Announcement

**BOBB** · December 23, 2018, 11:29 AM

Originally posted by ShockRef View Post

ES had a really bad game but ease up on him. He is pushing and pushing hard to fill-in the role for both DD and him. Give him some time - he will be fine.

Surprised no one on here commented about the start of the second half when VCU ripped off 12 straight points until HCGM FINALLY called a time out.
Game. Set. Match.

Every other coach in college basketball would have snapped after 3 straight baskets and tackled an official for a time out. HCGM remained stubborn and let the tidal wave roll on until it was 49-34 and then decide he had seen enough.
That is just stubborn bullshit.

Fred and Ron are gone and not coming back. Start coaching this team as though they are a bunch of inexperienced freshmen and not seasoned NBA caliber players.

That is all.

I am sick of agreeing with you. Is HCGM taking the same approach he took with the Murry, Kyles, Stutz crew? That is what we need here. Maybe simplify the playbook a bit, or a lot. Focus on execution. Take opportunities to teach during the game, not just explode. These guys aren't just going to put on the Shocker jersey and "get it." He needs to make them get it.

Fans aren't the only ones that got spoiled with Fred and Ron around. Coach needs to get to work. He is clearly capable of molding this team and I believe most of our players are capable of being molded. HCGM just needs to accept his role. We were probably going to lose yesterday regardless, but going from a lead to a blow out requires some coaching mistakes.

Also, I think ES is going to be a good player, just not a knock down shooter. I'd settle for made layups from him just fine right now.

**Veritas** · December 23, 2018, 11:45 AM

Originally posted by ShockingButTrue View Post

This Fr. class doesn't appear to be as good as Turg's Frosh class of Burn, Kampamn, Howard and Miller (Redshirt). That class never advanced beyond and NIT.

For what it's worth...

Marshall is a better coach than Turgeon.

Shox didn’t play well due to 3 combinations. Foul trouble, missing shots and JE’s injury. A three legged stool without a leg to stand on.

Disappointing game.

**TheShocktocles** · December 23, 2018, 12:22 PM

It ain't even close. There is no comparison between Marshall and Turgeon. Marshall is a way better coach and communicates better to our fan base. Heck he even is a great ambassador to my belove city of Wichita.I also think this fpreshman class is better than Burns etc.

But these guys do need better coaching. I know Coach doesnt like to call timeouts but he might have to adjust a little with this group. We not only have a bunch of freshmen but several guys playing Division 1 for the first time. We all knew this was going to be a struggle this year. My biggest gripe is the mental mistakes and missed open shots. I do see them playing harder and that's good. Go shocks.

**another shocker** · December 23, 2018, 01:20 PM

the shockers played well in the first half, i thought. the echenique injury was a huge blow to the team (how long will he be sidelined).. he was getting after it.

one of these days, when we least expect it, the shockers will put together two strong halves. i just hope that they can get and stay healthy from here on out.

**C0|dB|00ded** · December 23, 2018, 01:53 PM

Originally posted by BOBB View Post

I am sick of agreeing with you. Is HCGM taking the same approach he took with the Murry, Kyles, Stutz crew? That is what we need here. Maybe simplify the playbook a bit, or a lot. Focus on execution. Take opportunities to teach during the game, not just explode. These guys aren't just going to put on the Shocker jersey and "get it." He needs to make them get it.

Fans aren't the only ones that got spoiled with Fred and Ron around. Coach needs to get to work. He is clearly capable of molding this team and I believe most of our players are capable of being molded. HCGM just needs to accept his role. We were probably going to lose yesterday regardless, but going from a lead to a blow out requires some coaching mistakes.

Also, I think ES is going to be a good player, just not a knock down shooter. I'd settle for made layups from him just fine right now.

"...but going from a lead to a blow out requires some coaching mistakes."

Or losing the best big man you've had in 35 years. We had the game under control until Jaime went down. Vegas odds would have been 50/50 at that point in the game at worst.

Losing JE allowed the opposition to stop doubling down low. That was checkmate for our already suspect guard situation. For Christ's sakes we were having walkons bring the ball up the floor in VCU's barn...

T

...:cool:

**shelback** · December 23, 2018, 01:57 PM

Originally posted by ShockingButTrue View Post

This Fr. class doesn't appear to be as good as Turg's Frosh class of Burn, Kampamn, Howard and Miller (Redshirt). That class never advanced beyond and NIT.

For what it's worth...

This class will blow that class away. Freshman have never really thrived in coach Marshall's complicated system and he brought in a big class. Don't underestimate there is about 300 D1 schools with more experience than the SHOX. People forget Baker, Brown, Sham, and Shaq all had redshirt years. I also remember a class with 3 future NBA players AC, CL, and OJ that was a one and done NIT team.

**Shox The Revenant** · December 23, 2018, 02:06 PM

Santa gave me a lump of coal with JE's injury. We weren't going to make noise this season, but it's still an opportunity for the young ones to develop. JE was on the verge of blowing up, every game he was exhibiting glimpses of being first team all AAC and now he'll probably be out for the year. You can't easily replace a man who was shooting 61%/54% from the field and led the team in blocks. I'm even more pissed when I realize he's a junior and we have him only for one more year.

**ShockTalk** · December 23, 2018, 02:44 PM

Originally posted by ShockingButTrue View Post

This Fr. class doesn't appear to be as good as Turg's Frosh class of Burn, Kampamn, Howard and Miller (Redshirt). That class never advanced beyond and NIT.

For what it's worth...

Let's remember that Burns, Kampman, and Howard had Srs Benton, Mack, and McFall, Jr Steven, and So Clark to learn from. McFall being a senior PG was a big help. All 3 of the seniors averaged double digits in scoring just behind Burns and Howard. That team finish .500 in the non-con and conference and went 1-8 in conference away games.

**SB Shock** · December 23, 2018, 02:53 PM

Originally posted by shelback View Post

Don't underestimate there is about 300 D1 schools with more experience than the SHOX.

according to Kenpom (as of yesterday), WSU was ranked 280 out 353 in EXPERIENCE.

The teams ranked below WSU in experience here is their kenpom ratings

Top 50: 10
51-100: 11
100-150: 6
151-200: 8
250+: 38

Plenty of teams finding away to get it done despite their youth.

**RamJam** · December 23, 2018, 03:49 PM

Hey guys, VCU fan here. Never done the "post on another team's message board before" (no hard feelings if you hate me doing so), but reading through this thread and I couldn't help but chuckle as it read almost identical to one of our own. Not gleeful at ya'll's misery, just thought it was funny the common refrains on a message board after a loss. I know it's easy for me to say considering the result yesterday but I always love playing the Shockers and am happy we've got this series going again. Best of luck in the American this season.

**JVShocker** · December 23, 2018, 04:03 PM

Originally posted by RamJam View Post

Hey guys, VCU fan here. Never done the "post on another team's message board before" (no hard feelings if you hate me doing so), but reading through this thread and I couldn't help but chuckle as it read almost identical to one of our own. Not gleeful at ya'll's misery, just thought it was funny the common refrains on a message board after a loss. I know it's easy for me to say considering the result yesterday but I always love playing the Shockers and am happy we've got this series going again. Best of luck in the American this season.

This is just ONE of at least FIVE threads that you could sit back, read, laugh and enjoy. If fans didn't come here to ***** about the game, we'd all drink ourselves silly. Though some do a little of both, I think. :poster_shocks:

**Stickboy46** · December 23, 2018, 05:52 PM

Originally posted by SB Shock View Post

according to Kenpom (as of yesterday), WSU was ranked 280 out 353 in EXPERIENCE.

The teams ranked below WSU in experience here is their kenpom ratings

Top 50: 10
51-100: 11
100-150: 6
151-200: 8
250+: 38

Plenty of teams finding away to get it done despite their youth.

There are FOUR teams with less returning minutes. Most of our "experience" is coming up from the walk ons and people that didn't and still don't play (AM, RB)

**shoxlax** · December 23, 2018, 05:56 PM

- Customizable College Basketball Tempo Free Stats - T-Rank

http://www.barttorvik.com/returningmins.php

T-Rank College Basketball Ratings and Rankings. And fun.

Again I post this. Really the only stats that matter

**SB Shock** · December 23, 2018, 08:12 PM

Originally posted by shoxlax View Post

http://www.barttorvik.com/returningmins.php

Again I post this. Really the only stats that matter

Never heard of the site before. I stick with Kenpom. The only stat that really matters is W-L

**pinstripers** · December 23, 2018, 08:52 PM

Taylor Eldridge‏@tayloreldridge 33m33 minutes ago

Something to keep in mind: Only 5 freshman (JT Durley, Toure' Murry, Fred VanVleet, Markis McDuffie & Landry Shamet) have played more than 35% of minutes in Gregg Marshall's first 11 seasons at WSU. There will be 4 alone on this year's team that will exceed that mark.

Announcement

Wichita State vs VCU Game Thread

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment