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2020-21 Bracketology

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  • RoyalShock
    replied
    Originally posted by pie n eye View Post

    Sorry, I don’t buy it. It’s a minimal impact at best.
    I agree. It's just one of many arrows in a coaching staff's recruiting quiver. On-court results, coach/program/player fit, conference prestige, surely all have a greater impact than how a recruit was ranked when committed. The player isn't limited to what the so-called "experts" are putting out, but also the very important narrative communicated by the coaches.

    Leave a comment:


  • pie n eye
    replied
    Originally posted by SubGod22 View Post
    As to recruiting rankings (drops), they can have an impact on recruiting as a whole. Kids see the numbers. Coaches see the numbers. If you're pulling in top 50, 100, 150 kids, it catches eyes of those players and coaches and can help open more doors.

    Numbers aren't everything by any means, but they do play a part and can have an impact.
    Sorry, I don’t buy it. It’s a minimal impact at best.

    Leave a comment:


  • pie n eye
    replied
    Originally posted by TheShocktocles View Post

    Pie you really miss the point. Yes we know shocker players are going to perform better than they are ranked because we got good coaches that can see talent even if the national media can not. So I will not be surprised that KP performs better than what they think now since they have dropped him 50 spots. And I agree with others that it affects perception and makes it harder to get in the NCAA tournament when your trying to get in than already being listed as one of the teams in Bracketology. If your listed in bracketology you get benefit of the doubt if you lose a game , whereas if your not in and you lose a game the mindset is see we knew you were not good enough to be listed in the top 68 teams.

    But the bigger point is that WSU basketball is not treated fairly and does not get the respect it deserves. I just read an article titled " Top 10 College basketball programs since 2010. Kentucky or Duke No.1? They only listed 15 teams. Wichita State was in the group 5 on the Outside. The other 4 teams in this group were Michigan State, Wisconsin, Butler, and Ohio State. The quote on the Shockers was this:

    THE SHOCKERS RANK 5TH IN WINNING PERCENTAGE AMONG ALL DIVISIONS 1 PROGRAMS THIS DECADE.

    Yet the Shockers do not get treated like it has the 5th winning percentage among ALL divisions 1 teams. Each year it is the same old crap. I haven't double checked but I bet the other 14 teams in the above article are listed in June bracketology. So why not the Shockers? I tell you what, I know bullsht when I see it. The Shockers deserve to be in the June bracketology. I know 8 teams from the Big 10 conference is wrong.
    If that’s the kind of thing you want to worry about who am I to try and change your mind.

    Personally, I don’t put much stock in the basketball “experts” or media. I know what Wichita State has a very good basketball program that annually competes for championships and NCAA berths. Outside validation (of which WSU has received plenty during the Marshall era) isn’t necessary.

    I get it. I’m starved for shocker news and am ready for the season. That being said, if you’re reading June bracketology articles you’re desperate. If you’re getting this upset over June bracketology articles you need to rethink your life.

    Leave a comment:


  • AZ Shocker
    replied
    Exactly SubGod22. Exactly.

    Leave a comment:


  • SubGod22
    replied
    As to recruiting rankings (drops), they can have an impact on recruiting as a whole. Kids see the numbers. Coaches see the numbers. If you're pulling in top 50, 100, 150 kids, it catches eyes of those players and coaches and can help open more doors.

    Numbers aren't everything by any means, but they do play a part and can have an impact.

    Leave a comment:


  • TheShocktocles
    replied
    Originally posted by pie n eye View Post

    Once we sign him what difference does it make? His ranking dropping or improving has zero effect on how he will play next year or over his career.
    Pie you really miss the point. Yes we know shocker players are going to perform better than they are ranked because we got good coaches that can see talent even if the national media can not. So I will not be surprised that KP performs better than what they think now since they have dropped him 50 spots. And I agree with others that it affects perception and makes it harder to get in the NCAA tournament when your trying to get in than already being listed as one of the teams in Bracketology. If your listed in bracketology you get benefit of the doubt if you lose a game , whereas if your not in and you lose a game the mindset is see we knew you were not good enough to be listed in the top 68 teams.

    But the bigger point is that WSU basketball is not treated fairly and does not get the respect it deserves. I just read an article titled " Top 10 College basketball programs since 2010. Kentucky or Duke No.1? They only listed 15 teams. Wichita State was in the group 5 on the Outside. The other 4 teams in this group were Michigan State, Wisconsin, Butler, and Ohio State. The quote on the Shockers was this:

    THE SHOCKERS RANK 5TH IN WINNING PERCENTAGE AMONG ALL DIVISIONS 1 PROGRAMS THIS DECADE.

    Yet the Shockers do not get treated like it has the 5th winning percentage among ALL divisions 1 teams. Each year it is the same old crap. I haven't double checked but I bet the other 14 teams in the above article are listed in June bracketology. So why not the Shockers? I tell you what, I know bullsht when I see it. The Shockers deserve to be in the June bracketology. I know 8 teams from the Big 10 conference is wrong.

    Leave a comment:


  • Dan
    replied
    Originally posted by ShockdaWorld View Post
    I think it does make some difference, even if it's a small one. Drop 2 or 3 kids by 50 points and it could potentially drop your recruiting class similarly, say from top 100 nationally to 150. Bracketology and top 25 rankings drop accordingly. Could be what preseason would be considered a bubble team to nowhere close. So instead of spending your season fighting your way into the top 25, you spend your season fighting your way into the bubble. And yes, I absolutely believe the selection committee watches that stuff.
    Yes, this is what I was alluding to about Memphis. Not sure how they are viewed this year, but the talking heads seem to love them and always give them the benefit of doubt.

    Leave a comment:


  • ShockdaWorld
    replied
    I think it does make some difference, even if it's a small one. Drop 2 or 3 kids by 50 points and it could potentially drop your recruiting class similarly, say from top 100 nationally to 150. Bracketology and top 25 rankings drop accordingly. Could be what preseason would be considered a bubble team to nowhere close. So instead of spending your season fighting your way into the top 25, you spend your season fighting your way into the bubble. And yes, I absolutely believe the selection committee watches that stuff.

    Leave a comment:


  • AZ Shocker
    replied
    Originally posted by pie n eye View Post

    Once we sign him what difference does it make? His ranking dropping or improving has zero effect on how he will play next year or over his career.
    100%!!! But sometimes I wonder if the drop in rank affects the ego and maybe even the confidence of the player their first year at college. But way more importantly however is how other recruits view that drop in ranking if they even pay any attention to that (which I bet they do). In other words...if other Top-150 kids see how that works...do they have second thoughts in signing with the Shocks as opposed to signing at another school that doesn't get that drop in player ranking??? I wonder.....

    Leave a comment:


  • pie n eye
    replied
    Originally posted by TheShocktocles View Post

    And another example of bias is for WSU to sign a consensus top 150 player like Kenny Pohto and have him magically drop 50 spots without no explanation. Really? You can't tell me if KP had followed Pitino to New Mexico he would have dropped 50 spots in the rankings. Or if he would have signed with Utah,Ohio State , or SMU he would have dropped.

    There is some bias against Wichita State in national media and if people can't see it then they are just blind. Go Shocks.
    Once we sign him what difference does it make? His ranking dropping or improving has zero effect on how he will play next year or over his career.

    Leave a comment:


  • pie n eye
    replied
    Originally posted by Dan View Post
    the shockers are annually in the top of the conference and almost annually in the tourney, yet we have to prove it over the course of the season year after year. Meanwhile, teams like Memphis get the benefit of doubt just because they sign a few 5 star kids that aren't ready and have a coach that hasn't really done anything. Makes perfect sense.
    I don’t see how Memphis has gotten any benefit of the doubt considering they haven’t made the tourney since at least before we joined the conference. I’ll take being in the March bracketology over the June bracketology any day.

    Leave a comment:


  • Fairgame
    replied
    Originally posted by TheShocktocles View Post
    The new June update for bracketology is out. Wichita State is no where to be found. Yeah we think highly of the shockers and the recruiting by Coach Brown, but nobody else does. The shocker basketball players and fans will just have to accept its low status. Shocker basketball is just not what it use to be. Having back to back to back losing seasons can ruin a program. Our program is collapsing and the national media experts are in agreement.
    Could I talk you into explaining what in the hell you are talking about?

    Leave a comment:


  • MikeKennedyRulZ
    replied
    I actually don't mind this. I'd rather fly under the radar. We know who this team is and what they are capable of. Let the others make their noise...

    Leave a comment:


  • TheShocktocles
    replied
    Originally posted by Dan View Post
    the shockers are annually in the top of the conference and almost annually in the tourney, yet we have to prove it over the course of the season year after year. Meanwhile, teams like Memphis get the benefit of doubt just because they sign a few 5 star kids that aren't ready and have a coach that hasn't really done anything. Makes perfect sense.
    And another example of bias is for WSU to sign a consensus top 150 player like Kenny Pohto and have him magically drop 50 spots without no explanation. Really? You can't tell me if KP had followed Pitino to New Mexico he would have dropped 50 spots in the rankings. Or if he would have signed with Utah,Ohio State , or SMU he would have dropped.

    There is some bias against Wichita State in national media and if people can't see it then they are just blind. Go Shocks.

    Leave a comment:


  • Dan
    replied
    the shockers are annually in the top of the conference and almost annually in the tourney, yet we have to prove it over the course of the season year after year. Meanwhile, teams like Memphis get the benefit of doubt just because they sign a few 5 star kids that aren't ready and have a coach that hasn't really done anything. Makes perfect sense.

    Leave a comment:

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