Any Trump fans getting tired...

[C0|dB|00ded]

Cops don’t become cops for it to be an even playing field. Who would want to be a cop if the the perp is given the same allowances and provisions that they receive? Now of course with that as an officer comes with it a lot of responsibility. But the police and civilians aren’t equals. And that lack of understanding and perhaps jealousy of power is what gets people into trouble. Why be a cop if you’re out at an even graver danger than you already are and are at the mercy of a suspect that has unpredictable capabilities? If everybody listens to commands, do what they’re told, OR DONT BREAK THE LAW IN THE FIRST PLACE, like magic, you will never have to deal with law enforcement.

I'm a big defender of police in the context of a political argument with an anarchist, but overall, police are below civilians... that's why they are called public servants. They're not paid much, and they're not really that bright either as a general rule. Their job is to capture suspects, issue citations, and protect the vulnerable. The psychological profile of many officers is not dissimilar to violent felons. With that in mind, it is certainly in one's best interest to obey any law officer that confronts them and follow their commands. However, never should a civilian feel threatened by a law officer with respect to life or death unless they are actively threatening said officer. When some kid or drunk gets shot and killed because they scratched their nose or pulled their pants up... something is wrong.

The following video is one of the worst examples of police brutality I have ever seen.

[ShockTalk]

Do police even carry batons anymore? I haven’t seen them in years. Sure they haven’t phased them out because they were too “inhumane” of a weapon?

At any rate, what if the suspect makes a sudden erratic charge at the officers, blade pointed forward? Are you willing to take a chance on your Jackie Chan baton skills to disengage the weapon before he makes contact? That’s a very quick evolving decision to have to make and trust... for what? To appease a hostile movement? Do you think if the officer got knifed and died that it even would’ve made the news?

My understanding is that they carry guns as well. I do believe that is a threat on their life or others. Shot in the front or bodycam to show life threat to another person or officer. I believe you call that shooting a "nothing burger".

[Kung Wu]

The videos are helping to clarify in my mind why unarmed people (including but not limited to black people) get shot: They are dangerously non compliant and putting themselves in a situation where they CAN become armed quickly when they are shot.

There is an old horrific video of a rookie police officer dealing with a white defiant scumbag who starts taunting the cop, turns around runs to his truck, grabs a semi-auto rifle and proceeds to execute the young cop.

Once you see that, you lose all care about guys like the a-hole in the video that is trying to get into his car while being completely non compliant. That guy is dangerous as all get out if he is allowed to get in that car.

[C0|dB|00ded]

So people liked how Rodney King went down? Did that make the 6:00 news?

You think a baton vs. a knife is a fair fight? I don’t get it. Why does the law-breaking nutjob who’s ignoring all commands get the benefit of the doubt?

I mean if that’s the case, then what is even the purpose of law enforcement? If you can’t enforce it and are at the the mercy of the opposition, then wtf is the point?

Rodney King was different. They beat him for sport.

I'm not giving the perp the benefit of the doubt, I'm just not happy with his execution in the absence of a real mortal threat to the officers.

[Kung Wu]

Since the defense for the protesting violence is based on a ratio, why don't the police just start shooting a bunch more white people and Asians?

[ShockerFever]

Cops don’t become cops for it to be an even playing field. Who would want to be a cop if the the perp is given the same allowances and provisions that they receive? Now of course with that as an officer comes with it a lot of responsibility. But the police and civilians aren’t equals. And that lack of understanding and perhaps jealousy of power is what gets people into trouble. Why be a cop if you’re out at an even graver danger than you already are and are at the mercy of a suspect that has unpredictable capabilities? If everybody listens to commands, do what they’re told, OR DONT BREAK THE LAW IN THE FIRST PLACE, like magic, you will never have to deal with law enforcement.

[ShockerFever]

Do police even carry batons anymore? I haven’t seen them in years. Sure they haven’t phased them out because they were too “inhumane” of a weapon?

At any rate, what if the suspect makes a sudden erratic charge at the officers, blade pointed forward? Are you willing to take a chance on your Jackie Chan baton skills to disengage the weapon before he makes contact? That’s a very quick evolving decision to have to make and trust... for what? To appease a hostile movement? Do you think if the officer got knifed and died that it even would’ve made the news?

[WstateU]

[ShockTalk]

So people liked how Rodney King went down? Did that make the 6:00 news?

You think a baton vs. a knife is a fair fight? I don’t get it. Why does the law-breaking nutjob who’s ignoring all commands get the benefit of the doubt?

I mean if that’s the case, then what is even the purpose of law enforcement? If you can’t enforce it and are at the the mercy of the opposition, then wtf is the point?

Those expandable batons are pretty damn effective and I'm assuming the police have been trained on how to use one that way. Yeah, I think 2 cops with those batons could take down someone with a knife. There was a group of police following him for 1/2 mile.

[ShockTalk]

The problem with the BLM movement (and I think someone already alluded to this) is they feel the perp has a right to make the first move (take the first shot) and police should only be reactionary. That’s a complete irrational line of thinking and I would only ask that movement to put themselves in the reversed situation and see how they handled it.

As with the Wisconsin incident, how do we know the suspect wasn’t going to his car to retrieve his weapon? I just find it impossible for a police officer to shoot a guy for just going to sit in his car and have a smoke or because he’s just black. And once again, the hip thing to do is react on Twitter without any evidence presented for their actions, jump to conclusions, and then riot and destroy neighborhoods because of a few guys’ potentially dumb actions.

This society is essentially hot garbage just waiting for an excuse to cause chaos and “do whatever the **** we want”.

Fev, I totally agree with your first paragraph. So much so, that I believe the police should be "proactive" and that does not mean just shoot.

As for Wisconsin, he out-walked 3 police (2 around the front and one from around the back) and managed to get the door open before any of them got to him. Then 2 could not pull him away from the door, so they shot him several times in the back.

As to your reply to Cold (didn't read his post), I'm more concerned with what the police did from the time they confronted him at the first gas mart and over the next almost 1/2 mile of following him before he ever set foot on the drive of the 2nd gas mart. It was already stated that he threatened people at the first location. Your second paragraph on this post I also totally agree with, but as we are seeing, that just isn't always the case. My understanding is that the police are trained more than just on the firing range.

[ShockerFever]

With that many LEO's, all their taser's aren't going to "fail". All you need is one set of prongs to make contact. If that doesn't work get your baton out and beat the living **** out of him. That's how the Brits do it. An army of LEO's shooting a black dude pulling open a door is just bad optics is all I'm saying. And sometimes bad optics leads to a national revolution. Nobody likes watching a dude get gunned down. Shock or beat the **** out of him and it won't even make the 6 o'clock news.

P.S. Had George Floyd been tased he'd have likely gone into cardiac arrest considering his physical condition and fentanyl toxicity at the time.

P.P.S. Comply don't die.

So people liked how Rodney King went down? Did that make the 6:00 news?

You think a baton vs. a knife is a fair fight? I don’t get it. Why does the law-breaking nutjob who’s ignoring all commands get the benefit of the doubt?

I mean if that’s the case, then what is even the purpose of law enforcement? If you can’t enforce it and are at the the mercy of the opposition, then wtf is the point?

[ShockTalk]

Twice in the video. What do you think they should have done besides shooting him in the leg?

Are you saying that those cops in Louisiana are responsible for people breaking the law in Wisconsin????? If that is what you are insinuating, we disagree greatly.

In the case in Lafayette, the use of tasers was ineffective as it likely didn’t pierce the skin at two points. That is unfortunate.

Just using aftermath videos from both incidents where both situations most likely had better tactics than could have been used and not give the rabble an excuse or where they will look bad if they do something uncalled for. I'm not trained in police tactics, particularly in those that could be used in situations where there was either time and/or opportunity to use non-lethal means. That's their job, not mine. However, if I had that kind of mindset where I could kill someone, I do suppose even I could have executed what the police did in these two situations. Again, in the one case, the police confronted him at another gas mart almost a 1/2 mile away then followed him to the next. My own guess is that there were ample time and situations to stop him without using lethal force. In the second, an unarmed man basically out walked 2 police from one side of the car to the other and got the door open while the 3rd cop at the back of the car was not even in the picture yet coming around the backside. I'm going to assume he did or they thought he did have a weapon in the car. If not, totally out of line.

There are most definitely times when lethal force is the only option from a time and/or situation. With what all is going on right now, there are also situations where the police can be viewed as throwing another match on the fire. I DO NOT want any police or bystander to get seriously hurt or killed. In such situations, lethal force should be used. For me, I cannot make that determination in these two situations (given what little I think I know).

[MikeKennedyRulZ]

Btw, did you even read those studies? lol!



That was the first one. And yes, some folks are going to go into cardic arrest when tased extensively. Tough titties. A lot better mortality rate than bleeding to death after firing squad (that was a joke).

The second article was discussing mental disability and drug consumption when tased. Alcohol had no effect on number of times needing tased while mental disability did. Stimulants also resulted in more shocks. That doesn't mean the device failed. You can shock them as long as you want. That being said, I think increased voltages should be discussed. If you don't comply with officers, you should absolutely be looking at facing pain in your near future. Not necessarily death though.

I did. And there conclusions both supported that people on drugs and/or with mental issues can withstand shocks longer and that the effects of a tase on them might not work. What is your point? You said yourseld that it might take increased voltage. I am not sure what you are arguing for or against, but that is normal for you (speaking of mental issues).

[C0|dB|00ded]

And under your rules, when the taser fails, let the guy walk into a convenience store, take a bunch of hostages at knife point and roll the good ol dice. Clearly a better option.

How about instead you do what the eff you’re told by law enforcement? If that happens, nobody dies. Period. And better yet, don’t break the law in the first place and you won’t even have to sniff the bacon.

With that many LEO's, all their taser's aren't going to "fail". All you need is one set of prongs to make contact. If that doesn't work get your baton out and beat the living **** out of him. That's how the Brits do it. An army of LEO's shooting a black dude pulling open a door is just bad optics is all I'm saying. And sometimes bad optics leads to a national revolution. Nobody likes watching a dude get gunned down. Shock or beat the **** out of him and it won't even make the 6 o'clock news.

P.S. Had George Floyd been tased he'd have likely gone into cardiac arrest considering his physical condition and fentanyl toxicity at the time.

P.P.S. Comply don't die.

[C0|dB|00ded]

At least two studies disagree:

https://www.sciencedirect.com/scienc...35109706014513

http://jaapl.org/content/44/2/213

A person on drugs who is either hallucinating or having dulled sensory perceptions can absolutely "ignore" a tase or withstand it for a longer period of time, rendering it ineffective in a critical situation where time is of the essence.

Btw, did you even read those studies? lol!

Effects of Cocaine Intoxication on the Threshold for Stun Gun Induction of Ventricular Fibrillation

That was the first one. And yes, some folks are going to go into cardic arrest when tased extensively. Tough titties. A lot better mortality rate than bleeding to death after firing squad (that was a joke).

The second article was discussing mental disability and drug consumption when tased. Alcohol had no effect on number of times needing tased while mental disability did. Stimulants also resulted in more shocks. That doesn't mean the device failed. You can shock them as long as you want. That being said, I think increased voltages should be discussed. If you don't comply with officers, you should absolutely be looking at facing pain in your near future. Not necessarily death though.