Fred VanVleet is a Shocker!!

[ShockTalk]

VanVleet stands by Wichita State

Atlanta Celtics summer basketball coach DeWayne Jackson watched Fred VanVleet carry Pryme Tyme to upset after upset.

Impressive, but Jackson also paid close attention to VanVleet's behavior off the court. VanVleet, a senior point guard from Rockford, Ill., orally committed to Wichita State in July. Then he stuck with the Shockers even as his reputation grew and high-profile schools made inquiries.

"He's at a tournament at Minneapolis and I see him wearing a Wichita State shirt," Jackson said. "That kid will tell anybody he's committed to Wichita State because that was the first school that recruited him. To be able to get a kid like that to stay loyal after he started getting a lot of recognition... that story about him is a better one than any you could tell."

VanVleet, from Auburn High, spent all summer raising his game. He proved he can make jump shots. He continued to prove he can run a team with more maturity and efficiency than most point guards. Pryme Tyme coach Anthony Cornell said he took calls from coaches at schools such as Stanford and Michigan wanting to know how solid VanVleet's commitment stood.

"He told all of them, 'I'm not into that,' " Cornell said.

"Fred can pinpoint and pick out the weak spots in a defense," Cornell said. "They're making checkers moves, and he's making chess moves."

News for the WSU basketball program doesn't get any better than that!

:wsu_posters: :posterwu: :wsu_posters: :band:

[shock]

Awesome

[WSUwatcher]

Slow down

He's the best high school pt guard in the country, from what I've seen (AAU tournaments confirm that). I just hope he plays at WSU for more than two seasons.

As Dan said, you're getting way ahead of yourself, another.

Step 1 is for Fred to honor his commitment and sign, as it certainly appears he will.

Step 2 is for him to show the same ability at the D-1 collegiate level.

But even then, step 3 is almost certainly not to leave early. PGs who stand 5-11 or 6-0 are seldom in such demand that there's any reason for them to jump ship.

[another shocker]

How in the world is the #1 ranked pt guard in Illinois (which says a lot right there), who outplayed, if not dominated, every pt guard he came up against in AAU tournaments (that says even more), over and over again, ranked the 27th best pt guard in the country? Did I read that right?

[SubGod22]

How in the world is the #1 ranked pt guard in Illinois (which says a lot right there), who outplayed, if not dominated, every pt guard he came up against in AAU tournaments (that says even more), over and over again, ranked the 27th best pt guard in the country? Did I read that right?

One, many say the 2012 class in Illinois is one of the weakest they've seen in a long time.

I don't have an answer for the other part. I know Rivals didn't rank him because they didn't see him play this summer. How the others do it I do not know. Based on his summer performance, he should be ranked a lot higher in all rankings.

[Aargh]

His height is keeping his rankings modest. He's not the prototype "quicker than stink" PG at that height. There are taller PG's out there who are quicker than Van Vleet.

Van Vleet has the ability to make things happen when he gets his hands on the ball. Some quicker, taller, and more highly rated PG's found they couldn't do much to stop him or even slow him down.

There are at least 26 schools that are major accounts for Rivals and Scout, who signed PG's for 2012. Rivals and Scout are going to give their cash cows a reason to think that Rivals and Scout know what they are doing. (If they agree with BCS coaches, then they obviously know what they're doing - right?)

There's no reason to get hung up on ratings. It would be nice to see a WSU recruit get a bunch of stars. Those stars are worth about what the stars you used to get in Sunday School are worth.

[wufan]

How in the world is the #1 ranked pt guard in Illinois (which says a lot right there), who outplayed, if not dominated, every pt guard he came up against in AAU tournaments (that says even more), over and over again, ranked the 27th best pt guard in the country? Did I read that right?

One, many say the 2012 class in Illinois is one of the weakest they've seen in a long time.

I don't have an answer for the other part. I know Rivals didn't rank him because they didn't see him play this summer. How the others do it I do not know. Based on his summer performance, he should be ranked a lot higher in all rankings.

+ 1 on the two above posts. Remember too, that a couple of the PGs he matched/out-played were in the class of 2013, so that doesn't move him up or down in any way.

There are a few obvious reasons that he isn't rated higher:

1) He's 5-11 and 175 lbs.
2) He's fairly unathletic when compared to an elite level PG (compare and contrast VanVleet vs Manigault for opposite extremes).
3) He was a bit of a late bloomer that choose to sign at WSU prior to any BCS schools offering.
4) He plays on an AAU team that lacks elite level talent, and therefore he doesn't get as many views.

Based on the above listed reasons, he will also not bolt to the NBA after his sophomore season. Sherron Collins is a good example of a much more athletic, much higher profile PG that did not leave early for the NBA. If Sheron couldn't do it, I'd be shocked if FVV made the leap in jsut three years.

Lastly, from the videos I saw, FVV has a hole in his game that is common amongst HS PGs. His passes don't have enough zip. He will need to get that under control before he becomes an elite level D-I PG.

[shockmonster]

I think that it's a waste of time to try to read the minds of rivals evlauators and speculate what they are thinking. Who knows what they would think if he would have committed with Illinois, etc or if they would have seen him play. I guarantee you that their is laziness and mob mentality that evaluators use when they don't even see the player. ESPN saw him and rated him high. I think that if Rivals had seen him, they too would have rated him higher.

[another shocker]

Oh, I saw some guys on MVC talk say that Illinois is down this year.. ha ha. From what I've seen, Van Vleet does what he wants, when he wants on a basketball court.. so fast/quick to the basket, other players can't even react to it. Sorry, I'm not a Sherron Collins fan, wufan... Aheleghbe outplayed him.

[Steeleshocker]

Oh, I saw some guys on MVC talk say that Illinois is down this year.. ha ha. From what I've seen, Van Vleet does what he wants, when he wants on a basketball court.. so fast/quick to the basket, other players can't even react to it. Sorry, I'm not a Sherron Collins fan, wufan... Aheleghbe outplayed him.

The point isn't whether you think Sherron Collins is good or not. The point is that he was a small guard, and had to prove himself multiple years in college before getting a sniff at the NBA. He might have been able to go after his junior year, but he decided to stay in an attempt to improve his position. It will take the same sort of effort over multiple years for FVV. If he wants it, he can certainly go take it, but it will be a 3-4 year road.

[wufan]

Oh, I saw some guys on MVC talk say that Illinois is down this year.. ha ha. From what I've seen, Van Vleet does what he wants, when he wants on a basketball court.. so fast/quick to the basket, other players can't even react to it. Sorry, I'm not a Sherron Collins fan, wufan... Aheleghbe outplayed him.

The point isn't whether you think Sherron Collins is good or not. The point is that he was a small guard, and had to prove himself multiple years in college before getting a sniff at the NBA. He might have been able to go after his junior year, but he decided to stay in an attempt to improve his position. It will take the same sort of effort over multiple years for FVV. If he wants it, he can certainly go take it, but it will be a 3-4 year road.

Oh good! I'm glad someone got my point. Also, it's not the MVC talk folks who's opinion the Illinois talent is based on...it's the recruiting gurus, and more importantly, the coaches. There aren't alot of high level schools offering the Illinois class of 2012. You can like it or not, Illinois HS b-ball is not as good this year as it has been in the recent past. That said, it is irrelevant to FVVs talent.

[another shocker]

FVV isn't misrepresenting Illinois at all, from what I've seen.

Kemba Walker would have been the comparison I would have made.. you know, a pure OD PG.

[wufan]

FVV isn't misrepresenting Illinois at all, from what I've seen.

Kemba Walker would have been the comparison I would have made.. you know, a pure OD PG.

No body said anything about "misrepresenting Illinois," and to be quite honest, I don't know what that means.

As to Kemba, why not Allen Iverson? There are several players (even smallish PGs) that are highly rated in HS and DO leave for the NBA early. That was not my point. My point was that alot of small PGs that are HS AAs and collegiate AAs, don't leave early. Since FVV is not a HS AA, his chances are even more slim.

[pinstripers]

This continues to get stupider and stupider. (new word)

[_kai_]

This continues to get stupider and stupider. (new word)

I completely agree. This convo has taking a detour to the bizarre.