Pre-Game Thread: vs Missouri (11/29/22)

[ShockTalk]

No one is "hating" on Porter. You can recognize him for being good at all of those things, while also recognizing that as our starting point guard, he only has four more assists than turnovers on the season, including 5 turnovers in a game we lost in OT.

I agree but he needs to learn how to pass out of pressure rather than dribble into it. As a pg I feel he should be looking to draw post defenders when driving and finding someone under the hoop to pass to. But he is generally driving for a shot himself, which he has had some success with. But a pg needs to make the team work. That and stop the 5-10 seconds of dribbling at the top while diagnosing a potential drive.

Well, he had a 2:1 TO ratio last year when he wasn't dealing with a rag-tag bunch of newbies coming in from so many other programs and their systems, along with a mostly inexperienced coach dealing with his first class of the same.

[Shock Top]

Can we wait that long? That is the question.

No.

Have to strike while the flame for WSU basketball is still there.

If you let it burn out first, it's harder to start a brand new fire rather than grow it back with the ambers.

[Stickboy46]

I agree but he needs to learn how to pass out of pressure rather than dribble into it. As a pg I feel he should be looking to draw post defenders when driving and finding someone under the hoop to pass to. But he is generally driving for a shot himself, which he has had some success with. But a pg needs to make the team work. That and stop the 5-10 seconds of dribbling at the top while diagnosing a potential drive.

How often is there ACTUALLY someone under the hoop to pass to though ..

[Atxshoxfan]

Well, he had a 2:1 TO ratio last year when he wasn't dealing with a rag-tag bunch of newbies coming in from so many other programs and their systems, along with a mostly inexperienced coach dealing with his first class of the same.

TE had a great sophomore year...How did that work out the next year.
I'm not ragging on cp. I enjoy watching him and feel he is a huge contributor to the team. But just maybe he's feeling like he has to do great things for the team, like TE felt. He doesn't need to. He just needs to focus on how he can make the team better. That's what a good pg does.

[MikeKennedyRulZ]

TE had a great sophomore year...How did that work out the next year.
I'm not ragging on cp. I enjoy watching him and feel he is a huge contributor to the team. But just maybe he's feeling like he has to do great things for the team, like TE felt. He doesn't need to. He just needs to focus on how he can make the team better. That's what a good pg does.

Comparing what Porter is doing this year to TE's abyssmal performance last season is outright laughable and maybe the biggest joke in the history of SN.

Focus on making this team better????? What more does he need to do? Maybe a few less turnovers but come on!

Screenshot 2022-12-01 171032.jpg

[Atxshoxfan]

Comparing what Porter is doing this year to TE's abyssmal performance last season is outright laughable and maybe the biggest joke in the history of SN.

Focus on making this team better????? What more does he need to do? Maybe a few less turnovers but come on!

Screenshot 2022-12-01 171032.jpg

Again, I'm not ragging on CP, just stating what I see. More turnovers this year so far with less competition. While his assists are about the same as last year, they are middle of the pack for a point guard.
I wasn't comparing him to TE's total digression but I think CP feels he has to dribble out of pressure, often behind his back or between his legs right into a double team. He needs to find where the open teammate is in that situation. Where as TE felt he had to be the team.
So what does he need to do? More assists and less turnovers.

[MikeKennedyRulZ]

Again, I'm not ragging on CP, just stating what I see. More turnovers this year so far with less competition. While his assists are about the same as last year, they are middle of the pack for a point guard.
I wasn't comparing him to TE's total digression but I think CP feels he has to dribble out of pressure, often behind his back or between his legs right into a double team. He needs to find where the open teammate is in that situation. Where as TE felt he had to be the team.
So what does he need to do? More assists and less turnovers.

Honestly I think he’s doing plenty and the graphic I posted supports that. I think people are being nit picky when it comes to him. That’s my opinion. Would I like to see him protect the ball more? Certainly. But I’m not going to fault him one bit. He has very little help from the bench or the court.

[MadDog]

I think CP is a great player and the heart of the team. I think the unhappiness with his turnovers is not necessarily the quantity, but the type of turnovers he has been committing lately. It seems he makes very few dead ball turnovers (I.e. traveling, charging, throwing the ball out of bounds) and a large number of what Marshall would call “atomic bombs”, I.e getting the ball taken away while dribbling or throwing a bad pass that is intercepted. The atomic bombs seem to usually result in a layup or dunk. I don’t know if they keep stats on this type of thing but it would be interesting to know how his turnovers break down.

[ShockTalk]

Again, I'm not ragging on CP, just stating what I see. More turnovers this year so far with less competition. While his assists are about the same as last year, they are middle of the pack for a point guard.
I wasn't comparing him to TE's total digression but I think CP feels he has to dribble out of pressure, often behind his back or between his legs right into a double team. He needs to find where the open teammate is in that situation. Where as TE felt he had to be the team.
So what does he need to do? More assists and less turnovers.

Over the previous 2 years, CP played with teams that were very experienced players and had experience with the system.

This year, the team is almost all newbies to WSU and learning a system probably different than what they had the previous year or 2 (or more). If players are not where they are supposed to be, the outlet pass isn't there to be had and it may be hard to get out of a situation not of his making (thus a potential TO). He had a TO rate of only 1.9 last year. He knows how to value the ball. By the way, shooters need to make their shots for him to get an assist. We've got 4 players averaging a shooting average around 35% FG and around 17% from three. Bump that to 40-42% FG and 25-27% from three (still low), he'd probably have those additional assists you'd like to see and we might have been 7-0 or at least 6-1 right now.

We've seen what CP has done in the past with assists. Let's not just think that he has forgotten how to do it. The man leads the team in minutes, scoring, rebounding, assists, steals, blocks, while shooting 50% FG and 38% from three. I think I'll give him a break on the TOs until further in the season as well.

[BostonWu]

Would love to have seen CP play for GM

[Woodrow]

"the term of employment will run from May 1, 2021, to April 30, 2026. Coach Brown will receive one million the first two years, 1.25 million in years three and four, and 1.5 million in year five." "if he's fired without cause in section 13 of the LOI. How much varies depending on the year of employment - if it happens in years 1-3, he gets whatever remains on his contract still. If it happens in years 4-5, he gets half of whatever remains." This is from one of "Ted Lasso's" posts quoting the terms.

It would appear that Brown would get $4 million if fired at the end of this season.

If I was deciding, I would hire an Executive Head Coach and get rid of an assistant coach. Keep Brown and let him report to the new Executive Coach if he wants to stay. If he doesn't, so much the better. No way I leave the keys to our future in Browns hands.

[pinstripers]

No new coach would accept that

[ShockingButTrue]

Who said CP wasn't any good? He's doing as good of a job playing point as Jamarius Burton did under GGG (that's why Beard wanted him at Tech). As a point guard his job is to make the team and his teammates better, stats be damned, and not the other way around. If GGG was his coach he'd be pulled for some of the -ahem- 'mental errors' he seems to commit multiple times every game, if we're being honest. But, if WSU finishes 1st, 2nd or 3rd in the Conference CP will be 1st, 2nd, or 3rd team All Conference. As GGG said "the rewards will come..."

I think the pace that WSU plays right now favors what skills CP has. Any quicker of a pace would probably result in "diminishing returns" with our guards.

[Dan]

CP is a very good basketball player. He’s just not what you want as a tight ball handler and facilitator at the PG. His handles are too loose, as 3G would say. Watching on TV you can see defenders constantly sneaking up behind him to swat the ball away or luring him into a double team. It’s exactly what i would do if I were game planning against him.

[WstateU]

CP is a very good basketball player. He’s just not what you want as a tight ball handler and facilitator at the PG. His handles are too loose, as 3G would say. Watching on TV you can see defenders constantly sneaking up behind him to swat the ball away or luring him into a double team. It’s exactly what i would do if I were game planning against him.

I put part of the blame on the players and coaching staff.

Back when Ross and I played at the "U", our teammates were supposed to yell "WOLF!" when someone was coming up from behind to swat the ball away. I believe the term is still used today, but I sit pretty low in the arena and haven't heard it used by CP's teammates or our couching staff. It drives me nuts when I'm the only person yelling "WOLF!" when CP is about to be 'picked'. I also get some funny looks from people around me.

From a simple Google search...

"Whenever our point guard has the basketball and is advancing up court, and one of our team realizes that there is someone coming from behind, we'll yell “Wolf”, and that is his cue to switch hands, or to look around his shoulders to realize there is a guy coming who is ready to knock the ball away."