USD259 Salaries

[WuDrWu]

I saw this article on teacher salaries in Wichita. I'm going to need a little help here from those more informed than I, or pretty much everyone.

https://www.kansas.com/latest-news/article222994110.ece/BINARY/2018-19%20Wichita%20Teachers%20and%20Administrators%20Annual%20Salary%20Report#storylink=readmore_inline

There are 152 pages of teacher salaries, 29 per page, plus 3 on the 153rd page. That's 4411 teachers. The USD259 website claims 50639 students. That's about 12 students per teacher. Class sizes are how big?

I don't know what the average salary is, but a quick glance seems like 48k-62k covers most if not 80% plus of all teachers. 20 scheduled vacation days to cover Xmas and June (so salaries are evened out, effectively giving only July off, but for all intent and purposes they get June and July off, the contract calls for August 1 start date). Plus 16 holidays. I don't know if you also get sick and other vacation days, but I'm guessing yes. Really good medical (low low premiums if you're used to private sector premiums), inclusion in the KPERS retirement scam, free Life Insurance.

Tell me please how they are underpaid? 204 days (at the MOST) for 48-62k on average. Where else can you get that in the private sector? With those benefits?

[C0|dB|00ded]

You ought to look at the Derby school district teacher salaries. There are grade school teachers pulling home 90k+. That's almost 6 figures just to be a babysitter with a very basic lesson plan. I got a glimpse at a "secret budget sheet" that made my jaw hit the floor. This insider also told me that public schools are NOT under funded and waste is rampant as would be expected in a government bureaucracy.


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[SHOCKvalue]

The concept of poor teachers is a logical mirage developed by the teacher unions, at least in this area/market. There are parts of the country with significantly lower pay (Oklahoma, for one), or areas with similar pay but much higher COL's, however 259 peeps aren't exactly rubbing pennies together to keep warm in the winter. Starting salary at 259 is 67th percentile, meaning that a new teacher just out of college at 259 makes more than 2/3rds of the US in individual income. Ten years in puts them at the 73rd percentile, and 13 years plus a masters is 80th percentile. (Percentile calc is WSJ.)

The basic insurance for 259 still has a $0 monthly employee premium, I believe. I think that still applies to teacher's spouse and family as well, but I could be wrong. Better plans are available, for still fairly modest premium upcharge relative to what most others in the US pay.

BUT... for 259 pay, one has to be employed by 259, and work in a 259 school, which are no small tasks in a lot of cases. Suburbs generally pay less because of this 259 nightmare/PITA salary adjustment, 'cause they can.

[atlwsu]

I really don't think the salaries are way out of line. However, the benefits are. If you compare (salary + benefits) ÷ (years worked + years retired) for teachers and private sector jobs of equal responsibility your would have a real imbalance.

My daughter has a master's degree, 12 years experience and directs the activities for special education teachers at 2 schools. My son is in the private sector has 6 years of experience, 2 liberal arts bachelor degrees, with no supervisory responsibilities. He make $5K to $10K per year more than her. But because of her retirement benefits his lifetime earnings will most likely be far less than hers. I don't know how we tax payers keep paying for this.

[WuDrWu]

I tend to agree. It's the combo of benefits that really is out of line, especially when you consider it's taxpayer funded. Public sector jobs just shouldn't pay better than private sector, ever.

[SHOCKvalue]

You ought to look at the Derby school district teacher salaries. There are grade school teachers pulling home 90k+. That's almost 6 figures just to be a babysitter with a very basic lesson plan. I got a glimpse at a "secret budget sheet" that made my jaw hit the floor. This insider also told me that public schools are NOT under funded and waste is rampant as would be expected in a government bureaucracy.


T


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Looks like Derby tops out at $48K with a bachelors, $61 with a masters, and $73K with a doctorate...

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1ATp...ZFreR-IEf/view

Derby has the same PITA job adjustment as 259, with the Oaklawn area being Derby schools.

[C0|dB|00ded]

Those numbers are incorrect (Fake News) lol. I personally laid eyes on a salary budget sheet obtained from a senior official which included the names of every teacher and their total compensation. One lady was a 2nd grade teacher hauling in 90k plus with a masters. There were many at the 70-80k level.

I'll check to see if the report I was reading was "top secret". If it wasn't I'll copy some of the data on here. Your jaw will drop...


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[SHOCKvalue]

I guess... whatever.

My wife is actually a teacher (a non-union, non-whiny one), so I'm familiar with how these salary schedules actually work.

[C0|dB|00ded]

I've contacted my "source". I know what I saw. This data came from the highest level. I put my eyeballs on names, schools, and total compensation for the prior year. Some were north of 90k.

Have your wife apply in Derby lol. It's sick really... good for them though! Everybody should be making a great wage in America.


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[atlwsu]

I really don't think the salaries are way out of line. However, the benefits are. If you compare (salary + benefits) ÷ (years worked + years retired) for teachers and private sector jobs of equal responsibility your would have a real imbalance.

My daughter has a master's degree, 12 years experience and directs the activities for special education teachers at 2 schools. My son is in the private sector has 6 years of experience, 2 liberal arts bachelor degrees, with no supervisory responsibilities. He make $5K to $10K per year more than her. But because of her retirement benefits his lifetime earnings will most likely be far less than hers. I don't know how we tax payers keep paying for this.

[small tyme baller]

..

[Kung Wu]

I wouldn't be surprised if there are a large number of special needs teachers in the mix. I bet the ratios for them is quite low.

[WuDrWu]

Excellent point thank you, and frankly I'm a little embarrassed I didn't fully consider that. Since so few, if any, special needs students are serviced in the other school options, I'm sure that does skew things.

[SHOCKvalue]

Lmfao you two couldn't be more clueless. I'd love to talk to your insider in Derby Cold, I know numerous district employees over there as well. I've worked in multiple school districts within KS -- rural & city -- and I think y'all need to research the issue of teacher salaries, school funding, & shitstorm of politics surrounding the issue. The actual laws surrounding funding public edu are as confusing as about anything you can find... Easy to misunderstand or be misled.

Btw my current medical working for a local school district blows & wife didn't receive sufficient maternity leave due to the significance of her position & lack of staff support. Also dont know any effective teachers who work under 65+ hours per week, throw in if they coach, sponsor, etc and add more. The few not working that amount, usually, work a 2nd job or find seasonal work. Thousand other talking points here but I'm sure you don't really care, so I'll end it here..

And Cold... "secret budget sheet"

Uphill in the snow both ways indeed, in spite of the unadulterated fact that salary schedules and health insurance data is public knowledge. As is the ability to cross-reference that data with overall population data for context and comparison purposes.

”Facts don’t care about your feelings”, as is said, and I think you’re living on the feelings side of the equation.

[C0|dB|00ded]

Guess I gotta respond here as stb's original post was already deleted. So yeah, I was speaking with "politicians" and the discussion involved much laughter over the poor teacher narrative. I was handed a budget sheet which I was a little uncomfortable reading and we commented at length about several surprisingly strong Derby teacher salaries. The grade school person at like $93k was a stunner. There were a bunch at $70k. Needless to say I haven't felt sad a day since whenever I hear the plight of the Kansas school teacher. They also went into great lengths about the Fake News surrounding budget shortfalls attributing a lot of it to wasteful spending. Many more details about curriculum/supplies purchasing that I do not remember.

No need to get triggered fellas but I saw what I saw... I would have no reason to make this up.


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[WuDrWu]

I love the argument that they work a 2nd job or seasonal work.....you know why? Because they CAN! I get that they want more money, most people do! But most people don't get the time off during the year to be able to take a seasonal job. As for the coaching, etc, those are PAID extra. It's your choice. Uphill in the snow both ways is flawless.

[SHOCKvalue]

It's weird that teachers work 65 hours per week, when the school parking lots are almost entirely empty one hour prior to school and within one hour after school. Strange that. Must have a machine to bend space and time.

And everyone in the private sector works 40 hours per week.

[C0|dB|00ded]

na

[Shockm]

I really don't think the salaries are way out of line. However, the benefits are. If you compare (salary + benefits) ÷ (years worked + years retired) for teachers and private sector jobs of equal responsibility your would have a real imbalance.

My daughter has a master's degree, 12 years experience and directs the activities for special education teachers at 2 schools. My son is in the private sector has 6 years of experience, 2 liberal arts bachelor degrees, with no supervisory responsibilities. He make $5K to $10K per year more than her. But because of her retirement benefits his lifetime earnings will most likely be far less than hers. I don't know how we tax payers keep paying for this.

I don’t believe you know what you’re talking about. Several years ago, retirement benefits went way down. Also if things are so good in education, why is there a TEACHER SHORTAGE?

Doc you obviously are a rich person who always has WSU courtside seats. Good for you. Teachers will never afford those kind of benefits. I don’t know if you want their job and compensation.

[Shockm]

To answer Docs question and I may be wrong but I think I remembered that KPERS changed after 2013 or a year or two later. I just remember that new teachers (probably all KPERS ) don’t receive the same benefit anymore. Like you said, I may be wrong.

[WuDrWu]

I need to do some research here. I believe (not certain at all) that what changed was new enrollees into the KPERS program were going to have a different payout structure. I don't believe one single person already counting on the benefit had anything change. The older structure was something like put in a certain number of years (maybe 6 maybe 10?) and then retire as early as early 50s for around 3-400 a month or wait and watch that number go up to maybe 900 a month at 60 for the rest of your life or your spouse, whomever lived longest. I think the employee contribution was something like 26 dollars a month. Again, could be off but the bottom line is that it became apparent that KPERS was going to go bankrupt huge and had to be changed.

[ShockBand]

I don't know who pays $26 a month into KPERS, but it isn't me. My current monthly contribution into the KPERS system is 6% of my gross. Being a "KPERS 1" hired before July 1, 2009, in order to retire early with full KPERS benefits, you have to either meet the rule of 85 (age plus years of service) OR be 62 and have 10 years of service OR 65 with one year. I can take reduced retirement benefits at age 55 with 10 years of service. Right now my full monthly benefit at retirement looks to be about 1/3 of my current gross salary. Since 12 of my 25+ years were in private education at Collegiate and Independent, I'm in till at least 62, and they made contributions into my TIAA-CREF account.

Those hired after that 2009 date do not have the rule of 85 option. They can take full retirement at age 60 with 30 years of service OR age 65 with 5 years of service. They can retire with reduced benefits at age 55 and 10 years of service.

As far as how much, and whether they went down or not, I would have to dig into the deep weeds of all the multiplier and actuarial stuff they calculate on. If it did go down, I don't think it was by a ton. And to be honest, KPERS has always to my recollection stressed that KPERS should be viewed as one PART of your total retirement plan. My aim is for Social Security to be about a third, KPERS to be about a third, and my own retirement savings to be about a third.

[SHOCKvalue]

I don’t believe you know what you’re talking about. Several years ago, retirement benefits went way down. Also if things are so good in education, why is there a TEACHER SHORTAGE?

Doc you obviously are a rich person who always has WSU courtside seats. Good for you. Teachers will never afford those kind of benefits. I don’t know if you want their job and compensation.

Plenty of teachers with season tickets in Koch, and nice homes to come home to after the game.

Study income percentiles. Amazes me how many seemingly intelligent persons aren't able to interpret such basic and objective data. Or react completely irrationally when encountering it.

[C0|dB|00ded]

Shits gonna get real in this thread I do predict. Hopefully I can post my "readily available public data" and all the unhappy teachers can go to Derby and live the good life lol.


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