#3 Wichita State vs. Loyola Official Game Thread

[WSUwatcher]

Holland burns a year for a few minutes a game?

And Shaq would play even less.

Indeed, shizzle. If this isn't the goofiest ax to grind that I've seen this year, I don't know what is. Morris wasn't ready or in shape -- not Shocker shape, anyway -- and plays the deepest position on the team, where three guys are currently combining for 48(!) minutes a game as Carter spills over to PF. So what minutes would he get? And Holland is still building himself up, in addition to which he was never expected to be a backup PG this season. With Baker, Cotton, and FVV (way) ahead of him, what minutes would he be getting?

The two of them would be 11th and 12th on the roster in PT, getting fewer minutes than the 91 that Derail Green has played, and our geniuses would all be wondering why they hadn't redshirted instead of wasting the year. And by the way, if the coaches really think the Shocks absolutely can't get by without one or both of them this season, that option is still available, although it isn't clear what difference they'd have made in any of the games WSU has lost so far. Oops...

What's nice about this edition of the Shocks is that although they still have the occasional poor game against a lesser opponent, so far they're good enough and tough enough to win even when that happens (as opposed to, say, February 2011 at home against SIU, the night the Shocks booked their trip to the NIT they'd eventually go on to win) -- and tonight by double digits. Morris and Holland will have their time. It just hasn't arrived yet.

As long as WSU's worst problem is failing to cover the spread while winning on their off nights, it's hard to take seriously some of the complaints we're seeing.

[Aargh]

This and this.

Marshall putting in the deep bench before halftime was an omen of things to come. Scrubs came in way too early and when the starters came back, everything was way out of whack and rhythm. Started playing prevent offense, letting the shot clock wind down. It was about this time that Loyola felt like they had a chance.

I like our bench guys to get some playing time, but I don't EVER want to see it at the expense of letting the other team think they have a chance to win. This happened tonight.

When we're up by 40 with 10 minutes to go, ok, we can watch it dwindle down to 20 or 25. But when you're up 20 with 13 minutes left, and then the bench empties, that's just asking for it.

57 points against freaking Loyola. Loyola is in no way good. This was all of our undoing. Doyle only came alive late, when again, he felt like his team had a chance and played inspired. Outside of that, Cotton shut him down. He was a non-factor.

Again, moving on.

The other side of that coin is that now the Shox realize that any team in the conference can contribute to the Shox not achieving their goals.

[Rosewood]

The other side of that coin is that now the Shox realize that any team in the conference can contribute to the Shox not achieving their goals.

This. At first I was thinking about being critical about HCGM having cotton running the point with out baker or early but then I remembered how many final fours he has been to compared to me. Them I shut up.

In HCGM I trust. Even when it doesn't make sense and I feel it contributed to the negative results I don't care. In HCGM intrust.

[Rlh04d]

nope

yep

[Rlh04d]

maybe he was wanting to give the big minute guys a rest ?
a win is a win, disappointed it was only 57-45 but 22-0 sounds pretty good to me.

He actually ended up giving them less of a rest than he could have.

We could have stepped on their throats early and rested the starters most of the second half. Instead, FVV played 35 minutes, Early 31, etc. Baker only had 26 because he had to sit with the bone bruise. Too much rest early made it so they didn't get as much rest overall.

[molly jabali]

After sleeping on it, it probably was the perfect storm of a VERY beatable opponent that still played its' best to lose by 12, maybe throwing in Ron's ankle tweak, some fairly short range misses.....not to mention little things like an average ft%, some careless passing and a couple full to the hoop drives by them....I was more impressed with them than I thought I would be, but we made them look that good...

[Slalomshocker]

When the walk-on PG is playing with 3 mins to go in the first half....the message is clear. I love coach, but he is the one that sent that message and then he threw a couple fits on the sideline that, while not as "impressive" as Moser's fit, were really close to a 3 yr old that didn't get his ice cream. You can't fault your team for believing they don't have to try when you are the one that said "we don't have to try" by putting Simon in the game. As soon as it became evident the 2nd 5 couldn't manage, there should have been starters sprinkled in. Give the guys some positives to work from. So what if they lose a few points off the lead, but let them succeed as well. Have Cotton run the point, but give him Cle to score. Thats how the 2nd group gets confidence, not by blowing a 24pt lead.

This is what really bothers me; Coach has gone out of his way to take jabs and criticize the perceived lack of respect for WSU. This game is precisely why there is that lack of respect. You want the national respect? Do what the nation expects. Beat teams like Loyola by 30. That really isn't even running it up. Play your main guys until the under 8 and then empty the bench if you like. Quit feeling sorry and appologizing for being 30-40pts better than every other team in this junk league! Love ya coach, but its time to quit being nice and show what you got.

[another shocker]

yep

you're entitled to your opinion, too.

'shouldn't have redshirted holland and shaq.

[wu_shizzle]

you're entitled to your opinion, too.

'shouldn't have redshirted holland and shaq.

Do you have any reasons why?

[ShockerPhi]

Frankly, I like Marshall putting in the scrubs often. This time, yes maybe it was a little detrimental because the game started getting a little out of hand. But I like getting the deep bench some minutes. And I like the nation underestimating us. It just might help out again in March.

[asiseeit]

I like to look at positives, as well as negatives. I saw two positives. First, holding our
opponent to 35% shooting and 45 points. Second, 44-28 rebound edge that won the
game. Our shooting and offense execution were dismal and our bench was dismal
with the exception of EW. Now, many of you have been on EW's case for not scoring.
Is that what you think GM inserts him into the game for? I seriously doubt it. He
helped TC take Doyle out of the game offensively until the game was no longer in
doubt. Please remember that we run and execute ALOT of set plays ad those plays
are not designed with EW as a scorer. When NW enters the game he is expected to
contribute offensively and he is part of the plays designed for our scorers. I also
thought KC had another decent game. Fred had 9 assists and led the team with 8
rebounds. Except for CE our perimeter scorers didn't show up.

[pinstripers]

In retrospect, what is Loyola doing in the league?

[1972Shocker]

IF this 2nd half serves as a catalyst to get the Shocks re-focused and re-energized than it may have been worth sitting through that miserable 2nd half. Even the 1st half I didn't think the Shocks were particular sharp although they played well enough to double up the Ramblers.

No doubt Coach Marshall will pull the grinding wheel out of closet and work on sharpening his tool kit.

[WstateU]

The sun came up this morning and we're 22 and friggin' 0; not sure about you, but I'm ready for...

[ShockerPrez]

In retrospect, what is Loyola doing in the league?

Sadly, they are fitting right in with 3 or 4 other Valley schools