the transitory occupant of the speaker’s chair.
                “Losers Average Losers.” ― Paul Tudor Jones

                Comment


                • #9
                  Reading the Constitution created alot of jobs. :roll:

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by BenWSU
                    Reading the Constitution created alot of jobs. :roll:
                    When did the role of the government become to create jobs?

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by SB Shock
                      Originally posted by BenWSU
                      Reading the Constitution created alot of jobs. :roll:
                      When did the role of the government become to create jobs?
                      When Bush & Obama started their stimulus packages.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by BenWSU
                        Originally posted by SB Shock
                        Originally posted by BenWSU
                        Reading the Constitution created alot of jobs. :roll:
                        When did the role of the government become to create jobs?
                        When Bush & Obama started their stimulus packages.
                        LOL, you really thought that government stimulus was going to create jobs?

                        It is wasteful spending that is ineffective and in the end will cost more jobs than ever were created.

                        America needs to wake up and realize that if you want something, it is up to you, not the government to make sure you get it.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          The Constitution Protects Us
                          Infinity Art Glass - Fantastic local artist and Shocker fan
                          RIP Guy Always A Shocker
                          Carpenter Place - A blessing to many young girls/women
                          ICT S.O.S - Great local cause fighting against human trafficking
                          Wartick Insurance Agency - Saved me money with more coverage.
                          Save Shocker Sports - A rallying cry

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            The Constitution Needs More Than Lip Service from the House GOP
                            Requiring Congress to cite specific authority won't work if Congress follows the old pattern of treating the Commerce clause as a bottomless font of federal power.

                            In 1995's U.S. v. Lopez, for example, for the first time since the New Deal, the Supreme Court struck down a federal law for exceeding the Commerce power — in part because when Congress passed the Gun Free School Zones Act, it couldn't be bothered to cite that catchall clause — or anything else.

                            Easily fixed: in 1996, Congress reenacted the law, requiring that all prosecutions involve guns that traveled in interstate commerce. That covers virtually all guns, but it ignores the 10th Amendment, which holds that "the powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution ... are reserved to the states." As Hamilton affirmed in the Federalist, that means "the ordinary administration of criminal justice" belongs to the states.

                            Boehner's new rule changes little, because since 1997, the House rules have already required a constitutional citation for every bill that leaves committee. Obamacare leaped that speed bump with a perfunctory reference to — surprise! — the Commerce clause.

                            The "radical" class of 1994 had its own 100-member-strong Constitutional Caucus. Founded by Rep. J.D. Hayworth, R-Ariz., it aimed to "restore limited constitutional government."

                            Not long after its founding, the "Constitutional Caucus" voted en masse for the Church Arson Prevention Act, passed unanimously in response to media-driven hysteria over a supposed "epidemic" of Southern church-burnings. That "epidemic" turned out to be a hoax. Even if it hadn't, I'm reliably informed that torching churches is pretty much illegal in all 50 states.
                            Infinity Art Glass - Fantastic local artist and Shocker fan
                            RIP Guy Always A Shocker
                            Carpenter Place - A blessing to many young girls/women
                            ICT S.O.S - Great local cause fighting against human trafficking
                            Wartick Insurance Agency - Saved me money with more coverage.
                            Save Shocker Sports - A rallying cry

                            Comment

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